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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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KansasBoyd (25 D X)
29 Aug 17 UTC
University Professor fired over tweet
A University of Tampa Sociology professor was fired after tweeting Hurricane Harvey was karma for Texas for voting for Trump.

17 replies
Open
acamer4 (1022 D)
07 Sep 17 UTC
oh no!
now that it's about to be canceled is it safe to post gameID=204936 on the forum and speculate wildly about who was cheating??
5 replies
Open
The Ambassador (159 D)
06 Sep 17 UTC
Latest podcast episode: interview with Captainmeme
Hi webDippers

In the latest podcast episode of DiplomacyGames we interview Captainmeme, talk about how to create a Dip variant and introduce a new segment: Pet Peeves, which I'll post separately on.
8 replies
Open
jengamaster (2119 D)
07 Sep 17 UTC
Biggest game of all time?
Would it be appropriate/allowable to have commentary on the biggest game of all time? I ask because it is an anon gunboat game. But it seems like the type of game people could learn from like school of war.
5 replies
Open
jengamaster (2119 D)
07 Sep 17 UTC
(+1)
Three build Turkey or Four Build Russia in 01
Have you ever seen this rare beast in a game that was not marred by NMR? If so, how did it come to pass? And how well did that country do in the long run?
5 replies
Open
peterwiggin (15247 D Mod (S))
06 Sep 17 UTC
(+3)
Mod team personnel announcement
Socrates Dissatisfied has decided to step down from the moderator team. Please join me in thanking him for his service.

Szpoti has agreed to join the mod team. Please join me in thanking him for his dedication to the site and willingness to volunteer.
22 replies
Open
captainmeme (1126 D Mod)
06 Sep 17 UTC
(+3)
Diplomacy PSA
https://gfycat.com/ShimmeringUnsteadyHamadryas
3 replies
Open
Oztra (30 D X)
03 Sep 17 UTC
San Francisco reccomendations
I'll be going to the US western seaboard in the next few weeks and am looking to do a fair amount of sightseeing while there. Anyone have recommendations for can't miss sights/experiences? (let the sarcasm...and hopefully 1 or 2 useful suggestions...abound)
legit tho
26 replies
Open
Shenguin (268 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
(+2)
Ghost Ratings and CD Takeovers
Do the Ghost Ratings include games where the player takes over a CD? If a player regularly takes over CDs in a more or less hopeless position does it effectively screw up the player's ghost rating?

And, finally, why do I keep taking over hopeless CDs and should I seek professional help?
16 replies
Open
spacecadet (329 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
the odd man out - strategy question
so i got a strategy question for everyone:
the way i see it, 80% of games take the same route:
there is one odd man out which is attacked by the 2 others.
spacecadet (329 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
this happens in both the west and east triangles (A,R,T and E,G,F)
after these two are eliminated the remaining 5 cut 2 more players out of the draw.
by the time this is done either one player is in the position to solo and tries, or the game ends in a 3 way.
my question is this: how do you prevent yourself from being the odd man out in the first triangles? lets say you play as austria, how do you prevent a juggernaut.
lots of it, i think, depends on what strategy the other two like best as opposed to any communications. since communications are not very deep in the first two turns.
but on the other hand, it seems that very experienced players usually come out on top in this early stage and at the very least survive to be one of the last 5 players, but how?
your thoughts are appreciated
Deeply_Dippy (388 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
(+1)
Fair question, spacecadet.

As for the answer, the clue is in the game's title: Diplomacy.

Players form alliances FOR lots of reasons but always BY communicating.

This is true for all variants, perhaps except for Gunboat.

Deliberate alliance play is extremely difficult and rare in GB games but it is possible. It requires either prior relationship (itself founded on communication) or a good deal of guesswork and anticipation.
spacecadet (329 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
didnt answer my question whatsoever.
telling me the answer is in the title is not helpful.
and i didnt ask about gunboat.
lets take a practical example:
how do you stop a juggernaut as austria? what are the pressure points you use?
i, for example, either aim for turkey as an ally by playing on black sea paranoia or get italy to talk to russia about a full blown attack on turkey from all sides.
what are the pressure points you use in order to make sure you are not the odd man out?
A_Tin_Can (2249 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
(+3)
The biggest and most common mistake I see among otherwise good players is players not giving *good* reasons behind a pitch. For example, both of these are bad:

From England to France: "Everyone else's press is terrible, so I really want to work with you. Would you support me to Belgium?"

From Germany to France: "Hey, if you support yourself there, you can stop England getting Belgium, and then he'll only have one build and you'll have two."

Both of these are bad. I would probably not ally with either of those players.

Here are some good examples:

From England to France: "Would you support me to Belgium? It's better for me to have it, because if I take it with the fleet then I can't attack you, but we can attack Germany together. Also, if you support me there, then you can use your other unit to swing at Munich"

From Germany to France: "Hey, if you support yourself to Belgium, we can stop England taking it. With Russia going against Turkey, he's unlikely to be able to reinforce Norway for a few turns. So, if we keep England on the back foot, I'll be able to take Norway and Sweden, and you'll be able to take England."

These are good because they give good reasons why I would want to do the thing (beyond "because I like this player" or "because I get centres"). And they show that the player is thinking about the long term.

I will *always* choose the ally who is creating something for themselves to do that is not attack me. Alliances aren't necessarily about taking centres (although it obviously helps)- they're about constructing something that will benefit both of your positions.

This is how you hold alliances together longer term, too - an Austria/Russia alliance's goal isn't "kill Turkey", it's "give the other player something to do that isn't attack me" . To start with, that might be "kill Turkey", but as Turkey is dying, the alliance should be continuing to find other things to do together. It's a mistake to wait until you've squeezed someone out to decide what to do next.

----

Of course, there can be a bunch of rookie press mistakes too, like:

1) not writing enough text:

Russia to England: <Long, detailed message about working together>
England to Russia: "Sounds good."

2) Being overly paranoid:

Germany to France: "There's no way I will ever accept you having a unit in Burgundy, and I want you to only build fleets"

3) Being overly aggressive or grabby:

Austria to Russia: "I'm sorry man, but the only way I am prepared to work with you is if I get Bulgaria"

4) Being overly agreeable:

France to Germany: "Sure man, I'm happy to DMZ Burgundy. I mean, I've already agreed not to go to the channel, and Italy wants to DMZ Piedmont. I'm all peace over here."

5) Not considering that the other player might want something too:

Turkey to Russia: "Hi, let's work together. Why don't I pop your fleet in Rumania with Austria's help, and then you can help me into Budapest."

(What does Russia get out of that?)
A_Tin_Can (2249 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
(+2)
You stop a juggernaut by taking away Scandinavia. It can't survive without northern fleets.
MajorMitchell (1033 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
Good question space cadet, & ATC gives very good advice, imho. You asked about Austria, OK what does Russia want at the start of a classic game..to get a build from Rumania, because Germany can bounce him in Sweden. What works for both Austria and Russia ? Agreeing to a DMZ in Galicia. What should Austria insist upon from Russia ? You can have Rumania, but please use fleet Sevastapol to capture and hold it, not an army.. Hint to offer Austria if you have Russia. And you have to suggest a strategy that is a win / win for both of you..eg attack Turkey, share the sc's evenly. I suppose that's good advice generally.. Offer a "strategy vision" that benefits the player you are "wooing" as well as benefitting you. If the "strategy vision" only benefits you, it's not that attractive to the other player.. If it only benefits him, he is likely to be distrustful.. Too good to be true, so it's false is how the other will likely see it, and it's also a dumb strategy..
Aligning common interests "sells" alliance propositions. This can be.. We'll both benefit from doing x... Or it can be creating a perceived "common enemy".. Eg..Germany tells Russia.. Our common enemy is England, so I won't bounce you in sweden, or Germany tells that to France or France tells that to Germany. Classically England survives, does well by preventing any alliance forming against himself.. Anyway the " dab hands at the Diplomacy caper " like ATC can explain this better than I can. But good on you for pondering upon this stuff & asking for advice.
Don't over promise.
As another way to learn stuff, if you see an elite player, you can click on that player's name & go to their "home page" scroll down to their completed games, there'll be pages of them, find the games where they had solo wins, open the game, go to bottom left hand corner, see Archives & click on maps.. You'll be able to scroll down to the Spring 01 map, then slowly work up, seeing all the moves step by step...I've found this most useful.. If it was full press, you can read through Archived messages, but I've never bothered to put that much effort in. Good luck
Deeply_Dippy (388 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
Apologies, spacecadet. I was answering your question about how to avoid being the odd one out.

From your thread title and opening post, I thought that this was your primary concern. I had not appreciated that you were after juggernaut-specific advice.
As Austria, use your diplomacy with the non-RT powers to prevent a juggernaut.

To the extent you can influence the west, EGvF is probably the best outcome for you. If EG are working together in the west, they likely will work together in Scandinavia, which will keep Russia in check. In contrast, if either E or G side with F against the other, Russia likely will thrive in Scandinavia. The "loser" in that triangle will offer to help Russia to recruit help; the "winner" may recruit Russia to kill the loser off; or both may leave Russia alone. Those are all bad situations for an Austria facing an RT.

Sound the alarm with the western powers, early and often, that a juggernaut is coming. Project/predict more than you actually know. Make an educated guess and claim it was based on intel; if it turns out to be correct, you look like you were in the know and your information is more trustworthy.

Italy's early decisions are key. If it's AvRT, you need to convince Italy he is next once you get crushed so that he can help you in the Med against Turkey's new fleets. You especially don't want it to be RTIvA, as you likely will die very fast.

If you can convince Italy to go after Turkey from the get-go, then you have leverage with Russia. You can tell Russia that an AI vs. RT standoff helps nobody in the east, and Russia is vulnerable in the north once the EFG dynamic resolves (in contrast, Turkey is a safe turtle). It's more expedient for Russia to join in a quick dogpile on Turkey, RAIvT, and he can figure out what to do after that (of course, both of you are promising it will be RA all the way). If it's just you pitching this, Russia may not believe you but if Italy also is telling Russia that AI are going after T immediately, that helps immensely.

Also, check out peterwiggin's games as Austria.
spacecadet (329 D)
06 Sep 17 UTC
deeply dippy, i wasnt specifically asking about austria.
but i am using it as a case study.
thanks everyone for the wonderful answers!
they have all (somewhat indirectly) answered my question.
it seems experienced players Don't prevent themselves from being the odd man out, but know how to turn the tides very quick if they have an alliance against them.
some of your answers have directly helped me get a solo in a live game last night (where i coincidentally got austria and could use this case study)
thanks alot guys
eturnage (500 D (B))
06 Sep 17 UTC
Russia is the most exposed in a Jug. Experienced Dip players often use the Jug alarm with the west to form a coalition to stop it, and that coalition hammers the Russian before the Turk. Therefore, smart Russia's enter a Jug with trepidation. You can use that in your diplomacy with Russia in spring/fall 1901. A lot of Russian players prefer the R/A.

Austria nearly always should try to ally with Italy in the early game. Fighting between I and A create the environment for a Juggernaut. Italy attacking Austria in 1901 is also a pretty difficult strategy to execute and usually ends up with a stalemate and Italy getting killed by Turkey or France while struggling with Austria. Austrian diplomats use this in 1901.

In 1901 diplomacy with Turkey, try to get her to open to Armenia and Black Sea. Offer Turkey support to Rum. You want to get Turkey and Russia fighting if possible. Promise to ally with Turkey against Italy long term. Encourage Turkey to build fleets. This will keep Italy from moving against you. Providing inducements to Turkey are helpful in stopping the Jug from developing.
eturnage (500 D (B))
06 Sep 17 UTC
These are just some examples of Austrian diplomacy. Any country you play will have arguments to make. Try to figure out a strategy that helps both parties to a negotiation and tell the other party what they want to hear. But don't be too generous or they will know you're lying.
MajorMitchell (1033 D)
06 Sep 17 UTC
Oops I missed the juggernaut part of the question.. Plenty of good advice from others. If you have Austria, or Italy, working as a team at the start works well for both players. If you have Austria you really only need peace with Italy and modest help to attack Turkey if Russia doesn't ally with Turkey / attack you. The opportunity that an alliance with Austria gives Italy is the opportunity to attack France.. Getting Marseilles and Spain after Tunis.. And be can deploy most of his units to that enterprise, Italy only has to contribute one fleet to the fight against Turkey.. It can serve Italy's purpose if the fight between Austria and Turkey, even Austria against Russia & Turkey is a slow stalemate, in which Austria only slowly succeeds, whilst Italy gets growth by going West. Then Italy can use one extra unit from getting Marseilles and Spain to help Austria, and get a share of the Turkish sc's.
Look at the games with Austria and Italy where elite players do well.


12 replies
Hellenic Riot (1619 D (G))
04 Sep 17 UTC
(+13)
September GR Published
https://sites.google.com/site/phpdiplomacytournaments/theghost-ratingslist

All +1's are welcome as usual :)
7 replies
Open
trip (462 D (B))
27 Aug 17 UTC
France vs Austria
A set of friendlies if anyone is interested. 85% RR to go.
gameID=205274
gameID=205277
gameID=205276
1 reply
Open
Smokey Gem (184 D)
06 Sep 17 UTC
Voice to Text Sftware.
Hi all I need to do lots of notes and driving for my work.
3 replies
Open
Mintyboy4 (100 D)
05 Sep 17 UTC
Is it against the rules to tell somebody you've voted draw in hidden draw votes?
As written in the title.
Been a while since I've actively played the site. Few things have changed.
Just wanted to make sure.
4 replies
Open
Thucydides (869 D (B))
30 Aug 17 UTC
(+5)
Are you people still on this fucken web site
Yes I'm still alive. My family in Houston evacuated. Everything is fine. Climate change is real. I'm still an anarchist. Suck it.
31 replies
Open
slypups (1889 D)
04 Sep 17 UTC
Looking for substitute for Pairs game
Interesting concept game here - players are paired on the Modern Diplomacy II map. Unfortunately, we're about to lose one player (game currently paused) and might lose another, although we hope he's able to return. So looking for one more - more details follow...
52 replies
Open
spacecadet (329 D)
04 Sep 17 UTC
suspected cheating
hello everyone!
i suspect cheating in a recent game. id like to contact a mod about it.
rather not give any details and speak to a mod directly.
anyone has any idea how i get in touch with one?
26 replies
Open
Obbergruppenfuhrer (110 D)
31 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
Talking to other Players
Just wondering what other people think about how to communicate to other players. Some players go over the top and just write way to much, in my opinion. On the other hand there are people, like me, who keep it direct and to the point. Which way is best?
33 replies
Open
chluke (8555 D (G))
04 Sep 17 UTC
Biggest Game of All Time
I've been asked to help try to launch the "Biggest Game of All Time" one more time. This time you don't need a password to join, but you do need 4,500 points! Gunboat, 48hrs, Anon, DSS, HDV:
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=205586
3 replies
Open
jmo1121109 (3802 D Mod)
29 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
England Recommendations
I'll be working in the UK for the next few months and am looking to do a fair amount of sightseeing while there. Anyone have recommendations for can't miss sights/experiences? (let the sarcasm...and hopefully 1 or 2 useful suggestions...abound)
40 replies
Open
Maltir (125 D)
25 Aug 17 UTC
Map Question
What is that big black spot between Munic, Piedmont, and Burgundy?
24 replies
Open
ubercacher16 (259 D)
25 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
Question Thread
Ask your questions! I, and hopefully others, will most likely be able to answer them.
88 replies
Open
Hamilton Brian (662 D (B))
31 Aug 17 UTC
Thread for the cancelled game "Seriously this time. Do talk. A lot..."
Here's our chance for the big reveal.
9 replies
Open
CAPT Brad (40 D X)
03 Sep 17 UTC
Post Your Live Games Here
This is the the thread to post all and any live games!! Third time is the charm!!!
1 reply
Open
Live game needs 3!
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=205600
1 reply
Open
ubercacher16 (259 D)
01 Sep 17 UTC
Live Med?
http://www.webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=205582
0 replies
Open
Player finder for live games
Just hoping to find some players to play live games with
2 replies
Open
CAPT Brad (40 D X)
28 Aug 17 UTC
Fake News! The Hype is a Ruse!!
this gameID=205041 billed as the biggest pot will never happen!!!
19 replies
Open
CAPT Brad (40 D X)
31 Aug 17 UTC
What Would JamietUK or Krellin Do or Say?
Enough about WWJD or What Yoda would say. What could the commentary of our recently departed members be?
15 replies
Open
ConscriptedCow (113 D)
31 Aug 17 UTC
Balance in Modern Variant
I just got back into diplomacy after a two year hiatus and looking back at my old games I've noticed that the modern variant has big differences in skill required to be successful between countries. So I ask, has anyone been successful with Ukraine or Egypt?
5 replies
Open
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