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denis (864

)
25 Jan 10 UTC

*Sigh* blind following...

After getting into an arguement with my parents over religon and the true point of the bible, my father read me a sermon from a famous preist it truely said the following ( inside):

denis (864 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

In the late 1700's the Russian land was plauged with the philosophies of Voltaire and other French philosopher s of the so called "enlightenment" era. Russian became ashamed of there nation and traditional ways and out of this began to condemn God. This I all because we listened to Voltaire and other French philosophers. So we must ignore intelect and following Christ. If someone ask," why do you follow God when so and so says this" you must shake them off and follow God. Be like the sheep of a shepard. Be child like and become more simple and ignore philosophy, follow Christ like a child!

This was after I argued that the point of the bible isn't what happened who it happened to or when it happened but the morals. Ignore all the details those are all ways to pass the story along all in all and make it easy to understand. That most likely none of it happened but after stories being passed along people decided to write it down and thus came the compilation of stories we call the bible, a story with characters and events like anyother. And this passage that blatantly tells me to blindly follow the church and Christ ( I forgot to put in a detail it also condemned sects) is supposed to change my opinion? It tells me to follow blindly like a member of a sect! It tells me to be ignorant!
Honestly I can't deal with the ignorance of my parents any longer!!!!!!!!!

Acosmist (0 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

Did you ever read my paper?

Bananenrepublikaner (100 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

You take the blue pill and the story ends. You wake in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe.You take the red pill and you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes.

Fool or get fooled.

Maniac (189 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

Ignorance is bliss, if your parents are blissfully happy that is good. If you are happier being enlightened that is also good.

If you are unhappy that is bad :(

Find what makes you happy, if that involves some sort of intellectual ignorance that's fine.

Triskelli (146 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

I hate that phrase, "Ignorance is Bliss". Ignorance is fear; fear of the unknown, fear of change, fear of the new.

ottovanbis (150 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

Denis I feel sorry for you, that your parents are like this.

Hamish (579 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

If you like being ignorant and following blindly, by all means go ahead. But please stop voting for presedential candidates who are just as ignorant and blind.

The_Master_Warrior (10 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

Beats voting for presidents who have no knowledge of either the concept of hyperinflation or the concept of national debt. America is on the way to becoming the next Zimbawe, thanks to Pelosi and Pals.

The_Master_Warrior (10 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

I also feel sorry for your parents. If they're trying to convert their stubborn-as-hell son, they shouldn't do it so bluntly. The most they can do is encourage you to convert. No one can force you. They're wasting their time. They'd be better off flying to some third-world country and trying to convert people.

All they're trying to do is save your soul from hell.

The_Master_Warrior (10 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

That being said, you're just as ignorant as they are. The Bible is not some odd collection of myths; it is the word of God.

figlesquidge (2131 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

Do you think that the bible is 100% literal truth then TMW? 7 day creation etc etc?

Thucydides (864 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

Haha yeah... personally I don't talk with my parents much about religion, and when I do, I just act like I'm the same kind of Christian I was when I was a kid. These days its quite a lot more complicated, but like I said I just skirt the subject. One of these days its gonna come to a head and really kick me in the ass though, I expect, when I bring a non-Christian girl home and try to justify my relationship with her.

(Not so easy to get around that bullshit "do not be yoked with non-believers" verse. Like, come on!)

Stukus (2126 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

I'm lucky. My family is pretty apathetic about the whole thing. My mother was angry when she found out I was atheist, but only for like, 2 minutes. Then she was cool with it.

Nostradumass (119 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

@denis - you could always counter with Luke 14:26. "If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple." Tell him you love him too much to start believing.

`ZaZaMaRaNDaBo` (1922 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

Your parents obviously didn't go to evangelism school.

Jack_Klein (897 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

Ah, the Master Warrior pipes up with his patented blend of ignorance, false righteousness, and whatnot.

You know who else believes their holy book gives them all the answers, and that they alone are in possession of the true and holy path? Radical Islamists. Why don't you follow their sterling example and go get yourself killed. If only we could arrange for all the people who believe their particular half-mad scribblings from ancient times are the one and true that to kill each other all off, I think the rest of the sane people in the world would be well off.

We are both atheists about most of the gods and goddesses that humanity has believed in. I just take it the next step, and go for 100 percent.

DJEcc24 (246 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

thats good denis that you can;t stand that ignorance. i do not agree with your parents even though i am a Christian. Christians should question their faith. it helps it grow. if you just blindly follow then that isn;t very helpful to your own faith. as far as the bibles authenticity i might suggest some books by lee strobel. Most of all a Case for Christ by Lee Strobel. pretty good information. written by an atheist who from his research believed in Jesus as the messiah etc...

just a book suggestion. We aren;t all ignorantly beliveing. Some research

figlesquidge (2131 )
25 Jan 10 UTC

I would support that recommendation, is an interesting read.
Also, there are a number of good books by Christian authors on "if there's a god, why is there suffering". Some of these may be of interest to you

the.dibster (100 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Big Brother says: War is Peace. Freedom is Slavery. Ignorance is Strength.

denis (864 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Okay so I'm talking old testement especially as a book of morals not truth. For example Job....
He had everything then his house burned down his children killed and livestock diminished. Thi story is meant as a way to teach not to take things for granted and the judean scholars that wrote it pretty much compiled all the shit that could happen to you into the story thus creating a way to teach a moral and show what you can lose. At least that is what I believe. Even God and the Devil can be simply replaced by humbleness and selfishness.

denis (864 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

This*

DJEcc24 (246 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Job is an interesting book to choose. thought to be the oldest book written in the bible. even has some mentions of what are thought to be dinosaurs. Fro all we know that could of happened to Job. but it coudl also be a story as well. but thats not the point. Christianity places its belief on Jesus being the Christ and being resurected. what if Job is just a story? then it tells us soem very good morals. but it jsut beign a story doesn;t disprove Jesus being the Christ. after all Jesus did tell alot of parables so why woudl it be so bad if Job was just a big parable. i do however believe it happened. but the old testament is a tricky subject.

denis (864 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Well Christians also base there belief on the fact that there is God and Lucifer, heaven and he'll. And so the fact that this is suposed to be the word of god would be disproven if it was just a story...

DJEcc24 (246 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

not saying the entirety of the bible is a story. but some of it is. If the entire bible was a story then yes you would be correct. but there are alot of proofs to the authenticity of the bible. i do belive that Job is a true story. i mean why wouldn't it be? but seriously i would reccomend the book i said above. it coudl better answer alot of your questions. heck i'd even buy it for you and send it out to cali for yah. i'm sure your folks would buy it too.

denis (864 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Well DJEcc24 you just disproved yourself. Assuming Job is the oldest story in the bible that would mean there's a near 100 percent chance people didn't go around writing things like this down when most of the people in the bible at the time were nomads. And the fact that god and the devil have a significant role in this probably means it's a folk story that some people made up to teach a moral and if it is made up then God and the Devil are fictional character's

DJEcc24 (246 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

oldest as in pre moses writing genesis time. when there were civilizations all around. In Job there are a bunch of references to towns and civilization. doesn't sound nomadic at all. i probably have contradicted myself here and there but hey i'm a 16 year old not an expert on theology. i just enjoy readin up on it. i've already said my suggestions for books by better scholars than myself.

and language and forms of writing have been around before Moses. Someone had to of invented means of writing before Egyptians rule while moses was alive.

denis (864 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Well people didn't just write things down in many places scholars were the only one who new how to write...

DJEcc24 (246 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

denis your reasoning and mine have both probably been incorrect on some of this. i still have research on it to do and so do you. just think abotu reading a Case for Faith , and A case for Christ by lee strobel. thats all i really have to say. and hey figles agrees its a good read and he's a witty fellow! thats teh last time i'm going to suggest the book by the way i imagine my suggesting has been gettign on your nerves. i just find this subject very interesting.

The_Master_Warrior (10 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

I do not take the Bible literally, or else I WILL end up like the ragheads, killing Jews and blacks and whatnot. And I would never do that. Laugh at tasteful jokes? Yes. Kill? No. I firmly believe that God uses metaphors and similies liberally.

wydend (0 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

@TMW: Your ignorance makes me nauseous. You are the kind of person that gives Christians a bad name. The belief that all Muslims are radicals and extremists is absurd. I think there are just as many extremist Christians as Muslims. I also noticed that one of the most open anti-Semitic people was Martin Luther, and last time I checked, he wasn't a "raghead."

Crazy Anglican (1067 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

"Why don't you follow their sterling example and go get yourself killed. If only we could arrange for all the people who believe their particular half-mad scribblings from ancient times are the one and true that to kill each other all off, I think the rest of the sane people in the world would be well off."

Thanks Jack, you just answered a question I heard posed by Christopher Hitchens. It went something like this "Imagine an evil spoken by somone of your particular faith that would not be shared by an atheist. Now can you imagine an evil spoken by an atheist that could not be shared by a theist?"

You just did it. No theist wants all other theists dead. Even the ones who are looking forward to the end of days (which is not the death of all people in Revelations) are looking forward to eternal life. As a matter of fact. I haven't heard anyone on this forum, theist or atheist, wish anyone dead before now.

ottovanbis (150 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

wishing someone dead gets you no where though. eternal life is a fallacy btw, but you keep on believing what you are fed

Iceray0 (266 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

I like boobies :D

Crazy Anglican (1067 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

I agree that Jack shouldn't be wishing people dead. I'm a little shocked that the atheists on the site didn't shout that one down pretty quickly. We have all been a pretty peaceful polite crowd.

Crazy Anglican (1067 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Me too. btw Iceray ;-)

Iceray0 (266 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Hey Crazy! didn't we have a huge theological debate awhile ago? Boobies are awesome!

Acosmist (0 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

"Did you ever read my paper?"

Quoted because I wanted an answer, tia.

DJEcc24 (246 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

i'm curious what is this paper?

denis (864 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Oh right...no but I will. I have 3 books to read so I will try assoon as possible

ottovanbis (150 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

which paper?

`ZaZaMaRaNDaBo` (1922 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

"thats good denis that you can;t stand that ignorance. i do not agree with your parents even though i am a Christian. Christians should question their faith. it helps it grow. if you just blindly follow then that isn;t very helpful to your own faith. as far as the bibles authenticity i might suggest some books by lee strobel. Most of all a Case for Christ by Lee Strobel. pretty good information. written by an atheist who from his research believed in Jesus as the messiah etc...

just a book suggestion. We aren;t all ignorantly beliveing. Some research"

That is a very good book. I received it for Confirmation. It really shows the true meaning of how a Christian is supposed to show how Faith in God works in a real, growing relationship with him. Denis, your parents seem to be ignorant of the message behind the teachings. That's fine, but it won't go far saying that 'that's that'.

Iceray0 (266 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

I eat babies

Acosmist (0 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

So your opinion was reached before a familiarity with the facts and arguments. Hm. Not much of an opinion, then, right? I mean, it could be TRUE, but it couldn't be JUSTIFIED, and thus it couldn't be knowledge (justified true belief). But, I suppose, the point was never to know the truth, it was to throw a fit and rag on your parents. Success!

Other people - a seminar paper of mine on Kant's philosophy of religion. I sent it to denis some time ago.

Iceray0 (266 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

No, my opinion was reached due to the fact I ate a baby and it tasted good.

Acosmist (0 )
26 Jan 10 UTC

Real babyback ribs?

45 replies

johnfoxarmy (100

)
25 Jan 10 UTC

LIVE GAME START SOON

http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=20030

53 replies