Predictable trash. It has a headline the "white people" are more racist, blah blah blah....as if every INDIVIDUAL is more racist blah blah blah....

...and then proceeds to give us a bunch of statistics primarily about the legal system, and/or psychological studies that are not actually about racism.

But hell, calling all whites racist is all the rage these days, isn't it...so....little details, like being truthful and using the correct language to describe your study...what difference does that make...

If you are an average white person reading the article, chances are you are NOT the legal system....and therefore are not personally responsible for the outcomes of said legal system....and yet this article has called YOU a racist because of it.

Dishonest, race-baiting garbage....another article written for the purpose of DIVIDING people, rather than actually understanding them.

Utter and complete BS

Alternatively: Racism is a lot less common than you might think

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/apr/19/britain-uncovered-survey-attitudes-beliefs-britons-2015

A few eye-catching facts that may surprise people. Over half of ethnic minorities have NEVER experienced any racism in the work place. Over two thirds of ethnic minorities have experienced hardly any racism in the streets (with 1 in 4 never experiencing any racism in the streets period).

Clearly any racism that does happen is too much, but it is reassuring to note that my own observations of racism (that racist incidents are few and far between) reflects well the actual experiences of ethnic minorities.

Actually Krellin, if you read the whole article, you would have seen that it is not just crime statistics, but also studies involving individuals and their preceptiOn.

Though i find it hard to argue that crime statistics don't represent systemic rascism. Especially when you look at something like drug use vs drug convictions. Of violent crime incarceration lenghts.

Still you manage to argue against it, so i guess that means you're not a rascist? Or, wait, no, what? They also opened with a study of how rascist people 'think' they are... So the title of the article is pretty accurate. 'More rascist than they think'

@Oct, that is great to see. Though race isn't such a big factor in the UK class is - the riots of 2011 show that the UK isn't perfect, even if you're vastly better than the US when it comes to rascism. The same kind of behaviour, is it the same kind of underlying cause?? I don't honestly know.

Lol. This author is a total hypocrite. She's a blatant fucking racist herself! Try being white and getting an article published titled "10 ways black people are more X than they realize" where X is any negative trait or characteristic. See how people respond to that.

All of these titles are clearly racist:
* 10 ways black people are lazier than they realize
* 10 ways black people are more stupid than they realize
* 10 ways black people are more criminal than they realize
* 10 ways black people are more abusive than they realize
* 10 ways black people are more ignorant than they realize

No racism in this one though:
* 10 ways white people are more racist than they realize

Because, well, everyone knows it's not racism when it's directed against whites. Right?

Gotta side with the trolls on this one.

Obviously, pointing out racism is the real racist action, right?

...

Yeah, no.

It is when you say racism is a white thing. That's textbook racism and if you don't see that, you're part of the problem.

Obviously, racism against white people is the real solution to racism against black people, right?

...

Yeah, no.

"the trolls" (noun). Anyone who has an interest in truth and justice and is willing to argue and stand up for their principles.

Typical rubbish from Orathaic. Whine and whinge at white people because there's no point in criticizing non-whites because they are hopeless and nothing can be expected of them, right? mmmmm I smell racism stew.

I don't think you understand what racism is. It's the structural imbalance of power that's the issue here.

Who are you talking to?

To clarify: I agree that the structural imabalance of power is the issue here, but I'm not sure who doesn't understand what racism is according to you.

Hmm the structural imbalance of power

Can't you jerk off in private?

Please tell me when and where in human history of multi racial society there has not been a structural imbalance?

I guess when white people are at the bottom of every statistical measure you will be happy. I wish you luck in your glorious dream.

I have stopped using 'racist' for people. Many studies show that *everybody* is racist, including people of colour who discriminate against people of colour. And, for that matter, women discriminating against women. The much better term for that is 'prejudiced'. Everybody is prejudiced, and we have a moral obligation to try to become less prejudiced, and see people in all the variation that they have. And it's a goal none of us will every achieve.

Having said that, if you add up individual prejudices, a system can certainly become exclusive of certain groups, which I guess you can call 'racist'. There's tons of exclusionary mechanisms other than the blatant priviliged blocking the rights of the minority. It's much more subtle than that. Cumulative generations of deprivation, poverty, lack of education, and even self-exclusion, are in the way of tons of minorities, all over the world. (off topic: I tend to think most people are 'minority in some way, if only we could harness that!)

I was reading this great quote by MLK the other day, still apt:

"I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. "

I agree with a lot of the sentiment going around in this thread. I have a strong distaste with the way our culture operates where issues of race are concerned when:
Blacks who put together a TV station called Black Entertainment Television are demonstrating appropriate pride in their race
Whites who put together a TV station called White Entertainment Television are racist white supremecists.

Whites who attempt to demonstrate a similar pride in who they are become labeled as 'haters'.

I agree that this article fails to point out attitudes of minorities toward other races in an attempt to highlight the racism prevalent in others as well.

However, I also agree with the article that there is a prevalent racism within the white community that implies, or better still, calls for, me to examine myself in an effort to change that portion of society I am directly responsible for: me and my family.

Simply recognizing failures in this article diminishes my responsibility to check my own attitude examine myself seeking areas of short-coming, and make a personal change as needed.

@ORath " systemic rascism" What point of "SYSTEM" =/= "INDIVIDUAL".

If YOU yourself are just a mind-numbed moron that thinks and believes whatever the "system" tells you to believe, then YOU are part of the problem.

But please don't be so moronic as to actually believe that automatically represents the thoughts of *every* individual.

As someone above pointed out, everyone, to a certain extent is racist. A child, with no ability to yet have learned anything about race or learn bias -- i.e. an infant in a nursery -- displays favoritism towards those that look like himself. Is that wrong? Seems to me that is most likely an evolutionary survival instinct built into the brain.

Fuck, my parents raise chickens....guess what? Take 20 chickens all raised in the same pen, and when they start to differentiate into different appearances, they flock together, and exclude chickens with different appearance. Are chickens "racist"?

Fuck that.

That article is biased bullshit. the overwhelming majority of people go through their day treating people around them with indifference, *regardless* of the color of their skin.

I could just as easily write and article that shows the systemic bias AGAINST white in, say, the media. For example, a black individual is CLAIMED to have been killed by a white cop. IMMEDIATELY, the charges of murder are put forth in the media, white cops - and "white society" in general - are castigated as all being inherently racist. The media is ablaze with the story of white racism. When facts come out -- when not even the Federal government can find a reason to bring charges against the white cop, the story persists that white society is racist, and is repeated over and over....the dialogue of white racism is set in stone, REGARDLESS of facts on the ground, etc...

Now...take the other story....Black cop kills white suspect. Silence. Not reported. Didn't happen.

Clearly, wouldn't you say that, INSTITUTIONALLY, there is an extreme bias against white people? That in fact, as a society, we are racist AGAINST whites?


Of course my assertion is absurd, right? You all can start screaming now. But hey...it's just as valid as this bullshit biased study.

And the point?

The point is live YOUR fucking life. Don't be a fucking douchebag.

Here is something that 99.9% of people do: They walk into a store/restaurant/hire a contractor/etc and, REGARDLESS of the skin color of the person they are dealing with, they pay their bill, and move on with their life. 99.9% of people go about their day and do what they intended to do REGARDLESS of the color of the people around them. This bullshit nonsense that there is some deep rooted racism behind every action of every (and only) white people is long-dead mythology.

Perhaps all you people insisting this article are correct are people like Thucy -- people who think nobody not-white can survive without the white man's help -- people for whom racism is so inherently engrained upon your sad liberal soul that you automatically DISCOUNT anyone of color as incapable of success WITHOUT your white help....and THAT is the real racism - the racism of low expectations...

But most people do NOT live their lives that way, and do NOT think that people can't succeed because of their skin or gender.

Utter bullcrap...all of it. Yes....racism exists. Not denying that. But the extent to which it exists is FAR less prevalent than you apparently *wish*...and you *wish* it because you need a tragedy to cry about to make yourself feel important as you whine and moan and gnash your teeth over it....make yourself important because you express how deeply it moves your soul....

President and many cabinet members: Blacks and miorities
Supreme Court: Blacks and miorities in % approximating society
Sports: Skewed highly towards minorities in racial make-up
Entertainment: Skewed highly towards minorities in racial make-up

I can point out any number of facets of our society -- the places where people SPEND THEIR WEALTH --- which reflects their heart attitude --- that clearly demonstrate this assertion of prevalent racism is far less than you all wish it was.

Back in the, say, 1960's, a racist business owner would refuse to take a black man's money, and refuse to give money to a black man's business.

The very fact that cash flows just as easily...if not MORE so...to support minorities in area areas where we have a choice -- i.e. not necessities, like food and shelter; but our *free* wealth which we have a choice over how we spend it --- is another indicator that this mythological systemic racism doesn't exist to nearly the extent that you all wish it existed.

(And yes...you *wish* it to exist, so that you can have a problem to whine about...so that you can look down at others [either the minorities you *pity* in your own racist attitudes, or every other white man you judge {using your ESP} as racist simply by the color of their skin..] and make yourself feel superior.

1) "Fuck, my parents raise chickens....guess what? Take 20 chickens all raised in the same pen, and when they start to differentiate into different appearances, they flock together, and exclude chickens with different appearance. Are chickens "racist"?"

Maybe they are, maybe their behaviour is unjust. Maybe you can't see that. The point is human - not being chickens - can recognise injustice. If you can't recognise any injustices in current system perhaps you should be more careful going around calling people morons.

"Of course my assertion is absurd, right? You all can start screaming now. But hey...it's just as valid as this bullshit biased study."

Your assertion seems to be that when people call out white people on their rascism, this is rascist. Yes, utter bullshit, and unlike the article (actually not one study, many differet studies) our anecdot doesn't have any data to back it up.

That Black cops killing white kids doesn't cause uproar is a sign that it is not happening regulariy enough to form a pattern - when it becomes a problem, when white people are scared of it happening to them; then you will see them come out and demand better training (or fewer guns) for their police force.

Your anecdot proves only one thing. The rascism against white people, you know, the ones who hold most of the power in society to change things they see as problems, isn't a problem today.

"Utter bullcrap...all of it. Yes....racism exists. Not denying that. But the extent to which it exists is FAR less prevalent than you apparently *wish*"

It is so nice of you to tell us that rascism isn't a problem - while ignorin the voices of the minorities who are discriminated against. You of course know much better than them. Because you are part of the priviledged class who is used to being right and being listened to (whether you are right or not) You have a mindset of someone who is used to being agreed with, and can't possible accept another narrative or listen to voices which disagree with you.

Black people don't need me to save them, all they need is that we listen. Whether they are protesting in the streets, or taking court cases against the government. You don't seem to care, but then you're not really willing to 'not be a douchbag' if it actually costs you a single thing.

I'm not judging you by the colour of your skin, but by the quality of your character. And you're not coming off particularily well.

What krellin is trying to say in his... unique way is that it's fine if you call out racist white people for being racist, but if you call out white people in general for being racist only looking at colour to discriminate between racist and non-racist, you're part of the problem.

That's what I think he's trying to say, anyway.

I'd also be surprised if krellin isn't in fact a nice chap IRL.

Orathaic....I am not coming off particularly well? Why, because I don't pity a man and look down on him because of the color of his skin, as you obviously do? I don't come off well because I refuse to be lumped in with a study, and told that I am racist SIMPLY because of the color of my skin.

That you are too blatantly stupid to understand that calling someone racists SIMPLY because of the color of their skin is, inherently, a racist action, makes you unworthy to have a logical discussion with.

That I will do business with someone regardless of the color of their skin, that I will work alongside any man or woman, regardless of the color of their skin, makes me racist?

Please tell me, specifically, not in your generallized "I saw a study" bullshit, exactly how I am racist if, in my day to day walk, I treat each individual as an individual of equal potential. I only judge a man or woman when they begin to behave, and provide me evidence upon which to judge them - regardless of color.

I think my lilly-white brother is an asshole and a loser...and I wouldn't trust him with my spare change. Not because of his skin color, but because he demonstrates consistent failure when given trust.

On the other hand, my work place, which is probably at least 50% non-white, is a place of rather harmonious cooperation.

Your apparently limited view of the world is your problem, I would guess...and you insistence that biased studies, which are created and performed WITH AN AGENDA AND FOREGONE CONCLUSION, are you problem.

That you are too utterly dense to comprehend that labeling an INDIVIDUAL becuase of the action of a governent SYSTEM, is, in itself, a racist act - you judge ALL AS INDIVIDUALS by your PERCEPTION of a select minority of that group.


Your assertion that Black cop killing white kid doesn't happen enough to cause a stir is complete bullshit. In fact, Black person killed by White Cop is ALSO JUST AS RARE....which is why when it does happen, it is such a big deal. It is the ODDITY that makes the news, not the common event - depsite your asinine claim to the contrary.

You want to know where the REAL violence against blacks is found? It is found in BLACK ON BLACK crime...an event SO prevalent in these communities is doesn't get mentioned AT ALL.

You also ignore the fact that all of these protests against the supposed crimes by white cops against blacks are OFTEN DEMONSTRATED TO BE BASED UPON A LIE -- Sorry to tell you, pal, but Ferguson was a fucking LIE!!!! Even the damned Obama adminstration couldn't find a cause to charge the cop(s) with ANYTHING...and yet morons like you will persist in holding on to the lie that an actual white-on-black / cop-on-kid crime took place - because you are such a mindless, gullbile sheep *deperate* for a cause to scream about....desperate to place your priveledged white PITY on the minority that YOU LOOK DOWN UPON.

Further, I **never** said racism isn't a problem **at all**...of course it exists. I said that branding an entire set of people as racist because of the color of their skin is a fucking racist act, you blithering idiot. I said that all you need to do is open your fucking eyes and see that 99/9% of people spread their wealth -- i.e. make the choice -- amongst society regardless of the color of the people receiving their wealth. If we were such a racist society, then society would look far fucking different than it does. Again...maybe you are just so woefully fucking educated that you don't understand what it means to have separate drinking fountain, separate dorrs, etc for minoritites....maybe you are too woefully educated to understand that when this society FULLY embraced racism that you wouldn't see an Oprah, an Obama, a (pick you entertainer topping the charts), (pick your black business owner) etc.

You are just so sold on the idea that you MUST look down on the black man, that he is incapable of succeeding with you, that you refuse to see how far we have come. And why....because YOU are the racist. YOU are the one who, when looking at a black man, says "There goes a guy that can't succeed UNLES I (white boy) HELPS HIM... YOU are the fucking racist.

You people are all so white Lol

/\ Saith the King of Self-Loathing

Let me start this off with I am white... that is important. I understand the plight and systematic oppression of minorities. I have witnessed my siblings (half hispanic) and my cousins (half black) experience racism. I have seen numerous examples of the racism that afflicts my neighbors, my friends, and my family. I mean if you are denying it exists then you are ignorant to reality. Do I think that the answer to the system of racism is to regurgitate it back at the entire white community? No, that is just amplifying the problem, you breed angry and defensive white people who would rather destroy any notion of racism than work to solve the social problems facing our population; see the real strategy to progress is moderation. It may seem slow and may not be as sexy or appealing but it is what works. early 1800's people fought to free the slaves; then they freed the slaves. late 1800's early 1900's people fought to battle discrimination, segregation, and jim crow; then to an extent they succeeded. Today we are fighting for the economic and political equality of minorities; we will succeed but not via aggressive rhetoric or a complicated blame game. I mean do I hope my siblings will have the same opportunities as me, of course I do. I push my siblings to break out of this "ghetto" where we live every single day. This article is full of corollary statistics that don't prove a race wide racist attitude but rather prove a that a system of racism exists. Simply put, when anger gets a hold of a conversation especially one on the national level people will throw personal attacks. It IS racist to label an entire race as racist; it is NOT racist to label a system racist.

"Orathaic....I am not coming off particularly well? Why, because I don't pity a man and look down on him because of the color of his skin, as you obviously do? I don't come off well because I refuse to be lumped in with a study, and told that I am racist SIMPLY because of the color of my skin."

Not because you refuse to look down at them, because you refused to listen to their voices. I think i made that clear.

The point of the article was not that white people are 'more rascist' but that they precieve less rascism than the evidence suggests. That is what they think is wrong.

And by listening to the voice of marginalised individuals - who usually have less say in public/political/educational/media spaces - we can help start to improve things.

CommanderByron it sounds like your personal relationships mean you have heard their voices. And that is great.

As others posted above 'everyone is racist' - that isn't me painting white people as more racist, but if everyone is racist then we need to take a good damn look at the people most affected by this racism and listen to their voices.

The article i posted isn't about blame, or solutions to a problem - it is about awareness and recognising that a problem exists.

Krellin are you blind to the problem of race that exists in your country? To the poverty, the lack of educational attainment, the high rate of incarceration? The lower life expectancy? Are you ignorant of the protests? The voices which go unheard - until their anger boils over into violence, like in Baltimore? Are you even reading what i am saying, rather than assuming you know because others have talked about it before? (I don't recall once suggesting we look down with pity on anyone)

Orath - I'm not blind to anything, I just reject your unilateral solution that every problem in the world is directly atrtributed to the notion that every white person is racist by the fact of their white skin. Your very assertion is racist.

You want to talk about poverty - let's talk about poverty. I'll show you the out-of-wedlock birth rate in various racial communties inthe country. I'll show your the birth rates for single mothers, and the number of fathers per family in various racial communities...and then let's talk about poverty in relationship to the generalized behavior of individuals of those comunities.

It isn't white people forcing black fathers to spew their seed everywhere they can and then abandon the family....but the black community is overwhelmed with this problem. You don't think that THIS, and not racism, might be a major contributing factor to poverty in black America? A lack of family?

Ahhh....but to have a discussion about morality....what is actually right and wrong (supporting your child versus disappearing....)....ahhh....that would make me a racist, huh? To dare cast judgement on the pathetic losers that do such things?

Oh....and, let's be clear....this behavior happens in non-black communities as well. And....GASP!!! Guess what?!?! Single parent households where the father abandons children causes poverty REGARDLESS off race. And therefore...

BOOM....we have a data point we connect. Lack of father in the household, regardless of race contributes to poverty. BLACK families ---- all on their own....it is their OWN deicsion. --- have, by far, the largest problem in this particular area.

So....who's fucking fault is it that the black family suffers from poverty?

Fuck you and your racist bullshit, Orath. YOU, my self-loathing fool, are not actually the problem, not am I, or Thucy.

Most black familes that I know - FAMILIES - with Mom and Dad in the picture...going to the same schools as my kids, working in jobs next to me and my wife - they get along just fine in society, becuase they have made PERSONAL CHOICES to do what they need to do. Go to school, stay in school, get good grades, incur a little debt to go to college, get a good job, keep the family together even when things get tough.

But....fools like you....self-loathing assholes would look at my coworkers, and my kids' friends in school, and you would be the racist asshole that asks them to pat YOU on the back for helping them succeed, instead of acknowledging that they, as INDIVIDUALS, made the CHOICE to be successful.

It is a complete and utter lie that a black man cannot succeed in this country.

It is a truth that poverty makes it difficult for ANYONE to succeed...but poverty isn't tied to skin color, my idiotic friend. Poverty is very often tied to personal choices, and generational "culture" that passes on an accepance of failure. And....it is EXACTLY self-loathing racists like you, with your **expectation** that black men will fail WITHOUT your help - that perpetuates the myth that a black man is helpless and put down in this country. YOU put them down by telling them they cannot succeeed without you. And they put THEMSELVES down by buying into your lie, and by making bad choices.

You act like the media-perpetuated anger in Baltimore is valid. It's bullshit. 70% out-of-wedlock birth rate in Baltimore. Of course there is fucking pvoerty! Asssholes *BURNING DOWN THEIR OWN CITY* and then....a month from now...they will bitch about not having jobs. SELF-INFLICTED WOUND.

And...let's be clear...the cops did NOT kill the felon they had in the back of the van....it is reported by the medical examiner and by the other passenger in the back of the van that he *self-inflicted* his wound....it was unintentional suicide!! And yet every race-baiting asshole like you will utterly deny the truth of the medical examiners report, because you actually *want* it to be a "racist cop" so that you can perpetuate your feigned outrage and pretend you are noble because you "care".

If you cared, you'd be telling the black community to stop having kids out of wedlock, to stop dropping out of school, to stop doing things that damage themselves. But no....to actually offer a suggestion on how to improve themselves by a CHOICE of actions would be too racist for you. Better to just sit on the sideline, telling everyone how racist they are while you twiddle your thumbs in vexation, pretending this is an unsolvable problem, but certain that you and all your white kin are to blame.

Moron.

And now I'm muting this thread - having some self-loathing moron tell every white person he's guilty of a sin of racism simply because of the color of his sin is a bunch of hypocritical bullshit. Feel free to keep perpetuating racism by accusing all the black men in the world they cannot succeed without your help, you pieces of racist crap. I, and most people like me, defeat racism by living our lives as decent people, and doing business with whomever stands in front of us selling a product or service we desire. We fight racism by *refusing* to participate in it, and telling everyone we know that it is their *personal* choice to succeed, and I can neither help you, nor hurt you.

Be your own fucking man.

You people are all so white Lol

'Orath - I'm not blind to anything, I just reject your unilateral solution that every problem in the world is directly atrtributed to the notion that every white person is racist by the fact of their white skin. Your very assertion is racist.'

Good to hear you reject the very idea you put forward as being mine - as opposed to listening to what i said. Very useful.

'Oh....and, let's be clear....this behavior happens in non-black communities as well. And....GASP!!! Guess what?!?! Single parent households where the father abandons children causes poverty REGARDLESS off race. And therefore...'

Correlation does not imply causation.

It is equally true to say poorer individuals are more likely to have broken families - and this spread more poverty. The fact that this is true outside of the US where we didn't have the same decades of repression, slavery goes to show that it is a feature of poverty not being black. ( even if i can't show you which causes the other )

But guess what, a higher percentage of black people in america live in poverty, why?

History.

'I, and most people like me, defeat racism by living our lives as decent people, and doing business with whomever stands in front of us selling a product or service we desire.'

And you can't undo history like this; you can ignore it, but that doesn't make it go away.

" We fight racism by *refusing* to participate in it, and telling everyone we know that it is their *personal* choice to succeed, and I can neither help you, nor hurt you."

Of course this is a lie. You can not succeed by personal choice alone.

The measures of success in out society are ever changing, by the gap between rich and poor is getting wider - especially in America - the Land of the Free - so called, creates a lie in the American Dream; which is all Krellin is perpetuating.

Despite being the best educated generation ever, we also have the ones who are fairing the worst in finding employment - the worst for debt which they can't pay... The system is very broken, and all the bullshit blindness in the world will not make that any less true.

Krellin is just providing an exemplar of everything the article is talking about.

Article: "Hey, a lot of people think racism doesn't exist, but systemic unconscious racism really does - here's a bunch of examples."

Krellin: "OMG how dare you call me a racist there not really racism it's all actually other things like class/wealth/everything except racism."


Err, suuuurrree.