Hero - we're on a Diplomacy website, if you want tips on how to be democratic where better to start, the US Diplomatic Corps have obviously not read Dale Carnegies book 'How to Win Friends and Influence People'

democratic s/be diplomatic :-)

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2013/03/25/think_again_north_korea?page=0,4

Page 5 directly addresses past U.S diplomatic actions toward North Korea. Saying that a war in Korea is the result of ill formed or imperialist U.S. policy is simply untrue.

I read that a long time ago. Too long ago to remember most of it! I'm going to have to re-read it now. Do you think it's really a model for international relations though?

I've seen a great deal of opinion that seems to blame the North Koreans for the escalation. Even the Chinese seem to agree on that. Maybe it's no longer time to be diplomatic?

Here's our diplomatic model: Pay off our enemies with cash, food and whatever else they demand. They use our resources to develop weapons, instead of infrasturcture, and then threaten us/our allies, and demand more. We give them more cash, food, whatever. They develop more weapons, and play the bully card again. Rinse, repeat.

Self-inflicted wound. We paid off the bully and taught him how to be a better bully.

Nigee, stop trolling. That article you posted shows that the US has done *nothing* to provoke North Korea. All of our policies have been strictly defensive and reactionary. How can we "threaten" North Korea with missile shields and anti-missile destroyers?

Where's Putin33 these days? He'll put you all straight on North Korea.

@goldie - that is a matter of opinion

North Korea is the ultimate troll, not Nigee...

Now I'm not saying Nigee's right about this being a US-created crisis. But I've never understood why the US has consistently refused bilateral talks. I'm not saying we should make concessions or give anything up or whatever, but where's the harm in opening a dialogue? Talking to your enemies face-to-face shouldn't be seen as a sign of weakness.

Just imagine if every year North Korea and China had military exercises aimed at preventing an attack by the USA, and they held them in the Caribbean or off the Florida Keys, how would the US military command respond?

Bi-Lateral Talks...we have had them. There have been six way talks, as well. Get your facts straight. N Korea is not intereted in solving problems with the US, only blackmailing us for our cash and produce. Teh problem is the dictator and his loyal military, not the US.

http://www.armscontrol.org/2011_09/U.S._North_Korea_Hold_Bilateral_Talks

Nigee -- we hold joint exercises with SOUTH KOREA, out ally, which just so happens to border North Korea. It's not that big a stretch that our joint military exercises with our ally take place at their house...

@Krellin - why are they having these exercises every year? do they need them? what strain are these exercises putting on international relations with the North?

The responsibility for this grave situation entirely rests with the U.S. administration and military warmongers keen to encroach upon the DPRK's sovereignty and bring down its dignified social system with brigandish logic

Nigee -- Do you know anything about the military? What is wrong with the military having training exercises in environments that mimic possible areas of conflict? And better still...why not train with your allies that you might have to fight along side. and better still, why not train in the exact region you might have to fight in?

As for every year...uhhh...because every year we have new members of the military.

Seriously...how dense are you?

Why do football players practice even during the season between games? And why, for god's sake, do they waste their time practicing on a football field of all things. That seems kind of silly...

Nigee - there are all sorts of annual military exercises. There are naval ones based out of Hawaii every year, exercises with Israel every year, etc. Its all standard. North Korea is conducting some annual exercises as well. China does them all the time. Its what militaries all around the world do to stay up to snuff.

As for your hypothetical scenario - so long as the weapons used are strictly defensive, no nation should feel threatened - in accordance with realist IR theory. Say, if France and the UK had military drills with Belgium after Germany declared that it wanted to take some Belgian territory back at some point, should Germany feel threatened? Of course not, because Germany is the aggressor and the UK is acting to defend its ally.

Wow goldfinger you have no touch on reality

Yes, nigee and SYn are right...in fact, it is time for the Police to disarm as well...no guns, no billy clubs, tazers, nothing...because those damned cops with their weapons are *causing* the criminals to commit crime, damn it!

In fact, if we would just get rid of the f*ing cops, there would be no crime at all!!!

I don't think you can really compare street crime to the situation of Korea. Just sayin.

@Krellin,
Bi-lateral talks... late 2011-early 2012. You're right. I don't know how I missed it. I stand corrected. Well, I'm glad that the bilateral talks resolved all our issues with North Korea. Problem solved. Now if we could just teach them the words to Kumbaya...

Goldfinger does not understand realist IR theory, but that's ok. Correct me if i'm wrong but realists talk about security, and a nation should feel less secure if they cannot damage a possible/real enemy. That's why any attempt in the Cold War to get away from MAD was looked upon with fear, when one nation can defend itself to the point that they can attack you without too many losses, you are in real danger of being attacked (offensive realism), so an offensive realist could easily look at these actions with worry.

I phrased that wrong, I'm sure goldfinger does understand realist IR theory, but some realist theory would suggest they have reason to be afraid, there that's better

hecks -- I never said the issue was resolved. You complained we didn't have bi-lateral talks; I provided a correction. You also, I assume, are of the opinion that the US is the fault in everything...but since I have demonstrated you are certainly *not* fully aware of all the interactions between the US and N Korea, then I would have to question upon what data you draw *any* conclusion, void of the complete data set in a very complex issue?

Seems rather hypocritical to boldly point your finger of blame without even having the *basic* facts under your belt...

That being said, you are in good company - this site...hell, this country in general...is fraught with individuals that castigate and criticize and make their loud opinions known without the benefit of facts, so be in good cheer, my friend...

@Krellin,
No, no, no. You misunderstand. I was making fun of myself, not you. I'd long thought that bilateral talks would go a long way toward solving our issues with North Korea. Now I find out that they happened more than a year ago, and they appear to have resolved nothing. Damn my optimism.

If you know nothing about me, know this: I'm always willing to admit when my assumptions and predictions are misproven. I'm smart enough to know when I'm wrong and man enough to admit it.

*disproven

@Hecks - Sorry if I got a little prickly there...it's in my nature...
Your willingness to admit that you were wrong puts you in rarified atmosphere. I congratulate you! I try to admit when I'm wrong on occassion...and I definitely admit that I'm a prickly bastard!

I can see how you would have read that as getting sarcastic at you. Not how it was intended, though.

Still, I think bilateral talks were worth a shot, and I'm glad we tried it. I'm disappointed they weren't more fruitful.