Since that last marathon, I decided to go to the local shoe store to get fit for shoes. For my first pair of running shoes, I merely went onto Brooks website and used their program to fit me for shoes, and I got a pair that I thought would work for me, knowing that I have some serious pronation issues with my feet. Well, I then put a pair of orthotics in those shoes, which of course correct my pronation issue, so it's obvious now that I was double corrected for my pronation, which often leads to knee issues! Anyway, someone took video of me running on a treadmill and I got the correct running shoes.

I also did some physical therapy. More treadmill video, this time showing that with my slow tempo (~150 strides per minute), I was putting quite a lot of stress on leg/knee with each stride, causing my knee to rotate a bit with each stride. When I ran at a 180 strides per minute pace, no more knee rotation! This causes me to run more on my forefoot, which is good in some ways, but it also puts my stress on my calf/Achilles, so I figured I'd need to start training again from square one.

So, I searched for a relatively flat marathon, and found Lake Lowell in mid-April. Then I decided to try the 100 Day Marathon Plan, which has made running indoors in the winter relatively tolerable. I'm just finishing up Week 8 of the 15 week schedule, ran a 10K this morning.

PS - The wife started the third trimester today, we're both 41, this is our first kid, it's due May 24th, so I got to finish this marathon Madness with a bit of time to spare...

Good for you MM. I'm running the Gasparilla 1/2 marathon tomorrow in Tampa. I've had Achilles issues since last years race. Not sure if it's the bone spur or the achilles. Where did you get your 100 day marathon train program from? I's like to try a marathon later this year.

10K Progress To Date:

June 29th: 59:32 (splits: 9:05, 9:12, 9:19, 9:37, 10:22, 9:49, 9:28)
July 6th: 59:11 (splits: 9:58, 9:40, 9:32, 9:33, 9:27, 9:12, 8:24)
July 24th: 57:59 (splits: 8:32, 9:00, 9:06, 9:47, 9:58, 9:53, 8:06)
July 31st: 56:43 (splits: 9:11, 8:59, 9:07, 9:11, 9:03, 9:24, 8:36)
Aug. 14th: 55:35 (splits: 8:02, 9:04, 8:57, 9:14, 9:18, 9:06, 8:53)
Sept. 15th: 55:14 (splits: 8:52, 8:56, 9:01, 8:55, 8:46, 8:48, 8:48)
Sept. 23rd: 52:59 (splits: 8:49, 8:42, 8:31, 8:33, 8:47, 7:56, 7:47)
Oct. 9th: 52:48 (splits: 9:11, 8:41, 8:37, 8:18, 8:23, 7:59, 7:39)
Oct. 16th: 52:29 (splits: 8:48, 8:08, 8:10, 8:16, 8:42, 8:43, 7:41)
Oct. 27th: Columbia Gorge Marathon

Feb. 22nd: 49:53 (splits: 7:25, 8:00, 8:10, 8:33, 8:20, 7:54, 7:08)

Good luck with the race tomorrow, Czech!! With the 100 Day Marathon Plan, I do a half marathon in three weeks, four weeks before the marathon. Here's a write up on the plan, it cost $49, but well worth it in my opinion:

http://100daymarathonplan.com

My first marathon I used this free training schedule, supposedly it's used more than any other training schedule (or maybe Hal Higdon in general, you can pick the best schedule of his that works for your fitness level):

http://www.halhigdon.com/training/51137/Marathon-Novice-1-Training-Program

Thanks MM. I am A LOT slower than you. Keep us posted. I am interested in how you do.

I'm doing the Four Hour Marathon Plan with The 100 Day Marathon Plan, but it also has a 4:30 Plan, a Five Hour plan, and a Beginners Marathon Plan... It also has training schedules for 3:30, 3:15, 3:00 and 2:45 marathons, lots of options...

Damn, MM, you're killing it with those 10K splits! Having a higher turnover is going to do wonders for your speed - higher cadence, less distance over each stride, equals less work for each step.

If you're looking to improve your training beyond your 100 day plan, I'd recommend checking out Daniels Running Formula. It goes in depth into the physical science behind building speed and endurance and some great strategies for building training plans.

I can totally identify with your self-imposed rehab, I took about six weeks "off" over December and January while I rehabbed a painful IT band and started more strength training for my legs, hips, and core. Its already paid off - I set a personal PR on my 11.2 mile extremely hilly training route this week and my long run is at 18 in preparation for the Country Music Marathon at the end of April. Its not a terribly hilly race, but its more difficult than average, so I think that will help keep me from getting too ambitious and keep my pace in check. I run better on hills anyway. Plus, I've got a home course advantage :)

Good to see you still at it MM. My next sprint tri is in July. I'll definitely take the running portion more seriously this time around. I remember telling my brother "Heck, I can walk a 5Kvif I have to", last year. It's good to hear you're still on it and still much more fit than I am :-)

Higher cadence is less work for each step, but many more steps, 30 more steps a minute for four hours is 7200 more steps! I got a Daniels book last summer, but the training plans seem pretty complicated, The 100 Day Marathon Plan has done all that for me, though lots of other valuable info in the book! My knee was an IT band issue as well, half way down an 8 mile long hill (after having climbed up that same hill) was when my knee had enough in the Columbia Gorge Marathon and I started walking.

A triathlon sounds very challenging, especially to someone like me that isn't much of a swimmer! I also said I could walk the marathon (in seven hours) if I had to, when I signed up for that first one, but that's good, whatever it takes to start the process!

The higher cadence has been shown to be a lot faster. As your splits attest. And you are a lot younger than I was when I started running half-marathons. PR ~1:48; most recent ~2:05.

VB, it's much easier said than done. I can run for hours at 150 strides per minute, but probably only managed to keep up with 180 strides per minute for half of my 10K yesterday. If I run a 9:00 minute mile at 180 spm, my HR is higher than if I run that same 9:00 minute mile at 150 spm. I'm trying to make the transition, but you don't magically get faster by taking more strides per minute, you also have to get in better shape to be able to take more strides per minute. My best guess is that I'll only be able to take 160 spm on race day in 7 weeks, but we'll see, 180 spm has been much more difficult for me on a treadmill, but now that the weather is getting better and I'm running more outside maybe I will be more successful making the transition than I currently imagine.

How did The Half go, Czech? Were you pleased with the result? How was the weather? Did your Achilles hold up okay? Details, man, as many as you care to share!

Actually, MM, you do go "magically faster" if you take smaller strides and adjust your perceived level of effort. Try to set up one run/week at a track. After warming up, try to run the first 1/4 at your normal 150 cadence and normal pace for a 10K. You may need to settle into the pace for 2-3 laps. Once you are there, pick up your cadence to 180, but monitor your time ... smaller steps until you are within 5-10 seconds of your 10K pace from the first part of the workout. Then hold it. Once you have the pace mastered, try picking up the pace slightly to do negative splits, but every 2-3 laps come back to your "normal" pace. If you work on this for a couple of weeks you will have mastered the magic.

I was surprised, the tri was exactly the opposite of what I expected. The swim was the easiest part and the bike was the hardest. Twelve miles on a bike isn't much (my best distance was thirty miles, and I'd like to do a metric century next season), but this was twelve miles of really long climbs. For the first one I was just worried about finishing. I'd like to shave a good bit off the time on the next one.

Okay, MM since you asked. The weather was good. It was 68F at the start and we had fog all morning which kept it coolish. Since we ran along the bay front there was a breeze. I was on my pace (12 min miles) up until the 6 mile mark. Then the achilles started hurting. I still think it's the bone spur that aggravates the tendon. I will get a second Drs opinion after I see my primary care in March. Anyway, I fell off my pace and with the shorter strides My knee and hip started hurting. When I increased stride length the pain went away in the knee and hip, but I couldn't sustain the pace because of the achilles. My time was 2:55:27 and 13:22 pace. Worse than last year, but better than I expected given my training. I was 4848 out 5352. I did much better last year and last year I ran the 15K and 5K the day before the 1/2.

With the number of live games you play Czech, I wouldn't be surprised if you were playing on your phone during the race.

I used to cross train for running doing a fair bit of swimming, that worked big time for me, increased my lung capacity, built my upper body which I didn't get from running.
Swimming has got to be one of the best all round exercises for fitness and is very complimentary to long-distance running.

VB, I do plan to figure out the 180 spm, I'm just trying to not get my hopes up... My Wednesday workout is 30 minutes at effort one, then 30 minutes at effort two, then 30 minutes at effort three. With my 10K my main focus was finishing as fast as possible, and even though 180 spm may be the best way to finish as fast as possible, it's this Wednesday I will attempt to re-focus my mental energy on 180 spm and see what happens (for that day, and on as many training days as I can muster these last seven weeks, hopefully all training days/runs).

Swimming and hills on a bike indeed sound Crazy, Anglican! Maybe one day, but not anytime soon for me. Nigee, if I could swim properly, hold my breath under water and all, it makes sense, but I just flail around, not overly useful.

Thanks for sharing Czech! Running with an injury is also Crazy, but at least you made it about half way before it flaired up too much, and you still finished ahead of over 500 people, well done!!

MM I found that improving my breathing technique when swimming (when you are less than 50% oxygen efficient) significantly improved my breathing technique when running. I am not saying it works for everyone but I would be interested to know if anyone else has done this, you can become a better runner by becoming a stronger swimmer.

Damnit, NB, now you are getting me curious!! In addition to always having wanted to run a marathon, I've always thought triathlons sounded pretty cool, but never really imagined myself doing a triathlon... Maybe if I finish this marathon without injury, I'll focus on something new afterwards... Hmmm...

I am not a marathon man in any way (preparing for outdoor track season right now). However, you guys make it seem like a blast! Can't wait to start on that section of running after I'm done with the short stuff.

The run today didn't work very well. My schedule called for 30 minutes at effort one (HR ~72% HRmax), 30 minutes at effort two (HR ~80% HRmax), and 30 minutes at effort three (HR ~87% HRmax), for a 90 minute run.

My goal was to do the entire workout at 180 strides per minute. Fifteen minutes into the run, taking 180 spm, and running as slowly as I can at 180 spm, my HR is already at 80% HRmax. So, I backed off the 180 spm to get my HR down closer to where it's supposed to be. Half way through the effort two portion, at 180 spm, my HR was about 85% HRmax, almost to the top limit of my effort three, so I again tried to back of the spm a bit to get closer to 80% HRmax. During the final phase, I had a couple songs at 170 bpm, and that cadence felt very comfortable at effort three, *but* when I got back to 180 spm, not only did my HR want to go to 90% HRmax, but I couldn't find a comfortable rhythm mad my back was getting jarred around like crazy.

To make matters worse, the only time I was even close to my theoretical marathon race pace was when my HR was at least 87% HRmax, but the upper limit of effort three is too hard to be running for a marathon.

In the end it doesn't really matter if I can run a sub 4 hour marathon, or a sub 10 minute mile marathon, or a sub 5 hour marathon, that will sort itself out on race day. I would, however, like to find the most comfortable cadence for me that is as efficient as possible, to insure I am able to give every ounce of effort I am capable of beating out of myself on race day...

Next Wednesday I have a similar workout, except each phase is 40 minutes, for a total of a two hour workout, any advice on how I should approach it? Ignore HR? Ignore strides per minute? Maybe focus on 170 spm and somewhat ignore HR?

The biggest problem of all: I only have about 5 songs ~170 bpm, and how many times can one listen to Lose Yourself before going off the deep end?

Maybe instead of music get another beat maker? That could help. I'm not very used to very long distance running, my longest is 7 miles. But I plan on increasing it this spring/summer. I am very interested in this discussion on how to increase efficiency. Some of the terms used I didn't even know mean!
I just run. I find a good pace and go. I'm still young, so my body can adjust to a new pace quickly enough. I really don't have a form... Celt keep the back straight and arms moving. And always look where you are running.

I'd go crazy with a beat maker in about two minutes, I'll find more songs. As far as form, I took a short class from the local running store on Good Form Running:

http://goodformrunning.com

There are a couple short videos on the left side of the screen, I got a lot out of it, though I suppose I was a clean slate...

Measure less and find your comfort zone. cadence is key, so focus on a cadence that feels a little fast and a pace that feels comfortable. Measure your time on race day.

This Saturday I have a session where I alternate running at effort one for 20 minutes, then walking for 5 minutes, back-and-forth for three hours. Think I'll just ignore the effort one part, run as efficiently as I can at 170 spm (minimum, maybe I'll start at 180 and have 170 be a fall back option), goal being to find a comfortable pace with good form that I will hopefully be able to run at for at least four hours on race day...

Does anyone here have any experience and/or advice on how to transition to 180 spm? Maybe it'll just take a few more weeks, I feel pretty good about 170 spm, which isn't bad since last fall I ran at 150 and when I started training for this second marathon in January running at 160 spm was a real struggle...

Thanks VB, I do get obsessed with measuring and numbers, I need to "go by feel" more...

"Next Wednesday I have a similar workout, except each phase is 40 minutes, for a total of a two hour workout, any advice on how I should approach it? Ignore HR? Ignore strides per minute? Maybe focus on 170 spm and somewhat ignore HR?"

I would heed VB's advice and keep it simple. Run at a comfortable pace with a comfortable cadence and don't worry about the numbers so much. Personally, I think the obsession with a specific cadence and heart rate is a bit too complicated, and this isn't just you in particular, but a good sized chunk of the running community. Running is the most simple sport there is and its only as complicated as you make it.

I base a lot of my training off Daniels, but I simplify it so that it fits my needs as a runner. When I draw up a training schedule, I have three difference paces - Easy, Marathon Pace, and Tempo (not including workouts). My marathon pace is ideally my goal race pace and is entirely dependent on the race and expected conditions, with the idea being that I need to acquaint my body with the anticipated effort level of the race so I know when I'm going too slow or too fast without needing my watch. The goal of my training program, then, is to make MP my comfort zone by race day.

If you want to break four hours, MM, that's a 9:08 pace, call it 9:00 even for sake of rounding and to give yourself a bit of a buffer. This is the only number that should really be in your head during a long run or workout. If you must include SPM or HR, it better get you to a pace that's faster than 9:00mpm or else the philosophy should change.

But, 2WL, all of the long workouts on my schedule call for effort one, ~70% HRmax, and I assume my marathon pace should be around 80% - 85% HRmax, and I don't want to overtrain and make myself susceptible to another injury... You say you have an Easy pace, so you must do long/Easy runs, but how often do you do Marathon Pace runs, once a week?