Never too early to start celebrating your victory, eh?

Please do not post about ongoing games.

What was wrong with his post? Can you please explain in words why what he did was wrong, otherwise, please don't tell people what to do.

Whoa, Lando, I was just trying to be funny. Sorry I didn't include a wink wink nudge nudge. Sheesh.

There's some internet rule to describe needing to put a winkey next your sarcasm.

At any rate, for those who are serious about rules and whatnot. We we talking in game and figured an EOG thread would be appropriate now.

Nice! An EoG thread, will post my thoughts later, a little busy right now.

@Yonni: I've been partying about it for the last couple of days, so I'm already in the mood, ya know? ;)

@dubmdell: If you feel the rules have been broken, I invite you to contact the mods teams so they can analyze things and ban me if needed. (I'll post a ;) just in case I sound too serious there.)

Like Achillies, I will post something later, but right now, the weather is just too good to not go outside... Later!

I've gotta get me one of those winky faces.

My EOG: I hate all of you.

Not really. But I'm bitter. Will post something substantial in a bit. Because I was very invested in this game.

Will look forward to hear your thoughts. In fact, I'd really like to hear other players' thought process through that game.

Still can't write a detailed one, here...

Without gettig into the EOG properly yet, I'd like to say that I think Santosh hit the sentiment squarely on the nose. I was definitely very invested in the game - whih I guess is what you look for in a hobby. But, god damn, can it be frustrating.

And, yes, I hate you all.

And FTR, that's what I liked *very* much in that game. Everyone was so invested and talkative.... Even Turkey after elimination! ;) that definitely enhanced the experience, here.

The game was awesome, it just was sorta sad losing the 393 after all that.

Congratulations slyster!

Thank you! I now have time to write that EoG? So I will right now!

Ok, so here it goes... Every phase, I will summarize what has happened, and some personal views on the phase:

Pre-game:
First impressions was that I really was impressed by the amount of press. First years are usually really productive, and I really hoped it would continue this way. I also really was amazed at the quality of press by the others. I knew that it would be an awesome game just after the pre-game phase. So, in the north , I tried to see what was up with other people's thoughts and deeply, I wanted to avoid the EG as that's bad news for Russia in Scandinavia else, so I hoped France would come out strong so there would be some fear of us here and there. He tells me right off the bat he's going for Germany and wants assistance. Right after that message, a northern opening looked ugly and a Sealion was probably impossible, but still, I wanted to see with England if a DMZ ER (no northern opening, no army in Norway) was possible. After some talking with England, it looked like we fetched a deal, and opening north was out of my head. The country I really was trying to please, here, was Germany, to of course have a shot at Sweden right off the bat. Luckily, he's the one I quickly developped a good relation-communication, and I thought from there, who knows where it can bring us! I'm one who really likes long-term alliances, so I crossed my fingers and hope for the best! Down south, I had good and strong communication with both Turkey and Austria. I felt that Turkey looked more reliable and true in his speech, but Austria was sending me really interesting analysis on how the game could develop, alliances preference, so I really was 50-50 at that point. The whole deal, for this turn and that year, was to please Germany enough so he would let me have that 2nd build in Sweden, so all of my efforts were concentrated there. Basically, A wanted to ally with me quickly against Turkey so we could advance west quicker and wanted a DMZd Gal, T wanted me to open to Gal so we could have a better position against Austria, but at the same time, I didn't want to get screwed up north by a Gal opening so in the end, I decided to let the Gal fate into Germany's hands, and he wanted me to not go there. I figured it would help me get Sweden + give me good diplomatic advantages right off the bat. So then the moves went.

Spring 1901:
It went around 50-50 after that turn. Down south, I really liked what happened between Austria and Italy, there. It was clear that Austria would not get a 2nd build that year, and I guessed that their relations were tense, so I thought I'd see what's up with T and A, and I would likely decide my ally after this turn. Basically, what really turned into Austria's favor that turn, was that I needed T to not go to BLA this turn if he wanted us to continue our good communication and alliance, so I could support my Ukr army into Rum and send Mos to Ukr. For some reason, he wouldn't commit to DMZ BLA that turn, and even though I tried really hard, because I felt that it would give us one hell of a great strategic position against Austria, while not having people fear the Jugger too much. I don't really like having two fleets, especially a fleet in Rum after the first year, but after the BLA issue, it looked like it was the way to go, but I was confident in my position down south. Up north, that was an other story. France opened agressively against Germany, England went against France but sent his army to Yorkshire (WTF?), and Germany opened to Burgundy. I thought that all of my efforts to escape an EG had failed, but I hoped that I could sound more appealing to Germany to ally with than have England ally with him. England, after this turn, had only one convoy option, and that was to Norway, but he would break our DMZ if he did that. Luckily, I think I had Germany on my side at that time and I think it's that year that I went all in and proposed him a long-term alliance. I really just went with my gut feeling here and hoped for the best. Germany felt the same way, and we were onboard, so I knew I would get my 2 builds after that, unless he was lying to me, and that would have been bad news. I also was hoping that England would respect his agreement.

Autumn 1901:
Got my two builds, things were going great, but England broke his agreement, and after that, I told myself that I wouldn't trust him unless he shows pormising stuff, but my relations with him were off, for now. In the south, I really hoped that Turkey would still have DMZd the BLA without telling me it, but he didn't. So, at that time, A F. Sev build was my only option there, and go with Austria, while making an army for "self-defence" in StP against England, because he broke our agreement. At that time, if Germany was still on board with me, I knew that I could disband that Norway Army next year by sending all of my armies into Finland and StP. Then the builds came in...

Spring 1902:
Turkey was pissed at me for building an other fleet in Sev and he knew our relations would go down after this shot. Austria was then onboard to have us work together, but from that time, I really hoped that AI would not be working together, as that would mean I would get screwed at the end. Rationally, I tried to explain to Turkey what made me choose a fleet in Sev, and I think it took him a little while, but he then understood what made me do that move, and our talks continued, and I think I earned back his trust, especially since it looked like Austria had already lied to him once. Still, he knew what was comming. Up north, I was happy with EG's builds, but not really F's... With his Liv build, England showed that he weas off against France and that he couldn't concentrate on me at the same time, but I still decided to seel the idea to Germany that having an English fleet in the North Sea was bad news for him, and that with his build, convoy and fleet in North Sea, England was mostly pissing off all 3 of his neighbours. Germany and I continued our long-term alliance, or so I thought it was, from there, and I really felt good at that time, as long as Germany would stick to the plans we would discuss.

Autumn 1902:
Austria told me he and Italy would do a Bluewater lepanto on Turkey, and even though I told him it was alright, I really didn't feel good about it, and I asked him to go for Venice as soon as he could, or else I would have to ally back with Turkey and do our Jugger. He told me he was looking forward to it, but that the timing wasn't right. I tried to talk Turkey into the situation and I told him he might have a chance to comeback soon, but that it would be a tough thing to do with my two fleets down south. Austria still looked cooperative, and there, I really just had my fingers crossed to have him attack Italy. One thing I didn't like at that point with Austria, is that the moves heg proposed me where always putting me off guard and stab open. But at that time, I really was committed with my two fleets. I remember Turkey told me he would try to throw me the game because he was pissed at both Austria and Italy, and I actually believed him, so instead of taking Bulgaria, I decided to aim for Ankara and get me a top position if AI were to ally against me. Up north, I told England I would have him disband that Army so he could concentrate against France and wished my communication with Germany was enough to NOT have him attack me this year in Sweden, so I decided to put my faith in my long-term ally and just go for Norway and not protect Sweden.

Builds 1902:
My gamble worked down south, but I wasn't all that happy, because Germany, my long-term ally, stabbed me to keep that English army in Scandinavia. He wanted to discuss about my retreat, and when I received that message, I just told myself: who does he think he is to think that I would do his bidding and retreat where he would want, when he clearly stabbed me, so I just retreated to Baltic Sea right away. He wasn't happy, but I told him that it was mostly diplomatic considerations that made me retreat there, but that I would attack and disband (FINALLY!) the English army in Sweden with that Baltic fleet. I still tried to see what build would make him more happy, as I still had in mind to ally with me for the whole game. I told him I would accept not to build in Warsaw, and build in Moscow instead, but in exchange of a fleet build in Kiel, and I even sent him detailed plans to go against England, together. I thought we would see after the builds.

Spring 1903:
Now, that was a really tough phase for me. I tried to convince both Germany and Austria that we could do one wicked alliance and go for the 3 (or 4) way-draw, with me making only fleets in StP NC and Sev, while securing our borders, and they said that they were tempted, but they weren't sure because they said they didn't trust each other. At that time, I told myself it doesn't smell good, especially since I wanted Austria to attack Italy this turn, else our alliance would be hard to continue. I also told Turkey that I thought he would have a great chance at coming back because there was a high chance I would get stabbed, but at the same time, I knew I couldn't do anti-stab moves in case Austria and Germany would compell to our agreements, because then, I would've sounded like the stabber to the eyes of Austria, and that would have put me off position, so I decided to gamble on that and hope that I would not get stabbed, even though the odds were high on me getting stabbed, but at the same time, I told myself that it was too early for the CPA to come out, so I thought that the situation could quickly be resolved with the other powers if a CPA was indeed forming. At that time, I wanted to trust Turkey as well, but I still didn't want to let him into Sevastopol, just in case he wanted to be a spoiler.

Autumn 1903:
The stab happened, and Turkey definitely was onboard to an alliance again with me. Germany, my long term ally, decided to stab me and Austria, my other ally went against me. I remember telling myself that I needed to react just now and that this turn was my only chance or else, elimination would be happening. I though the stab was flawless, but when looking closer, it wasn't, and because of that English army that retreated to Denmark. All of a sudden, all of my plans to go after England and eliminate Turkey had to be changed. Also, funnily enough, that English army I *so* wanted to disband became my biggest hope of turning the tides and thought that the best way to escape elimination was to concentrate all of my efforts against Germany and try to talk all of the corner power alliances that if we didn't react quickly enough, the CPA would take over and that we all would get screwed out of it, so really, the easiest country to distabilize in a CPA is Germany, so since he went from the player I wanted to ally the most with to the country I wanted out the most, I dedicded I'd try all I can to reverse the situation, and quick! Luckily, I started to develop a good communication with England, and he really was into stabbing Germany because the plan that Germany proposed him was to convoy to Livonia, and he didn't like it as he would have need to disband one of his unit, so I knew we had a chance there. France, who was under fire for some turns, also had no other choice but ally back with England, even though he was all over him. I remember there was England's sitter for some turns, and I was really happy with it, as I found he was more reliable, and less likely to stab me like the original owner did in the first year. Down south, I discussed really much with Turkey on what possible moves we could do to prevent him from disbanding and keep his fleet so we could cruise together through the med and have him as a minor ally. So, I was happy that at that time, it was the CPA against the 4 corner powers.

Builds 1903:
Flawless turn! All of my guesses were good, and all of EF's guesses turned out to be perfect, so we really were onboard after that. We reacted quickly, and all of us gained from it. England and I really were onboard with an alliance at that time, and we both knew it. With my builds, I told GA that they would have a hard time fighting me with my two builds, two armies, and hoped they would change their plans a bit, but I feared that it would only make them more scared of my 9 SCs at that time, so I wasn't sure it would work... Germany was really pissed at England, but at that time, I thought Germany would be the first country out.

Spring 1904:
At that time, Diplomatic considerations were already played and the alliances were clear. 1904 was mostly to get a good position against Austria and have an Army in Rumania and guess him correctly, while keepin Turkey alive. Germany hoped we could ally back somewhen and he already showed that by disbanding Silesia, which pleased me much. But still, I told him that he's the one that stabbed me and that for now, my trust was in England and that he had to show commitment if he wanted to comeback, but I didn't really think what I was writing, my game there was to have England and I in the final draw, no matter what, as I really like the new England, and for the rest of the game, especially since he was trustworthy.... And anyways, payback is a bitch and I felt like Germany deserved a little payback there.

Autumn 1904:
I had to guess correctly Austria so I could have an advantageous position against him, and I hoped I could keep Turkey alive, especially since his fleet was really helpful, and he was a great ally that I really enjoyed discussing with.

Builds 1904:
No builds, but a great position. There was an English NMR that affected the game greatly, as France didn't get Tunis, as promised, and it turned out that Italy had the build instead of France. Germany retreated back and I was feeling good about it.

Spring 1905:
My war against AI still continued, but my main strategy, from that time, was to convince one of them to turn against the other and go in a draw with England and I. Austria didn't want to consider at all, especially since I had so many armies surrounding him, and I understood his point, BUT, Italy was onboard, or so he said, and I just had to cross my fingers and hope for the best. Germany still attempted an attack on me, but England and I clearly were favoured.

Autumn 1905:
Italy moved like we discussed and I was so happy that the AI alliance was finally resolved, and then, I only waited for Austria to comeback at me and tell me he would try to move against Italy. And he did! But I think that was Spring 06... Oh well.

Builds 1905:
An unexpected build, there, as the plan with Italy was to have him take me a SC and have me disband one of my southern and rebuild elsewhere, but I actually took Bulgaria, and magically had a a 10th build. A. Sev was really the only possible build for me there, logically.

Spring 1906:
So, yes, looking back at things, it is when Austria promised me, for the first time for a while, that he would *finally* attack Italy. I told him I would still wait and see, and not open up myself to him widely, in case he tries something else. Up north, things were just going great and Germany would surely go to a quick elimination, and I was really happy about it at that time, since Germany went from a solid longterm ally to my nr. 1 ennemy in just a few turns. France and England were doing their things and splitting up SCs, so all seemed like I would head to a solid 3 way draw, unless...

Autumn 1906:
So I decided to screw my initial agreement with Italy, just because I could and that Austria was going against him. England told me he planned a stab on France, and Germany told me he was already pissed against England because he stabbed him for the 2nd time, so there I started to feel that all of the alliances were broken, except mine, and Germany wanted to work with me at that time, because he wanted to avoid elimination and give me a solo shot. I really was unhappy after Spring06 with him because I wanted us to start moving for the solo right there, but he later told me he didn'T see my message in time, but yeah Germany, you were right, I was pissed at you at that time, even though I said that you didn't interpret correctly my message, LOL! But he then understood that it was in his best interest to let me move within his lands and get a better position against Austria, and maybe have an army going into France if we could, but that he had to let me walk into Munich next year. I also attacked Italy and positioned against Austria with my armies to surround him.

Builds 1906:
Wow... Two builds baby! Making it to 12! Germany badly wanted me to make a fleet in StP NC, and I thought I would at that time, but I still wanted to keep any suspicions from England by making only a neutral army in Scandinavia, to start stalemating our borders. I remember having him tell me what was the point of having a 12 SCs country stalemate two 7 SCs countries (A and E), and after receiving that message, I told myself: "Damn he's right, what I proposed doesn't really make sense", but I knew I would need firepower up north if I eventually wanted to have a shot at the solo, but I thought I still had one year and a half, two years before I could think about it, so the deal was closed: Army in StP and Army in Sev.

Spring 1907:
France and Germany were onboard to help me, and Italy as well, because they knew the 3 way-draw would be without them, so I really just had to capitalize on what everyone wanted in order to get myself the best possible position, and hope Austria and England's suspicions would still go away and hope they would still think I would go for the 3 way so funnily enough, I had everyone working with me that turn. But unfortunately, something really surprising happened that same turn...

Autumn 1907:
Austria NMRs... At first, I was: Holy shit, this might put shadow to a possible Solo I might get, but after thinking about it, I told myself that it might just draw everyone's suspicions faster now... Austria even declared and congratulated me on the win, when I was only on 12 SCs. I really wasn't feeling good as I thought everyone would react to it and start plotting against me to stop me. The main deal, that turn, was to be sure that Germany was still working with me, so I could have a shot at the solo. I told him that if he stabbed me, that I would go for the 3 way draw next turn for sure, because he really was the only one that could stop me from soloing at that time. I decided to take a leap of faith and decided to go for the 18th builds that year...

Builds 1907:
Even though I jumped to 17 SCs, I was SO pissed at myself, because Germany made me disband that army in Kiel that was golden, and I oculd only build up to 15 SCs, and I felt like I screwed my solo chances at that time, becuase that Kiel army was just golden, and I knew Munich was lost, along with Norway... Luckily, and I don't really understand why, it looked like no one was really up for stopping me from soloing, but I knew it would all change eventually. So, from there on, it was my chase to the solo, and it really was a guessing game through the end that made me have the solo, plus some bad decisions taken left and right that gave me a golden opportunity against Austria, but what has really gave me the advantage was Autumn 1909 because before, I had trouble to find a way to solo properly.

So, pheeewww! There we go!! So, as for my personal messages to everyone:

Turkey (Rokakoma): I think you're the first ever player that I still continued to chat with, even after elimination, and I really enjoyed our communication throughout the game. Discussing strategies with someone eliminated from the game... How great! = )
Unfortunately, for the reasons I already explained to you, the BLA issue was the only reason that made me switch gears and I was really sadened by that through the game, especially when Austria stabbed me one year after that!

Austria (jmeyersd): I really was impressed with your tactical skills through the game, you clearly showed why you belong to the top of this site but I have to say I really found unfortunate the end of the game and I have yet to ask myself why this has happened, but you truly impressed me in the early stages of the game.

Germany (Yonni): Wow! What kind of rollercoaster was that game for our communication!! Went from my longterm ally that I really enjoyed chatting with to my nr. 1 ennemy that I loved to hate, to my best solo ally! Really, I'm glad we had all those discussion through the end of the game and that it finished the best way it could and I really enjoyed it all, Man! Thanks for setting up this game, will look forward to an other challenge of yours! = )

England: I really liked the way we turned the tides in that game, and I really think what happened south was out of your control, because else, we would have 3 wayed, just like we discussed for most of the game. I really enjoyed our exchanges and I'm sure we'll look forward to play an other game together soon enough!

France (Achillies27): I really appreciated your quick responses through the game and felt like you were a really reliable partner and I knew if I wanted to have a clear vision of seomthing in the game, all I had to do was to message you and have a heads up with you so really, keep this up, this is a great quality to have in a game: reliability. Will look forward to an other game with you later this fall.

Italy(KingRishard): I thinik you were the one I lied to the most and that I discussed with te less through all the game, I don't know if there is a correlation to that, but unfortunately, we didn't get to work together, apart from some years where I didn'T respect my agreements... I'm sorry, I'm not used to not respect my agreements, but I only did it because I felt I could do it (attack back Turkey's SCs). Nice fight through the game with Austria there, truly enjoyed it! ;)

So, that's about it! I really enjoyed playing with you all and will look forward to an other game with any of you. Cheers!

... My EoG isn't going to be near as long, so don't get your hopes up. ( that EoG was awesome btw)
Here it is, my long awaited and amazing EoG.
Right off the bat, I got stabbed by England. (1901) my communications were tense with germany off the start as well. In autumn, I just hoped I could get 2 builds....
1902
I got tricked by England from the build phase... And by autumn I realized I had an E/G on my hands.
1903
I was talking like crazy to anyone, asking for help while trying to turn England or Germany against one another, but they were Damn loyal. Me and England were just talking about some random stuff for most of the time after a while. Eventually me and England started talking about an alliance on Italy an Germany, and we went through with it.
1904
Me and England keep on pushing Germany and Italy, but England NMRs in autumn, causing me to not get Tunis or a build. I'm talking to everyone still, just doing what I can to keep good relations all around.
1905
Over here, in spring in in a great position to get a center, but in autumn England stabs me for port... I'm really just scrambling now and just doing what I can to get Russia to advance on Austria and England... Of course, I'm talking to Germany asking if we can put everything aside and attack England with what remains of our empires...
1906
I lose Spain and try for belgium.... I lose Belgium in the autumn.
1907
Just trying to annoy england and try to give Russia the best chance for him to get close to a solo so I can get to be part of a stalemate line.
1908
England realizes he needs me for a stalemate, mission accomplished. I'm doing all I can to help stop Russia now....
1909
I go for Rome and bargain with Russia for it, and he let's me in! YAY. In the north my burgundy just helps with Munich.
1910
In spring Germany gets a plan ready and we all follow it for minimum tactical error, but in autumn we all realize it is impossible to beat Russia now... So I just talk to Russia about the rice krispies he promised me of I let him win. Russia also messaged me a list of who was who in the game, and he was right.

I hope to lay with anyone of you guys late on, and hopefully I will play better.

Hahaha! The Krispers. But remember that you had to *help me* solo in order to get these. Not fight me and still want them. ;0p

Ya know... you won anyway.... So, maybe I actually helped you by misleading my allies? Hmmmmmm? Ya don't know, doya?

Man,there was so much wrong with the last sentence of my EoG, I'm going to revise it here.
"I hope to play again with any of you guys later on, hopefully I will play better."
Also, maybe I will start a game like this one and invite all of you!

Honestly, we will have to wait for the others to post their EoGs before I see what's up with that!

Um... Uh oh. Why would you wait when you can give me my Krispers now? ;)

Because they're not ready and won't likely be for a while.

I will put mine up in one of the next couple of days.

Oh. Just to let everyone know. I was sitting for santosh for most of this game. It was only supposed to be a couple of weeks, but it turned into the whole game as he asked me to finish it. I started in spring 02, after his goofy fleet Liverpool build.

I will get to mine but it'll have to be later in the week. Shits been hectic. Enjoyable game Tom, didn't know it was you. Must be nice to gamble with someone else's chips though, eh?

Don't worry about it yonni, the longer you wait, the higher chance Russia might give me my krispers...

I wasn't thinking about points. I was more into this game than my games under this account.

Yeah, I had some interesting conversations with you Tom...

Yeah. I'm not going to lie, I was not meshing with you at all achillies. Glad we worked well together at the end, and we able to keep things friendly and fun.

Yeah, t'was fun.

Instead of going year to year, I'd just like to point to specific moments/ideas to discuss. Hopefully I'm not misremembering too much.

Really, I just want to talk about 1902/1903 for now as that was an incredibly exciting but ultimately disappointing set of moves.

So, things are going well between me and England. France is sending me short messages without really much interest in working together.

Things are going great with Russia between us. However, I openly expressed that I really didn't want him opening on England that doing so was straining my relationship with my Western ally. I was also of the impression that France's stubbornness was of Russia's doing. He seemed like one of best diplomats on the board and wasn't about to dismiss the idea of him being up puppet-master.
To make the matters worse, I had told him in 1901 that I was more than willing to give him Sweden but that I saw it as a German centre in the long term. He kept giving me runaround and, even though F02 was a great turn to hand it over, we could not come to an agreement on it.

So, in F02, as England is my ally I support him to Sweden. I was hoping that in 03 I could beg forgiveness from Russia (after all, we were getting along swimmingly) and that he would support me into Sweden and turn things into a Sealion. Then, without discussing, he retreats into Baltic. FFS, that can't be seen as anything other than aggression and I get suitably nervous. I have a 7 centre Russia as my neighbour who is a strong diplomat and just retreated into Baltic.

To make matters even worse, I message Turkey saying that it was poor luck that he vacated Ankara to move Armenia and his reply IN FALL OF NINETEEN FUCKING OH TWO is that he's throwing the game. He's not a big FP player and this game has not been enjoyable. Austria can't be trusted and he's giving all his centres to Russia. He's not playing for some end game (obviously, because it's 1902!). Rather, he just wants out.

At any rate, 1903 comes and Austria makes his move to me. He suggests that we stab Russia and we offer peace to Turkey. England should be happy with me after supporting him to Sweden and should for sure want to weaken Russia. Why wouldn't Turkey want another shot at playing this game? And Austria was the one that propsoed it so what could go wrong?

Well, first off, Turkey wants no part of it. I point out that Austria breaking the arrangement would be akin to stabbing me. That I'd do whatever I fucking could to make Austria's life miserable if he attacked Turkey but, still, no dice. The discussion went down to the last few hours and I didn't have time to change our plans so I had to go ahead with a rather lame stab. Had Turkey gone along with it (because why the fuck wouldn't he?), Russia would have been down Rumania and likely one more. He also would not have gotten Con. That's a huge swing of power.

*I wouldn't have stabbed my best ally on the board if I didn't think it was a death blow and unfortunately it wasn't*

In the North things didn't go any better. I was certain that I had England on board (perhaps the switch of player through off my read of things - I hadn't considered that until just now when I saw that Tom had taken over). However, no matter how certain I was, I shouldn't have been that naive. I concocted a plan which I though would have been the strongest for stopping Russia. I dislodge him from Belgium so he can move to NTH while I let him into Denmark with his retreat. I think support him into Sweden. It was fucking great. How could England not love me after that? And Russia would be on the ropes. Life was going to be great.
England insisted on tapping Picardy which I said I was very nervous about (because what if Picardy moves?) but he went there anyways and it put out plan on the fritz.Still I thought, how could England not be nervous about a Russia who controls all of Scandinavia? And haven't I been nothing but nice?

Well, as they say, the rest is history. It all went to shit. I had lost the trust of my one ally who also happened to be the largest power. France never really gave a shit about talking to me and England had stabbed me besides me bending over backwards for him.

By about 1906 I was promising Russia the moon just to try manoeuvre my way onto the stalemate line. My plan is to not stop until England tries courting me. I don't want to offer help too soon only to be cut out in a 3WD. That never happens but after an Austrian NMR I'm forced to attack Russia again and it's just a fight to 18.

Now I think there are two points that we've skirted over that were instrumental in the solo. Uclabb (I think) put it nicely in his commentary of the SOW game going on now. In a push for a solo, the attacking country will - by definition - be at a disadvantage in terms of the number of units (barring a country not being able to build). The solo was most definitely not in the bag at that point except for two major mistakes.

1. Burgundy not supporting Bohemia to Munich
2. wtf was with the fleets in the South?
GoL-Spain and Ionian-Tunis in S08 were puzzling but then Spain moved to MAO which was even weirder.

I'm sure there were some other tactical mistakes (and an army build in Marseilles in 09 would have made things closer) but those two things were most puzzling.

Now, even if we did stop the solo, I'm not sure if I would have been kept around. I would have liked to think that England would keep me in the draw if I did prove myself instrumental in not letting him lose but that's only for Tom to know. Regardless of whether he would or wouldn't, it is never my intent to let a solo happen. I thought this survive wouldn't sit so badly with me but it does. I hate letting someone solo - even if he is such a classy player.

Anywho, those are my two cents.

Like I said before, I really enjoyed the game and look forward to playing with you guys again.

At the start yonni, I always like to go for Germany, and once you stabbed me, I didn't have much love for you. I could have been better with my diplomacy that game though.

Interesting thoughts Yonni, really! So thats what went through your head those times.

There's some points I'd like to discuss with you, though.

First, the instant Baltic retreat. I think theway you felt is exactly how I hoped that you would feel. In a game, I always try to stay as honest as I can with my neighbors or the good, but also for the bad. If someone stabs me, even if I felt that you had to do that move against me, I won't be so nice to my ally who stabbed me, because I feel like if he sees I always react so nicely to a stab, he might just try to repeat the occasion when he feels he wants to do it, but maybe you have an other view on the subject?

Segundo, about you stabbing me and what I think you said about me that I was your first ally at that point. Clearly, from what I just read, you've put tactical considerations in front of diplomatical considerations, which Im not saying that it's better or worse than doing the other way around, but looking back at the game, do you think there would have been a way that I could've convinced you, before you stabbed me, that I thought you had more benefits from allying with me than jeopardizing your position (mainly to England, as I believe Tom saw that he had much more benefits from stabbing you at that point rather than 4 on 1 me, if Turkey was in the plan)? I'm saying this as I really was looking forward to put that alliance, GR, far and see where it would bring us, and thought I would take some notes about it if I play an other game and faced to a similar situation with someone else.

Tercio, Regarding Turkey's decision of not following through the big stab against me. I know we've talked about it a few times, and still I don't want to speak for Rokakoma and maybe you(Roka) can tell Meir I'm mistaken or not, but I really feel like its hard for someone that got stabbed twice (by Austria here), to ally back with the stabber and hope it will go well and earn back trust in him... But maybe Roka can confirm or deny this?

Finally, Regarding my solo chase, I agree a 100% with you that those were the moves I was the most confused (but the happiest) with. Austria's NMR Clearly didn't help you guys, but I think I could've Been stoppable after that, and I'm not sure how that mistrust between England and France played in them not moving fast enough through the stalemate?

Still working on mine.

A couple of points I would like to touch on though:

1) I think while my moves in the south were suspect tactically, RUS would have never made it past Italy and we had a stalemate line set up in time. The stalemate line in GER was much more important because of the AUS NMR.

2) The mistrust between myself and France was the downfall in terms of stopping the solo in the last few years. France, to me, seemed reluctant to put his full trust in me, forcing me to make moves that slowed the pace of our side in the race to the stalemate line.

As simple as it sounds, I think giving me Sweden would have let the alliance last a lot longer. I never would have supported England there if I had an inkling that I'd actually get it without forcing your hand.
I definitely made a mistake by not preparing a speech regarding the English support and sending it to you the second the turn ended. I was fairly certain that you were a reasonable enough player and valued the alliance enough that, if framed properly, it did not have to be viewed as a stab but because I didn't think I was convincing enough and because you moved to Baltic I had the idea that it was me or you and I had to get the stab in first.
I probably underestimated your propensity for keeping the alliance going.

Regarding England not attacking you. I 100% agree. In an alliance or stab, you always have to make it MORE profitable to follow your plan than someone else's. Even though my plan was probably good for England. Stabbing me was at least equally profitable for him. I completely failed in that and can readily admit it. I should have accepted England's loss in Scandinavia and just gone for a weaker but more definite stab and then tried to get England on my side.

I'd like to hear Tom's take on it though. I imagine the move to Picardy wasn't intentionally chosen to screw the plan but how would he have reacted if he did retreat to NTH and was guaranteed a stake in Scandinavia the following turn?

After I started to leave Spain alone, I did my best to stop the solo, up until then, you hadn't messaged me, so I felt no reason to let you go. As soon as we agreed that we should stop Russia, I was all for it.

Thats what i thought Tom. Thanks for confirming, though!

Interesting thoughts there Yonni. I knew Sweden was the contention point, and takes also for confirming that. I knew that at that time, but I think it's really after analyzing the map that I told myself I couldn't make such sacrifice, that year, but I truly was sincere when I said I had no problems with you having it short term. But thanks for saying, I'll keep that in mind if a similar situation happens. Regarding Tom and the stab, I do think your proposition could have benefitted him, but I think the plan we setted up, along with France, was just irresistible for him. He would get two builds that year, with France disbanding his sole fleet, while holding the two threatening SCs surrounding him: Brest and Kiel. A deal like that rarely happens IMo, especially since France also had benefits in letting him have Brest. Am I right, here, Tom?

Bump?

Honestly, I don't much want to put the effort into a full out EOG so, I'll try to make a short version of my thoughts.

I started the game in spring 02, which already put me in an awkward position because of the fleet in Liverpool, which I didn't understand. If santosh had wanted to go after France, there were plenty of ways to do so which weren't so obvious. So I decided my best option was to continue the assault on France, especially since I hit things off well with Germany, and RUS seemed like a competent player as well.

The stab of Germany a few years later was nothing against the German player, but more a stab of opportunity. I was in great talks with Russia, and we had worked out some sort of alliance. I was also able to get France on my side, which was more than ideal since I was already in Brest, meaning he could not build fleets there to get revenge. In my eyes, it was a perfect opportunity to stab.

As Germany put up a good fight, I was pushed into deciding to take Portgual and Spain as well, and hope that I no longer needed France as an ally.

Regarding endgame, I think it is pretty self explanatory. GER and FRA tried to throw the game to Russia so that they would be essential in the draw. They were both very successful in this. AUS NMR'd, which was bad news for everyone except Russia. the rest is history.

Sorry for the brevity, but thats all I got.

For some messages to specific players:

RUS: Well played, and well deserved win. We had superb press between us, and I just hope that next time, for my sake, I work my way into a better outcome.

TUR: Didn't talk with you much. Maybe some other game.

AUS: I know you had some RL issues, but I think that NMR really screwed us. I would argue to my death that had you not NMR'd, Russia would not have won that game. That being said, I don't hold it against you because shit happens.

ITA: Solid press from you and solid play. Unfortunatley things did not go your way in this one. I really enjoyed when we were able to work together though.

FRA: I did not care for you short messages at all. We did not vibe well, and I thought I could use you to my advantage the entire game. I was right in some instances and wrong in others. I think you made some tactical errors, but one thing I commend you for is working your way into a draw situation. You did that beautifully.

GER: I feel bad for the way I played this against you. I thought your press was second to none in this one (well, maybe second to Russia =P). The reason I repeatedly stabbed you is not that I thought you were a poor player or that I thought I could easily beat you, but more that I thought I could use France as a puppet, and that you were a logical choice to expand. Hopefully we play again in different circumstances.

Hey Tom, I know I played VERY bad this game, and accept your criticism. I play a lot of live games, and got better throughout the game, and feel like near the end I was definitely playing better. Looking back at the part of the game when I wasn't trying to stop the solo, I definitely could have been much better, my position shows that. One of the reasons I may have had short messages (I don't remember which ones) is because I had I play most if this on my phone/ iPod, as my laptop broke partway through. I hope to play better against you next time to make up for this one.

Thanks for the kind words. I was surprised at how long you let me work with Russia without trying to convince me otherwise. I was waiting for you to come begging but it never happened.

Achilles, its definitely something to take as a learning point because the short messages really put me off too. A) it was impossible to get a read on you and B) I was paranoid that you were talking more to everyone else.
Besides, it's less fun to have two word conversations.

@Yonni: The reason that I never came begging to you is more of a testament to Russia. I was confident where I stood with him most of the game, regardless of the fact that you were working with him.

Yeah yonni, I normally have longer messages, but as I said, it takes me a while to type on this iPod...

Also, another major reason why I may have had short messages is cuz I do play live games, so we have a lot less Ike to talk, it is a lot like "ally on Germany? DMZ the channel?" then having enough time to coordinate and talk details... Guess I play too many live games, it's starting to affect my longer phase games.