Or we could do it as follows:
If a tiebreaker is needed because both players won as Austria, then the player controlling France wins if the tiebreaker ends in a draw.
If a tiebreaker is needed because both players won as France, then the player controlling Austria wins if the tiebreaker ends in a draw.

@ Mercy: I like the idea. Simple and efficient.

That tie-breaker could lead to distorted games where one player intentionally keeps the game going to accomplish the secondary goal of taking over the other persons home supply centers.

@ Jeff: I assume you refer to my proposal, not to Mercy's one.
I disagree. I suggested that we count the *maximum* of centers the losing player had. So if he has 15 centers and drops to 10, it is 15 that will be taken into account.

@CptMike: I like your idea of maximum SCs for losing side.

@Mercy: My above comment was directed toward your proposal.

How is that a secondary goal? Am I missing something?

Yeah Jeff I don't see how your comment makes sense for Mercy's proposal. The SC count idea has a lot of flaws

Like, if you win your Austria game and France had 15 SC's, your goal is no longer to win the game. It's to get 15 SC's, so you'd give an inordinate amount of priority to securing all the English SC's

*16

@ goldfinger : correct. But both games should be simultaneous... You could state the same currently. If you have won the 1st game, then your goal is not to win but to draw...

From my experiences in the tournaments, the two games never progress evenly, and many players prefer to play consecutively

And correct, but drawing means holding the line, whereas SC count could mean abandoning it. One follows the spirit of the game more than the other

There may be a misunderstanding in my proposal but count would not mean "abandoning" anything. If you don't hold the line you get +1 center but you also lose -1 so your total stay the same. And the -1 for you means the +1 for your adversary, leading to your defeat. But I agree with you that if games are not simultaneous, a player who against a adversary with +13 may decide to rush on the +14 just to win the tie...

The advantage remains that instead of have a playoff based on 1 game (and we all have seen that Jeff Kuta is not happy to have played France) it can be done in 2 games.

To avoid the disadvantage we would just allow players in the game having n years of advance to wait for a few years the other game reach the same year...

I may have missed a point that I think we have :

Pool 1 :
* michaelf77
* xorxes
* bozotheclown
* goldfinger0303
* cspieker
* IceKingCold
* CptMike
* captainmeme

Pool 2 :
* josemurc
* stranger
* Nealkochhar
* rdrivera2005
* dagabs0
* SplitDiplomat
* Flumonator
* genghiz

Is this right ?

Now that I re-read Mercy's proposal, I like it quite a bit. I didn't quite understand what he meant, but I see it now.

My complaints about France have nothing to do with my personal situation in the tournament but rather with the fairly extensive look I have taken into FvA based on the 16 names listed above. Wins with France may have been the deciding factor, but the base of your strength (you as in everyone) is consistent wins with Austria.

And good luck to those who have advanced. I will be watching you!!

@ Jeff Kuta: I apologize. I didn't mean that you would have complained about your situation. And you underlined the difference between F and A *before*.

@CptMike - I was thinking of the (not too uncommon) scenario where you have to retake StP (as France) to prevent a solo and get the draw. In any situation where France isn't 100% guaranteed to retake StP, the player will be incentivized to convoy an army over to England and grab Liv and Edi to get 16 rather than take a dice roll chance at reclaiming StP.

That and any tournament with that level of micromanaging rules as you proposed at the end just isn't feasible

I thought it's going to be winners vs runner-ups, how am I matched against bozotheclown ?

That was not the final draw, just the default draw when I started the next round. I tried to edit it on my phone but was unable to, so it had to wait until I got back from holiday today. The second round draw, drawn via random.org again, is as follows:

cspieker (Winner Group E) vs stranger (Runner up Group B)
captainmeme (Winner Group H) vs SplitDiplomat (Runner up Group F)
michaelf77 (Winner Group A) vs dagabs0 (Runner up Group E)
xorxes (Winner Group B) vs rdrivera2005 (Runner up Group D)
IceKingCold (Winner Group F) vs genghiz (Runner up Group H)
CptMike (Winner Group G) vs Nealkochhar (Runner up Group C)
bozotheclown (Winner Group C) vs Fluminator (Runner up Group G)
goldfinger0303 (Winner Group D) vs josemurc (Runner up Group A)

For some statistical analysis of the group stages:

75% of first seeds (6/8) advanced to round two.
50% of second seeds (4/8) advanced to round two.
37.5% of third seeds (3/8) advanced to round two.
37.5% of fourth seeds (3/8) advanced to round two.

Groups B & C were the only groups from which both the top two seeds advanced to round two.

Group H was the only group in which the top seed came last, and the only group where the top seed was eliminated without losing a tiebreaker.

Four players of the original thirty two were eliminated without scoring a single point. Only one player (bozotheclown) scored the maximum 18 points in the first round.

Groups A and F were the only groups to go to tiebreakers, with Group F the only group going to a three way tiebreaker.

I shall send PM's out during the day today to start the next round. Commiserations to those who were eliminated. Congratulations to all who qualified, and good luck in the knockout stages!

Oh crap

PM's are all sent out. If anyone needs any countries rearranging, just let me know.

Question: the rules imply that there would be 2 legs for knockout stage ( Knockout Stage: If the two legs do not produce a clear winner ... ) does that mean we'll play 4 games ?

"In the knockout stage, you will once more play two games against your opponent (one as France, one as Austria)."

"If the two legs do not produce a clear winner (either 2-1 or 1-0), then a first tiebreaker game. If this game is also drawn, then a fourth game will be played - and only then will Austria advance in the case of a tie."

You have to play one tiebreaker game, and only if that game is a draw you play a fourth game.

I think the "two legs" are meant to be the two games, one as Austria and one as France. Where it says "2-1" it should probably say "2-0".

Spring 2017 1v1 Champions League
FvA Counts

Only games played by those who advanced to the elimination round of 16 were analyzed.

I delayed posting this until after all games in R16 had advanced past 1901 builds.

Counts may not add up to 40 because games are in progress.

TK = "yet to come"

Games analyzed: 40

RESULT
Austria win: 15
France win: 8
Draw: 5
In progress: 12

FRANCE OPENINGS (Wins)
ENG, Bur, Pic: 30 (A10, D5, F6, TK8)
ENG, Bur, Pie: 4 (F1, TK3
MAO, Bur, Pic: 1 (F1)
MAO, Bur, Pie: 5 (A4, TK1)

AUSTRIA OPENINGS (Wins)
ALB, Boh, Gal: 1 (D1)
ALB, Gal, Tyr: 20 (A6, D1, F5, TK8)
ALB, Rum, Tyr: 3 (D1, TK2)
ALB, Tri, Tyr: 1 (F1)
VEN, Gal, Tyr: 15 (A9, D2, F2, TK2)

FRANCE BUILDS (Wins)
A-Mar, A-Par: 18 (A8, D2, F3, TK5)
F-Bre, A-Mar: 17 (A4, D3, F3, TK7)
F-Bre, A-Par: 3 (A3)
F-Mar, A-Par: 2 (F2)

AUSTRIA BUILDS (Wins)
A-Bud, A-Tri: 1 (TK1)
A-Bud, A-Tri, A-Vie: 2 (A1, TK1)
A-Bud, A-Tri: 8 (A3, D2, F3, TK2)
A-Bud, F-Tri, A-Vie: 1 (A1)
A-Tri, A-Vie: 21 (A6, D2, F5, TK8)
F-Tri, A-Vie: 5 (A4, D1)

NOTES
* France does not do well opening to MAO (4 loss, 1 win).
* Austria does well when building a fleet (4 wins, 1 draw).

We will see more blitz games where Austria is victorious in 1904 by capturing Norway, St Petersburg, and all of Italy, while ceding both Munich, Berlin and Tunis. This is what France players must figure out how to counter. 1902 fleet to Norway instead of Denmark may be the best solution. Longer less risky strategy for Austria includes using 2 fleets to lock down Italy and parts east.

Sorry, can you explain what the letters and numbers after the openings stand for?

And these are elimination round games? Or the round-robin

X#
X: Austria, Draw, France, TK
#: # of wins