"children can't enter into legal contracts"
I'm supporting a change of laws, like children being able to work if they wish to (which would include children being able to enter into legal contracts), and you provide me with existing laws to counter my argument. cool.

I just want clarification.. what exactly am I disproving? That children shouldn't be allowed to work? I agree with the laws as they stand. I'm not going to drag all of those out and provide them for you.

Lets say that there is a 13 year old boy, he has a disabled mother, a smaller brother and a father that with his salary keep all of them. One day his father dies in a car accident. What does he do? Can he go to work to provide for his mother and younger brother? Does he get put into a foster home? Does he receive welfare?

The parents should receive welfare to help them afford the extra costs of living with disabilities. The idea that child labour is a good response is quite frankly a victorian mindset.

and who pays for that welfare?

people that never met them? people that, frankly, don't give a shit?

See here's where I say it's not the boys responsibility to figure that out, but his mother's. We have programs in place to help people in that situation.

What if i told you that in 2012, in the US, charities received a total of 316 billion dollars while government money allocated to welfare (specifically family and children) was 137 billion dollars. Are private charities not capable?

Just cause you wouldn't give a shit doesn't mean others don't ILN.

No I don't think private charities are capable since I believe 80% of donated money go to running the charity and only 20% to actually helping people. On average of course, some charities are better then others.

(Personally, i do give a shit, but there are some that don't)

Btw why do you say it's the child's responsibility and not the mother's in that situation?

care to provide any sources for that myth?

The mother is disabled, she can't work.

I'll look them up sure just not tonight and no she's the mother it is her responsibility. She figures it out then not him. That's BS. My father was disabled and couldn't work and he still figured it out.

So you would punish a child, somebody who has done nothing wrong, because there are too many selfish assholes in the country? Fuck em. If they want to live in a functional society they have to make a contribution towards that society.

I get where ILN is coming from I just disagree. I've had this exact same conversation with someone before. It's just a difference of opinion. I would rather place trust in our government to proved for people who are disabled or need welfare, while they would rather seen it done through the private sector.

Is it not a mans right to be selfish? And this society isn't entirely functional.

Of course man has a right to be selfish.

ILN ... speaking as a high schooler here:

YOU DON'T WANT TO LET US DECIDE WHETHER WE WORK OR GO TO SCHOOL.

What are you, a niner? :p

I'm a senior. I go to one of those smart kid preppy schools where we all wear high rolled pants and play Zelda games all day. Except not really.

Child labor laws as well as parental guardianship are both essential to progressive education. If parents had absolutely no say in whether a kid dropped out of school to work, our education system would grow exponentially worse, and while I may not have projections or something to go along with that, it only makes sense that that would be absolutely abhorrent.

Niner.
I'm not saying that parents should have no control over their kids, I was saying that anyone willing to work should be able to. I'm also against mandatory schooling. Anything they teach in school is on the internet now anyways, so the argument that kids will grow up stupid is itself stupid, kids that want to learn will learn, with or without school, until recently school only provided kids with knowledge they couldn't get elsewhere. Only thing mandatory schooling does is make kids that want to learn have their class interrupted by some douchebag that thinks it's funny to make farting noises in class.

Niner means freshman...

And the rest of that post is ridiculous.

Having experienced public school unlike you I can tell you that I have learnt more from various Wikipedia articles than all my history and geography courses put together. Public education is a joke.

But public education forces you to learn a minimal amount. And your charity argument is stupid - private charity may have enough to take care of people, may not, if you rely on private charities and there aren't enough donations then what, it's tought shit kid, we think charities are better then welfare so you're on your own? the minds of some people on this site.... really anti schooling, pro child labour, f*ck me.

Skimming through this thread... Guys... you're all crazy... Well, it's an Internet behaviour... A bubble within which to play with words capriciously invested with frustrated feelings.

SD, I am an admirer of Socrates and Castro too. It will be difficult to pick two names out of human history more worthy of remembrance.
But I am dissatisfied with your last reaction here... I find ILNs entry here profoundly important and will copy it for use in another thread. Thanks ILN!
Ivan Illich is a thinker who dug deep into these things, for example in his book "Deschooling society" from 1970.

fair play sylence, i liked the use of 'dissatisfied' in your post too.

"Having experienced public school unlike you I can tell you that I have learnt more from various Wikipedia articles than all my history and geography courses put together. Public education is a joke."

I was in public school for ten years.