Any chance of staying on topic this time?

Goldfinger is right, a lot of the 4chan opinions are of course trolling and should be enough to discredit them. I wonder if trolls realise everyone only pays attention because they find them laughable and sometimes shocking. People don't give them attention because they agree with them

I totally agree with Lando.

Al's contempt for women was the subject of several threads he created, early in his membership of this site, which some may have forgotten, but I certainly havent.

I am not willing to accept that Al is trolling. Some people genuinely *do* hold the disgusting view that women are generally inferior to men. Those people need to fuck off. I think that Al is one of those people.

@ ANimac - we *are* on topic. "Attacks on women" is literally the subject of the thread. Al has made attacks on women, and it's perfectly on-topic for Lando, myself, or others to challenge his attitude.

"Poorly designed. I failed on the first question, "Do you think all people are equal?" No, of course not. Some are smarter, some are stronger, some have other gifts. Do I think all people have equal rights? Yes. But that isn't what it asked."

I have to agree with agree with dipplayer's assessment there...

"Does me being stronger than you make us actually unequal? Or does it just mean we have different attributes."

It means both of those things, Thucy?

It means we're unequal in strength, but equal on the whole in a legal and personal sense?

I agree with dipplayer, the question should've been worded differently.

I agree with Lando and Jamiet. I find Al's posts regarding women to be extremely offensive, far more so than numerous posts by others that have led to silencing or banning. Whether the posts express his genuine attitudes or they are his attempt at sarcastic humor, they are vile. I am not surprised in the least by how much he values the protection of his privacy.

"You don't think it's somewhat shameful to keep company with women?"

You don't think it's shameful you're asking--no, wait, of course you don't, you're Al.

"Are women your intellectual equals?"

How dare you insult women's intellect like that! :p

"Do women *get* you? Do you *relate* to women better than to your fellow men?"

On the whole...yes? I've said that before, that I find women more engaging to talk with, and therefore enjoy and share their company far more than with fellow men (hence why, you know, my friends are women by a vast majority, including just about every close friend?)

Unless it's something sex-specific (like, you know, their discussing their "time of the month") I feel more at ease and usually more rewarded talking with women than men...I again think they're better conversationalists (the ones I've met, at least), have better and more developed communication skills on the whole and, most importantly of all, seem to share far more of my interests; the only thing I can think of a higher percentage of my male friends share in terms of interest than my female friends would be sports, and even that, not so much, since a ton of women I know love their sports with a fiery passion and will wear their team colors loud and proud. :)

Other than that? Literature, classical music, art, any number of things I rant on about here...it's just my experience that more women than men in my setting are passionate and like to talk at length about such things, and do so in a way I find interesting, or talk about themselves and their lives that's interesting. The majority of US college grads now are women, and that number's especially high among English and Humanities students, so...yeah...

Besides all the other reasons I could list why I in general trend towards the company of women over men, that'd probably be a big one of them.

Men and women are equal in terms of human merit...

I just happen to have spent more of my near-adult and adult life around women, have a major that's majority-women in terms of student population (professor-wise it's been about 50/50, my sister has a ton of male friends because she's a Math major and that's a male-dominated major at our college.), and so for that and other reasons I just prefer the company of women...they don't "get" me more (what's there to get, lol?) it's just a generalized preference.

(On a totally besides-the-point--even more so than usual--and only semi-serious point...when different female friends of mine talk to one another, it's ALWAYS more animated and fun to watch than any of my male friends...I love the energy present there...if we could somehow harness the energy from a trinity of women talking excitedly about anything for half hour on end, we'd solve any and all power crises, I'm convinced!) :p

You guys are ready to feed Swedgin to Wu's pigs.

Obi, I think you're missing your own point. Why are you comparing men and women on broad categories like conversation skills and enjoyment of sports? The idea is that these are human traits and don't depend on gender.

Al was clearly just being a jerk toward Obi for saying he had lots of women as friends. There was very little clever sarcasm there at all, and it was mean-spirited if he meant it that way.

Point is that Emma Watson put out the word for men to call other men out when they behave badly. Punks hiding behind keyboards are the new bane to society.

I don't think that is clear at all, Jeff. You only joined this site a few months ago. You haven't seen some of the awful stuff Al has said about women in the past.

All human traits depend on gender. It is a biological imperative.
Vive la différence!

"All human traits depend on gender."

What?

My point is that Al wanted to take down Obi for admitting that he had lots of women as friends, as a proxy against women in general. Al doesn't deserve a pass for that at all.

Okay, sorry, we're kinda on the same side, in as much as you're critical of Al too - I misunderstood you slightly. Al wanted to take down obi because obi was supporting women, and Al hates women.

Why does anyone take anything on 4chan seriously...

Why wouldn't all human traits depend on gender? Our hormones are different. They affect our maturation differently. Our chromosomes are different. Women can bear children; men can't.

That's not to say that one human should be treated differently from another under the law for their physical characteristics, but we can't ignore that differences exist.

JT, I think we understand each other. I've got daughters of my own, and I am disgusted by 4chan's stunts.

"Why are you comparing men and women on broad categories like conversation skills and enjoyment of sports? The idea is that these are human traits and don't depend on gender."

I agree they don't, which is why I added the qualifiers of AT MY COLLEGE and IN MY EXPERIENCE.

Just talking about the people I know, rather than the sexes as a whole.

I <3 Emma Watson

Right, but your discussion is irrelevant. The people you have found that have similar interests/social activities to you have mostly been women. This is not relevant to anything at all and your discussing implies that you are trying to see men and women as different or unequal, which is the point most of us are trying to argue against.

+Unequal?
No.
Different?
That's nature vs. nurture and while I lean towards the latter, the former probably has some effect as well...

What's more, I'm not speaking about women/men as a group so much as I am speaking about them in a specific setting--college--where the data backs up my statement when I say the majority of overall grads are now women, and the majority of Lit and Humanities majors are women.

It WOULD be unequal to say "Because women are "naturally better" in those fields," or "Men are naturally better at Math, hence their dominating that field."

It IS still valid, however, and relevant given the specific question of my having mostly female friends...

When most of the co-workers at your job are female, or most people in an area that share your basic artistic interests are female...

That does not mean 1. Females are better/more incline to that job/those interests, or that 2. This is the universal condition of women everywhere, it simply means 3. For you, yourself, in that specific workplace...you're probably likely going to have majority-female friends.

With the nationwide stats, I COULD argue 4. Perhaps this is less of a one-time thing and more of a trend given the statistics about who dominates which majors in college in the USA, but that'd again only tell us a trend, and NOT innate nature.

Trends are just that, trends, they can change (and have, in this case)...
To suggest its innate nature would be to suggest men and women are naturally unequal in this regard.

Instead, I'm just pointing out a trend among a subset of certain men and women as one reason why I probably have mostly female friends, and in that context alone, I think that's valid.

" Do women *get* you? Do you *relate* to women better than to your fellow men?"

Speaking for myself. I don't consider you a fellow man. I don't *get* you. And I don't consider you an equal in any category that matters.

Given the amount of technology and gender/sex change therapy methods we have, the terms boy and girl hardly represent biologically male and biologically female anymore. It's an interesting subject to delve into, but anymore it seems like most people that don't understand that are of an older demographic.

But Obi does try to go out of his way to point out that his friends are women. He's pointed this out about as many times as Al has made disparaging comments about women. It's as if we're supposed to be impressed.

@Jeff,

Thank you for offering to intervene.

I think your take on events is kind of one-sided. Obiwan himself has taken sides in a dangerous struggle. I am singling him out for white-knighting a cause that has long suffered from too many white knights. Did he not want to be ridiculed for his effeminate views? He could have remained quiet. I certainly won't complain about people challenging my views.

Rather, I think my views challenge people.

No, they don't.

They're not views. Calling them views is like calling a series of belches a symphony. It's just hatred.

Al's "views" challenge people to resist vomiting.

Perhaps Al has webdip confused for Redpill?