This multi-account/meta-gamer hunting is getting a little crazy, and no one seems to be following the rules of leaving the name of the accused out of the first post.

I don't know if the mods can tweak the webpage quickly/easily, but I think it would help alot if the suggested forum etiquette were included in the FAQ's section on multi/meta issues.

That not leaving in the first post isn't a rule as such, its more a view of some peoples (including myself) that has developed into the norm.
As for the hunting gone crazy - there are a lot of comments about it true, but equally consider how many users there are that *don't* get commented about! If you want to make a comment directly to one of us you can email, but the forum is here for this after all.

correct me if I am wrong but meta gaming is technically not breaking the rules.

Its a controversial subject...

Meta-gaming is cheating... it's not "technically not breaking the rules", it's cheating, and when people are that blatant about it, they deserve to get notified on.

Also, I notice cheating Zeus68 isd in two games with germ... something or other. They were acting very oddly in the middle section of one game I was in with them. It now looks as if they have agreed to go into another one together.

That isn't fair.

Thats cause they are related i know germ in real life they are nephew and uncle. They work together most of the time so that its practically multi-accounting. im in a game with u too submariner and i agree with u and germ is in like 5 games with me 2-3 also with zeus68

I wasn't trying to discourage people from posting complaints altogether, but I was under the mistaken impression that such things were a violation of an informal site policy. (And it seemed like it might be better to formalize it, avoiding the recent pattern of various mods/forum members showing up and chastising the accuser for not being more discrete.)

And you're right that the number of accused is a small number compared to the total number of members.. And I don't want to be hijacking Submariner's thread, nor am I trying to cast doubt on his specific complaint..

However, I'm just a little worried about these complaints becoming a dominant feature of the one and only forum. Their conspicuousness might influence newer members, skewing their perspective of the site and of the frequency of these issues. Such a trend could lead to an ever increasing number of (increasingly unsubstantiated) complaints.

Combined with the apparent trend to post the name of the accused in the first post, this seems like a recipe for an ugly slanderous zeitgeist of witch-huntey proportions. :p

I'm new here so I don't know the norm for anything.. but I'm just saying.. it seems like an ugly trend.. and it's often best to curb these bad habits before they become overly popular.

This is why, as I suggested in my FAQ update, that we suggest accusers email the mods instead of creating witch hunts and flame wars on the forum.

For the record:
I think it might actually be a good thing if there was a formal place for people to list these complaints. It might get ugly and slanderous, but it might also be the best way for the community to self regulate and discourage this sort of behavior.

I'm just not sure if the one and only forum should be the place for such a list.

@Centurian:
Ideally, I think a discrete approach like that would be best.

However, there are only a few mods who are volunteering their time. Posting in the forums has an advantage in that it invites other people to take ther own time to review games and collect evidence, which might make things easier for the mods. (for Multi-accounting, for example)

Also, with the meta gaming and other more 'grey' issues, it might be difficult for the mods to really investigate and punish players. Rather than asking mods to spend countless hours reviewing player histories and looking for patterns where they always play with certain other people and always work with them, it might be better if such a thing really was a community driven witch hunt.. though I agree that it would become a mess.

It's also why the forum could be re-designed into a more traditional layout with a "how to" section such as "how to complain about a cheat" being in the same place so people don't have to keep posting here.

that's not a very smart way to deal with the issue.

he will read this, be angry at you and ruin your game.

the best would be to email a mod, instead of dealing with this publicaly. If you want time to find a replacement, find an excuse to pause the game, so he gets banned without disrupting the flow of the game

Joseph Stalin, you say you know them in real life? Could you let them know that metagaming is not allowed? You could tell them in the games as well. You're allowed to play with people you know in real life, but you have to be ready to stab them like you would any other player or you put other players at an unfair disadvantage that can ruin games. If you don't think you can do this, you'll have to refrain from playing games together. Cross-board gaming is also not allowed in regular game play.

Why is he still playing? Isn't this form Of cheating taken seriously?

When a game is banned it pauses the game for you so that's ok

"but you have to be ready to stab them like you would any other player or you put other players at an unfair disadvantage that can ruin games"

I never post and this is kinda a thread hijack but I am just curious and not sure where to ask. I play with a lot of people I know from other forums and from real life. I also seek out game long alliances, usually from the start of a game and so far haven't stabbed an ally. Sometimes with friends, sometimes with strangers, it just depends on the countries.

Is that an unfair advantage? I am only asking because your post was copy-pasted to our private forum and someone is upset that so far I always make game-long alliances and go for a draw. Since the website uses points per supply center it encourages this, so....

The problem most people have is with pre-game collusion, whereby you enter a game with an alliance already. There is a big difference between this and seeking out a game-long alliance after the game has started (even if from the first move). In former case you have an advantage over all the other players before the game has even started; in the latter, you may seek a game-long alliance, but you have to use your diplomacy skills to make sure this happens, and even then there are no guarantees.

lol i told germ in real life and he is mad lol

Hibiskiss, you are fine making in game, game long alliances. Although some peole hate when others play for a draw, it is a legit form of play.

Again... He's still playing... WHY?

@Submariner: There is no facility for the moderators to ban this guy just because he is metagaming. Metagaming is NOT against the rules of this site at present. If he hasn't broken the rules, he can't be banned. If you check the FAQ you'll see it makes it clear that metagaming is 'frowned upon' but is NOT against the rules.

To clarify, the FAQ currently says:

"Meta-gaming is usually frowned on, but is acceptable in some cases and not seen as being as bad as multi-accounting."

@Hibiskiss - So long as you treat friends and strangers alike on this site then you are not violating any rules (formal or not).

Too bad Submariner cannot read.

I play on the same computer as someone else, I dont want to get banned

The data used to tell whether someone is a multi-accounter is a lot more thorough than just IPs. More evidence than just having the same IP is needed for a ban.
However if you know the other player well you may want to avoid playing in games with them, or you'll have an unfair advantage. You should at least let the other players in the game know that you know the other player in real life.

@dangermouse - what if I stab my friends even more than strangers? :-)

Furthermore, germ was playing this game for 2 weeks before he talked me into joining. There are already a couple players I met though this game who I know to be honorable and if I were in a game with them I would trust them and others I would not.

why dont we just get along jeez......lol germ freakin funny name.........ha......stop cheating!!!!!!!

'There are already a couple players I met though this game who I know to be honorable and if I were in a game with them I would trust them and others I would not.'

whoops -

Not only is that technically meta gaming but ur gonna get beaten the shite out of that way - even if u trust based on other games, most people dn't they take each game seperately and would stab u if they had a chance.

just thought i'd point that out

So he admits he was persuaded into a game...

Really, why is he still allowed to play?!

Again, because what he's done isn't officially against the rules. I agree it should be against the rules, but it isn't. So he can still play.

Zeus68, please refrain from metagaming. If you're going to play with friends you have to be prepared to treat them like any other player. If you don't think you can do this, you'll have to refrain from playing games with them. The more you metagame, the more the community stews in anger, and the more the community stews in anger, the more likely it is that a precedent will be set. =/

Hibiskiss, while I don't very much like people who get into alliances with the aim of carrying through until the very end (unless they're with me, and aren't suspecting my stab), it is not the same as metagaming because the alliance did not happen pre-game. It's fine to do it once the game has started because every other player has an equal chance of using diplomacy to form long term alliances or break up yours.

So he admits he was persuaded into a game...

Really, why is he still allowed to play?!

You really can't read Submariner. Maybe your name should be subthought.

Yes, germ was playing phpdiplomacy for two weeks and told me it was a cool game and I should play too.

I admit it, that's what happened.

No wonder you have 0 points LOL.

BTW, the game description says, if you act dishonorably, you will get a reputation and no one will trust you.

God not another "site rules/FAQ" pedant. Zeus68, you are about to force the mods to set a precedent. Read 1 800 Sniffy's similar attitude and see how close he came. But he has apologized and promised not to do it again. He did lose the Sniffy account though and basically had to start over. Chrisp has warned you. He is a mod and I would listen to him.

if there wasnt the names in the forums how will the accused tell their escuses (I say this half sarcasticly)