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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
19 Dec 11 UTC
The Greatest Threat To Us All
The greatest danger to us all is the fear of failure.
It's that simple. Without failure to identify the errors individuals and society make total disaster becomes a real possibility.
Embrace failure because failure alone tells us where the edge of the cliff lies
13 replies
Open
PowMacP (140 D)
23 Dec 11 UTC
World Map Winner takes all.
gameID=75629
3 days phase not to interfere with weekends although we can have it move to our own pace
All welcome
5 replies
Open
WoodenSpork (100 D)
23 Dec 11 UTC
Players needed for Live Game Quick
NAME: silent quick game 15
we need 3 people to complete hurry while spaces last very very very fun game please join
13 replies
Open
Zennith (0 DX)
23 Dec 11 UTC
Quick Game Now!
Get a game going here! Starts in 20!

http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=75738
0 replies
Open
Tettleton's Chew (0 DX)
13 Dec 11 UTC
The World's smartest people=Americans
n U.S., Fear of Big Government at Near-Record Level
Proof positive Americans are the smartest people in the world.
69 replies
Open
P-man (494 D)
23 Dec 11 UTC
Ten center Oz... Any takers?
0 replies
Open
MadMarx (36299 D(G))
12 Dec 11 UTC
MadMarx ABI-36 EoG's
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=69819
27 replies
Open
jmo1121109 (3812 D)
22 Dec 11 UTC
World Games Unwrapped
My thoughts on world games and what I’ve seen. I’m curious to see what everyone else thinks and has noticed.
8 replies
Open
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
21 Dec 11 UTC
Point Loaning has been discontinued
I'm not exactly sure how this policy started, but the mods will no longer be transferring points between players. If you need points to play in a tournament, we will still give them to you. It's just too much of a hassle and completely undermines the point system.
60 replies
Open
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
22 Dec 11 UTC
eBooks and Christmas
So, as you may know, I'm a big proponent of eBooks. However, about half the gifts I'm giving this year are still traditional books. This is partly because a lot of people still don't have ereaders, but partly because giving ebooks seems wicked lame. In fact, for those I know have ereaders, I've avoided giving them books in either form.
49 replies
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
22 Dec 11 UTC
Kim Jong Il is still dead!
Reactions to the lack of resurrection of the Dear Leader?
22 replies
Open
acmac10 (120 D(B))
22 Dec 11 UTC
NFL Week 16 Pick 'Em
Go get 'em, boys. With only 2 weeks left in the schedule, teams like the Giants and Cowboys are battling it out for a playoff spot! It should be an exciting two weeks, and now, PICK 'EM!
7 replies
Open
Yonni (136 D(S))
22 Dec 11 UTC
!! and checkmarks
I'm pretty conflicted on whether or not I like the fact that you can see if people have inputted orders yet. Reasoning to follow.
19 replies
Open
Levelhead (1449 D(G))
23 Dec 11 UTC
Merry Christmas!
A Merry Christmas to all my Christian colleagues, a Happy Hanukkah to all my Jewish colleagues, and lastly to Tettleton: Happy Holidays!
0 replies
Open
Alderian (2425 D(S))
21 Dec 11 UTC
Vegetarianism is evil
Imagine we make contact with an alien lifeform. A lifeform that is much like our plants in that they get their energy from the sun or other light sources. What would they think of us savage earthlings.
27 replies
Open
erik8asandwich (298 D)
23 Dec 11 UTC
Join booty pirates!
Come on. You know you want to find some treasure.

http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=75675
1 reply
Open
The Czech (41695 D(S))
23 Dec 11 UTC
Sitter needed for a live game
gameID=75620
PM me if you are interested.
1 reply
Open
PowMacP (140 D)
22 Dec 11 UTC
World map. Need 7 more players.
gameID=74616 World Diplomacy map
Starts in 11 hours. Missing 7 players
password: purps
Don't be shy, we don't bite. :o)
5 replies
Open
santosh (335 D)
22 Dec 11 UTC
WTA-GB-27
6 replies
Open
Sydney City (0 DX)
22 Dec 11 UTC
new rome needed- great position- winning
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=75595&nocache=539
0 replies
Open
LordVipor (566 D)
22 Dec 11 UTC
If you are in a game, and you miss three turns, do you have to pay to rejoin?
If you are in a game, and you miss the three turns and get kicked out ("Player Blah has Left"). If you come back, do you have to repay to join or not?
9 replies
Open
stratagos (3269 D(S))
20 Dec 11 UTC
I'd just like to point out...
that I'm a FREAKING IDIOT.

21 replies
Open
darklordpotter (102 D)
22 Dec 11 UTC
Live Classic NOW
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=75580
2 replies
Open
darklordpotter (102 D)
22 Dec 11 UTC
The World Ends in FIve Minutes
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=75565
1 reply
Open
Kochevnik (1160 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Luis Suarez and the difference between Spanish and English terminology
So, the Liverpool football player Luis Suarez just got a huge ban from the English FA for racism. The problem is that what he said is racist in English, but not Spanish, and he was talking in Spanish.
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Kochevnik (1160 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
The situation, for those who don't follow football, is that during a recent match between Liverpool and Manchester United, the two most popular teams in England, Liverpool's striker Suarez, who is Uruguayan, was giving United's Evra, who is French, a hard time.

Evra (who, it should be noted, is black) got upset at him, and called him a "sudaca," which is sort of a derogatory term for a South American, but which has nothing to do with race. Suarez replied by saying "Porque, negro?" (or possibly "negrito" depending on who you listen to), meaning "Why, Negro?"

Now, obviously to an English speaker, calling someone a "Negro" is totally offensive and wrong, and thus the English Football Association, trying to make a strong stand against racism, decided to ban him for the very stern sentence of 8 games. The problem is that "negrito" and "negro," though literally translated "black," have long since been used to mean different things in South America.

You can go anywhere in South America, where I'm from, and hear people call each other these names, and they're used like "dude" in the US or "mate" in England. You can call a white person a "negrito," and no one will blink an eye. Simply put, they are in no way racist, and I'm sure that Suarez didn't even consider the term a reference to Evra's race when he used it.

The question becomes, then, what responsibility does someone have to adapt to a new culture when he moves? If he is speaking his own language, is it OK to use the terms in that language that don't have a negative connotation, even if they are offensive in the language used by the people in the country of his new residence?

The English FA has obviously taken the position that it doesn't matter what a speaker meant by his words, what matters is that they could be perceived as racist by the people who hear him. I'm curious to see how people on here would take this, as it's really an interesting situation to me.
redhouse1938 (429 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Sounds a little overzealous. I bet Putin33 could fill your thread with the deeper political agenda of Mr. Suarez though.
diplomat554 (2104 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
I always thought the whole Suarez thing is bullshit, and now your explanation only reinforces that. Soon enough, accusations of racism are going to become the new way of diving. If you remember the brawl after the Spanish Super Cup, when Villa attacked Ozil, Ozil later claimed that Villa had insulted his religion. Not a classy way to counter Barcelona's simulation, but ever so politically correct and useful. It seems to have started a trend with Suarez and Terry now in trouble...

In answer to your question, he was speaking Spanish. I don't know where to draw the line in English, but in a different language, the connotations of the word in that language must be taken into account. An 8 match ban? Total BS if you ask me.
Maniac (189 D(B))
21 Dec 11 UTC
@Kochevnik - the question you have to ask yourself is this. Should Germany drivers be allowed to drive on UK motorways at any speed they like because they are allowed to back on the germany autobahns? I think not. If a person contravenes a local rule or custom then they should be subjected to the same punishment as a local. Ignorance of a law is no excuse for breaking it. I do not think he is a racist and neither does Patrese Evra, I think he has learnt what is and isn't acceptable and a very clear message has also been sent out to others who may have been unsure.
Mr_rb (594 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Evra has always been quick to pull the racism card, also in other situations. What I find worrying from a football fan's perspective is that essentially they're banning Suarez solely on a statement made by Evra, not supported by any witnesses. That sets a dangerous precedent. Given that both players allegedly spoke Spanish I think the FA should look at the weight these terms have in that language, and give a warning to both players to take into account the values of the country they play in in their communication on and off the pitch. 8 matches ban seems absurd.

However, although I do not agree with the ban as I do not find the evidence and the context clear enough, I can see why the FA seeks to set an example against racism in sport, and banning the top player of Liverpool is a sure way to set such an example. Perhaps it'll help to root out racism and discrimination in sport.
MrcsAurelius (3051 D(B))
21 Dec 11 UTC
I know suarez from his time in the Dutch league and I was also really surprised by this incident. I saw countless interviews with him on tv, Suarez comes across as a merry, decent guy, that sometimes gets way too passionate during a match and does something stupid (for a bizarre example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_Zbk0gHwtM ). He is always genuinly sorry after, I feel. He is not a malicious guy.

On the other hand to me Evra comes across as a complete asshole, way to sensitive and got lots of 'misplaced pride'. Also in the long term. Just look at the recent world cup where he behaved as a total moron, blowing up the france squad as a captain of that team, instead of mitigating that situation, like a captain should.
Kochevnik (1160 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Oh, I totally agree about the Germans driving at autobahn speed on UK motorways.

But that's a terrible analogy, to be honest. What if I'm speaking in Spanish, in my own home, to my South American kids, and say something that, if translated into English, would be offensive? You surely wouldn't argue that I was being a racist, unless what I was saying was racist?

What I mean by that is that he's not speaking English, so why would he be expected to use only terms that an English-speaker would consider acceptable? Since we're dealing with a language issue here, and he's speaking his own language, then in the case of your analogy it's as if he's found a magic way to teleport his autobahn into his English neighborhood, and then driving on it. Actually that doesn't make sense, but that's why your analogy fails.

My point is simply this; he's speaking Spanish, not English. Yes, he's IN England, but he's not speaking that language, so why would we use the standards of that language to judge his speech?
Kochevnik (1160 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Sorry, that was a reply to Maniac.
MrcsAurelius (3051 D(B))
21 Dec 11 UTC
Hmm.. maybe I came across a little too strong in that last paragraph.. Now mancunians or french in this thread right? ;)
MrcsAurelius (3051 D(B))
21 Dec 11 UTC
Now = No
Thucydides (864 D(B))
21 Dec 11 UTC
Suarez is a dick.

Anyone remember his red card world cup 2010? Yeah.

So I don't really give a shit if they put him in little league. Good riddance.
MrcsAurelius (3051 D(B))
21 Dec 11 UTC
That red card is probably the most professional thing I saw a player do. It gave his nation a shot at reaching the next round and was NOT malicious in anyway, but very professional. He was punished accordingly. Ghana missed their penalty and Uruguay advanced.
diplomat554 (2104 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
+1 Marcus
Suarez can be unsportsmanlike at times, but that was a very professional incident and it was dealt with as it should have been.

This ban could have a serious influence on Liverpool's season, which is the sad part. The price of the message the FA sends is singling out a prestigious club. Fortunately, Liverpool seem determined to fight this one through the whole appeals process, so the FA can reverse their blunder.
SacredDigits (102 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
The thing is, the football world has lots of seriously unbridled racism. I've read stories of African players getting pelted with bananas, and hooligans booing Ajax (which is supposedly owned by Jews) by making gas chamber hisses. Did Luis Suarez intend to be offensive? Probably not. But not punishing him opens the door for everyone else to "speak Spanish" when it's convenient.

Granted, the actions I listed are actions of fans, not players, but ultimately, it's a lot easier to discipline a player than a fan, and by disciplining him, they send a message to the whole community.

Now, it's total bullshit that there's no evidence of what he said. A ban of this level should only happen if he's mic'ed up saying it. If it's just hearsay, it's just hearsay.

And Suarez' red card in the World Cup is exactly what you're taught to do in that situation with that much riding on it. Japan did a similar thing against the USA in the Women's World Cup final, and that was also fine.
Putin33 (111 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
So the excuse is that you can call someone negrito 10 times because they do that in Spanish speaking countries? The idea that this is a "term of affection" goes out the window when it's clear Suarez kept using the term as an insult.
diplomat554 (2104 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
@SacredDigits: I agree mostly, but the price of this "message" is singling out Suarez and Liverpool very unfairly. Even if it was offensive, as you said, there is no evidence to support the argument. A terribly mismanaged situation by the FA.

@Putin: Look, do you understand the connotations of that word in Spanish?
ghug (5068 D(B))
21 Dec 11 UTC
@Thucy, I don't see why everyone hates him so much for that, he did what was needed and accepted the punishment, and Ghana fucked up. That's all there is to it. You don't see everyone constantly badmouthing Thierry Henri for scoring a goal with his hands to get his terrible French team out of qualifiers, and yet that incident was much worse.

@Putin Have you even read the thread at all, or are you just assuming that he was being a racist because it allows you to join the argument and attempt to impose your viewpoints on others?
SacredDigits (102 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Does Suarez agree that he said it? It's seeming like he does, if he's explaining what he used it to mean. I haven't read articles on the story, but you know how it goes. Ignorance of the law is no excuse. If you're playing in England, and you know that football in general has tried lately to fight the racism of the overall football culture, you should be aware of what is racist in England.

And you can't escape knowing that professional football has been trying to cleanse racism out for a while if you've been anywhere near a football pitch. Isn't that ad campaign that's backed by FIFA pretty much ubiquitous?
SacredDigits (102 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Au contraire, ghug, people talked shit about Henry's handball for a very long time, Ireland was even trying to get themselves placed in the World Cup instead of France and demanding a variety of things from FIFA as restitution. Ireland is, to this day, hella pissed about that.
ghug (5068 D(B))
21 Dec 11 UTC
I know that people are still pissed, I just think that it's on a much smaller scale and that Henry is still respected by the majority of fans worldwide, which most definitely can't be said for Suarez.
diplomat554 (2104 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
@SacredDigits: You're right, and that's not the best example, but it's been only the Irish who were seriously mad about that for longer than usual. Suarez has been condemned as a cheat, etc., by fuming fans the whole world over up to this day half a year later, as Thucydides so nicely demonstrated.

Speaking of Henry, I think this is appropriate:
http://irelandfrance.blogspot.com/
Putin33 (111 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
"Look, do you understand the connotations of that word in Spanish?"

Yes, "little black man". Can be a term of affection but also a term of belittlement, which in the heat of a football game is how Suarez meant it, especially since Suarez claimed he was insulted as well.

Carry on imposing your own views while whining about me. Your views are never imposed and you're not trying to silence anybody.
SacredDigits (102 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Suarez did exactly what you're taught to do in that situation with the red card. Important gamechanging goal coming in the final minutes and the only way to stop it is to foul? You foul and hope they choke on the penalty kick. The same kind of thing happens at the end of basketball games where the desperate party will grab opponents' jerseys and hope they suck from the foul line.
Putin33 (111 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Suarez did what amounts to goaltending or flagrant/intentional foul in basketball. But in football you're not afforded an automatic goal like goaltending.

Putin33 (111 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
And unlike in Suarez's case, people don't hail flagrant fouls as heroism or fair play.
diplomat554 (2104 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
This isn't an argument between sports, Putin.
diplomat554 (2104 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
"But in football you're not afforded an automatic goal like goaltending. "
What?
Draugnar (0 DX)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Putin is referring to high school and collegiate basketball where goaltending sees the point automatically awarded to the shooting team. But he is comparing amateur (HS/College) bball to professional soccer. If he did a true apples to apples, he would find that goaltending is *not* an automatic two or three points in the NBA.
Octavious (2802 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Plenty of white English people have used the terms darkie and blackie in what they considered to be a non-derogatory, even friendly, fashion, much like Suarez has done. For good or ill such things have become highly unnacceptable and people who do so in public will be punished, like Suarez.

I don't really thing Suarez is racist, but under the rules UK society currently lives by he has clearly done wrong and should be punished. My personal view is that such rules achieve little but to stoke racial resentment and keep true racism hidden under the carpet, but that's another debate.
diplomat554 (2104 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Thanks for the explanation Draug.
+1 Octavious

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77 replies
redhouse1938 (429 D)
19 Dec 11 UTC
22 years
This game took 22 diployears to finish. Anybody interested in a summary of what happened here?
gameID=67307
68 replies
Open
Putin33 (111 D)
22 Dec 11 UTC
GOP cuts off CSPAN cameras
Because they hate criticism and want to hide their hatred of the middle class. Spin this one, Repugs.
38 replies
Open
goldfinger0303 (3157 DMod)
20 Dec 11 UTC
The Masters Tournament
So just a quick update for all those involved
2 replies
Open
erik8asandwich (298 D)
22 Dec 11 UTC
Rome: Total War Again
Hey we just had 4 of the 5 we need. So I am trying it again. JOIN!!

http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=75548
0 replies
Open
Hyperion (983 D)
21 Dec 11 UTC
Thirsty Tuesday EoG
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=75413
6 replies
Open
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