Putin, I'm not a libertarian. And I actually don't know a thing about that whole theory. Education and Magic Johnson scared people off.

Wouldn't that tell you that the ones who do are going to stick together, krellin, through thick and thin?

@putin, librarian or not it scared the bel out of us! Librrache ... Dead. Gomer Pyle ... Dead. Rock Hudson ... Dead. Fred Mercury ... Dead. Easy E ... Dead. Then Magic got it and lived ... And is still alive. Maybe it was Magic's non-death that started bringing the age down again.

100% of marriages that don't end in divorce end in death.

bo_sox48, you're so naive. You and your friends' relationships may seem solid now, but they almost certainly are not. Like I said, I only know of two from my class still together. Rearranging your life over a high school boyfriend or girlfriend is a sure-fire way to limit how successful you can later be in life.

@abgemacht: I've been through college, and I disagree with you. "Breaking the relationship before in a healthy manner, imho, shows maturity and wisdom" -- No, breaking a successful relationship just because you're entering a new phase of life shows a lack of faith in the relationship. What shows maturity and wisdom is to have an open and frank discussion about the transition and how each of you feel about it. There's absolutely nothing wrong with heading into the transition with eyes wide open, both of you striving to achieve your mutual goal of making it work. The vast odds are that it will not work out, and both of you should recognize that. That doesn't mean you should automatically call it off, because on rare occasions it does work out.

Every relationship, every life decision involves a road not taken. This is just one more fork in the road. You can start dating someone when you're in college, then one of you has to decide about a year studying abroad. Or where to go to grad school. Or where to take a first job. There are always going to be new situations, new temptations, new opportunities. Most relationships fail no matter when you start them. Every successful relationship started somewhere.

valar morghulis

A naive high schooler... can I rephrase for a moment? Thanks.

"bo_sox48, you're so naive." >>>> change it up >>>> "bo_sox48, you're completely normal."

@abge ... Abgemacht. Going to a school close because of someone else ids a bad idea.to clarify, that's not why I went close. I went close because I always knew I wanted to be a Sun Devil! I was going to go to ASU Regardless of who I was with. Of course I didn't have great grades in HS, what with all the underage sex going on, so I was prey much destined for a state school in AZ, and of the 3, ASU was top of my list (fuckt the Wild Cats!). If I even had a shot at MIT or Cal Tech, I would have taken it.

Let me rephrase too.

"bo_sox48, you're completely normal." >>>> change it up >>>> "bo_sox48, you're still wrong on this one."

@THM

I see what you're saying and I appreciate someone with an actual experience that counters what's being said.

While I agree that every relationship will involve challenges, I think age and experience play a particularly important role in the College/HS scenario. Is it *really* a successful relationship, or are you just two kids who like to make out? Personalities change much more between 16 and 21 then 21 and 26. Will I still like that person?

@phil

Yeah, that wasn't directed at you. Of course there are plenty of good reasons to go to a school close by. Your HS sweetheart isn't one of them.

Staying close to your high school girlfriend isn't inherently bad. It's passing better opportunities that is. If you pass up going to a better school for a girl then you've limited your future success considerably. That's unreasonably risky, sorry.

To chime in with the personal anecdotes, I spent two years in a relationship with a highschooler when I was in "college". Then she went to college as well and we didn't make it through another year. I guess the moral could be that while you might be able to keep it going on your side since you obviously have control over yourself, the same cannot be said for your counterpart. Especially in a campus environment, one encounters a lot of new experience and sensation that will override previous feelings. And you don't want to get duped while finishing your thesis like I did :) That doesn't mean you should terminate the relationship though, you're both happy so there's no reason for that. Enjoy every moment, don't let needless fear of breaking up ruin your days, love her, plan your common future and you might end up schooling us cynical old men few years from now by still going strong ;)

@Invicuts

Yeah, I think pretty much everyone here is in agreement on that point.

Maybe you won't like that person anymore, and maybe you'll change. Maybe that's true when you and your girlfriend graduate college and enter the work force. Do you break off the relationship because you're both going into the working world? The first few weeks of a new job are pretty important, building (probably mostly platonic) relationships. Do you hold off on applying for jobs cross-country because you both want to live and work in the same place you went to school? What if she gets a job somewhere first? Or gets into grad school somewhere else? Better just call it off.

It's not like people stop changing at some magic age. What if you hit your 40s or 50s and go through a midlife crisis? It happens to a lot of people. What if you might not like your wife anymore? Maybe you're just two grownups who like to have sex. Better not get married at all. Or wait until you're 70. Personalities change much more between 26 and 36 than between 70 and 80.

I agree that most 16 to 21 year olds lack the perspective and life experience to really know themselves and what their lifelong values and priorities will be (as if those were some immutable). But some do know at 16, or 18, or 21. Some don't know at 21, or 26, or 36. I think it's bogus to dismiss someone's self-assessment because of their age, or to ignore someone's advice because of their age. You go into it eyes wide open, and do the best you can.

@THM

Of course there are exceptions, otherwise we'd say 100% of HS relationships fail. That certainly isn't true. But, I think the transition into adulthood, as aided by college, is one of the more important times in life and it can be hindered by an old relationship that you can't shake off.

And by the way, often times they won't break the relationship even though it's clearly not working because they don't really know how to handle loss or lack the perspective to even realize it's not working.

@abge and Invictus. I'm not in agreement on that point. What does "unreasonably risky" mean? Maybe it's unreasonably risky to pass up on the one person who might have made you happy for the rest of your life because you're chasing some stupid US News and World Report ranking. When you *really* grow up, your SAT score and the school you went to have very little relevance, most of the time.

Besides, abge, didn't you advocate in another thread a long time back that it a reasonable way to avoid rising college tuition was to go to a community college, then transfer to a "better school" for the degree? Why can't Tyran (or hypothetical teenager X) go to his local community college while his gf finishes school, then transfer to wherever they both want to live together, assuming they're still together?

If you get into a prestigious four-year university and decide to do community college instead due to a high school girlfriend, that's unreasonably risky. Even assuming he can still get in later, he'll be entirely out of place socially and miss out on so many experiences. Make fun of SAT and USNWR all you want, but a better education means a better future.

@THM

1) "What does "unreasonably risky" mean? "

I don't know. Did I say that?

2) Re: CC

Yes, I do support going to community college for a variety of reasons, but those reasons shouldn't be "so I can live closer to my gf". If going to a CC makes sense and, as an added bonus, you get to live near your gf, then great! I have nothing against that.

@abge: Unreasonably risky was Invictus' term. You posted that you thought everyone agreed with Invictus on that, and I thought that's what you meant. Maybe you meant something else, and I got confused by cross-posting. It's a bitch keeping up, especially by phone.

@Invictus: I agree it's important to get a good education. I'm not sure where all these add-on facts are coming from. Is Tyran giving up admission to a prestigious four year university? Is it just to be with his HS girlfriend?

I agree that the vast majority of HS relationships don't last. I agree that for most people it's a bad idea to base their life plan around their HS girlfriends. I disagree that for any hypothetical teen, the wise and mature thing to do is break off a successful HS relationship under the assumption it won't work out out of fear it is unreasonably risky to miss out on the experiences he might have were he single. You never know (until you KNOW) which one is going to be THE ONE, and if you have found THE ONE, it would be foolish to let her go for sake of a school ranking.

Oh, I do agree with Invictus on the point that you shouldn't choose a school based on your HS relationship. I think/thought most people agreed with that. I'm not quite sure if you agree or not.

@THM

I think you're misunderstanding what Invictus said. We're talking about two things at the same time.

In that instance, he was talking specifically about choosing a college based on your relationship. You can go to your first school and still try to make your relationship last. Those are two separate issues.

IMO, you shouldn't pick a school based solely on your HS girlfriend. I doubt anybody does, really. I think the location of your significant other is a valid factor in choosing where to go to college, assuming things are going well and you both wish to try to make the relationship work, keeping in mind the extremely low odds that this HS relationship will turn out to be one of the few long-lasting ones. Should you pass up on the full ride scholarship to an Ivy so you can stay in Smallville for next year's prom? Probably not when considering all factors, but I wouldn't automatically rule it out for everyone.

@Invictus,

"In all my live long days I've never seen an arcade that wasn't attached to a movie theater or bowling alley. Unless they're going on a date at Chuck E. Cheese's or something I think the master troll behind the pathos-soaked Conservative Man account has slipped up."

There are tons of arcades that are stand-alone. Dave and Buster's is a whole chain of them, and there are a ton of indie ones, too. You must just have been oblivious.

Kitchen, Den and Bar/Gameworks is another. Must be suburban Chicago is pretty deprived and boring. Glad I live elsewhere.

I mean, I get where Invictus was coming from. There weren't any arcades where I grew up besides one at the mall that you stopped going to after elementary school

Yeah, I forgot about Gameworks. Also can be good, though I have more fond memories from D&B. Overall, at least to my taste, indie ones are better -- fewer ticket games and more old classics (if it's a good one). Ground Kontrol in Portland, for example.

@Putin There's a Gameworks in Suburban Chicago. Some people just don't go there really. Actually there's several arcades in this area. Including one nickel arcade. No D&B close by though actually.