INvictus - how fucking out of touch are you, seriously? The Senate didn't even call to order until about 2 PM today, and the White House cancelled planned meetings, or at least delayed them today.

You 'tards on the left may not agree with Republican policy, but you completely lack any credibility when you try to put forth the notion that Obama/Reid are the good actors in this faux, made for tv drama.

I honestly thought the collective here had a bit more intelligence and would be outraged by any bad behavior...

For example, when you all say "the law is the law....Obamacare must be funded with the law exactly as it is, Republicans are holding the American peole hostage, blah blah blah...." why are you not EQUALLY bashing Obama/Reid, who are now trying to renegotiate the Sequester in negotiations over the debt ceiling.

You will recall, Seuestration is THE LAW...and it was a law proposed by OBAMA...

So where is your collective outrage at Obama trying to change a law he signed?

You people would like to your own grandmothers an steal babies from a candy store if you thought it would further your demented socialist agenda.

I obviously don't agree with your politics...but I thought a *few* of you at least had a bit of intellectual integrity.

I was sadly mistaken.

Yes....I'm an asshole, and vomit my shit all over these forumns....but I sure as hell hope I'm not as intellectual dishonest as you people...

"like to your own grandmothers"....that's "LIE to your own grandmothers..."

Invitus -- here's a test....if the Democrats refuse to voting on anything but a "clean CR"....why have they voted on and passed multiple partial funding bills which Obama signed?

Invictus -- if every bill supported by the opposition MUST be brought to a vote, then why has Harry Reid blocked over 26 bills from coming to a vote in the Senate.

You ass clowns are such disingenuous fucks it isn't even funny.

Fuck off, seriously.

http://thehill.com/blogs/healthwatch/health-reform-implementation/328459-labor-gets-obamacare-olive-branch-

Oh geee....what's this? When Democrat-supporting UNIONS call for a change to Obamacare law, suddenly this is a great bi-partisan idea? And fucking yahoo's like Invictus will think this is suddenly a great idea now that the thug Unions are supporting the Republican idea.

krelin, krellin. Calm down. Deep breath.

The shutdown itself is what's bad. It's the original sin here. A "clean CR" is what needs to happen. This kind of behavior can't be accepted as legitimate means of effecting public policy. The House Republicans can't be allowed to pull stunts like this and have the country lurch from crisis to crisis. This whole mess over the shutdown is the lastest and by far the worst example of magical thinking by people individuals who have no business being anywhere near the levers of power.It was entered into without any strategy on how to win it, and the result has been the GOP sinking to the lowest approval level since such records were kept. Seriously, how do you expect a Democratic Senate to pass a spending bill defunding Obamacare? How do you expect a reelected president to allow his signature achievement to die on the vine?

The Obamacare roll out has been an unmitigated disaster. But are we talking about it? No, we're talking about the possibility of a worldwide economic crisis due to the quixotic decisions of certain politicians in the GOP. As I said, people like you enable these blockheaded moves. It's ridiculous and after the crushing, embarrassing loss here we'll get adults back in charge of the party.

Invictus.....back-pedaling as fast as he can, now that he's been nailed to the wall...

You're right - the shut-down was a bad idea. It's too bad Obama and Reid didn't sit down with Republicans to negotiate BEFORE the shut-down....but instead, Obama/Reid decided to use dimwits like you as political pawns, knowing that you good little sheep would carry their anti-Republican water for them...

...except now they are negotiating (which is what mature adults do...and every other split-government has always done)...and now they are going back on their word (which they already broke when they passed previously partial bills)...

Why don't you just man up and admit it, Invictus -- you were wrong. You were wrong about Republicans being wholly responsibile, and your bleeting on behalf of the Democrats is now being thrown in your face by none other than Obama and Reid themselves.

You dare to tell me to take a breath, when like a fucking retarded kid being pushed around by the bully you just repeat whatever MSNBC tells you to say.....until you are presented with fact that contradict your lies.

You are truly pathetic, man, truly.

What does winning look like to you, krellin?

I can tell you what it looks like to me. Keeping the majority in 2014, with a dozen special elections in the meantime as the incompetent Republican Congressmen who got us here resign in disgrace. It's that bad. This is wholly unacceptable behavior, and Americans not caught up in the self-justifying right wing media bubble hate it. My boy Rand Paul can kiss a presidential bid in 2016 goodbye. Only a governor untouched by this mess has a prayer against Hillary. Or a ham sandwich with a D sticker on it.

The GOP is absolutely wholly responsible for the shutdown, krellin. They're the ones who did it! You can't blame the Democrats for not opening it back up again and helping the Republicans fix their mistake.

Seriously, you're acting crazy. This is the kind of behavior which loses elections. Isn't that the point of it all? To win power and enact your policies?

Invictus - winning would be the education of near-illiterate electorate. Winning would be people like you - who *are* smart enough to understand truth - actually having the intellectual integrity to acknowledge truth.

So....chances are, there will be no winning, because asstards like you are so died-in-the-wool political sheep that there is no hope for you. You are the type of guy that ignores facts if they mess with you emotions....so there is no hope in 2014.

That being said, all your dire predictions for 2014....<yawn....> Go to Vegas and put your money where you mouth is, pal. I'm sure they're already taking bets on the coming elections. CAll me back when all these Republicans resign in disgrace...lol

It's hillarious....even as I present FACT above that demonstrate just how fucking wrong you are you still act like a mindless Democrat sheep.

Seriously, man, you are more intelligent than this. Quit making yourself look like such a mindless pawn.

INVICTUS -- THE GOVERNMENT IS RUN BY TWO PARTIES. CONGRESS, BY LAW, PASSES A BUDGET. THE SENATE THEN TAKES IT UP AND VOTES ON IT, AND IF IT PASSES THE PRESIDENT CAN EITHER SIGN IT OR VETO IT.

REPUBLICANS HAVE PASSED MYRIAD BUDGETS OVER THE LAST YEAR. THEY PASSED CR SPENDING BILLS.

HARRY REID WILL NOT VOTE ON THEM.

THEREFORE, THE *STOP* IN THE PROCESS IS HARRY REID, WHO WILL NOT GIVE THE SENATE A CHANCE TO VOTE ON THE BILLS.

YOU CAN ACT LIKE A RETARDED MINDLESS SHEEP (or maybe it isn't an act...maybe you truly are retarded???) BUT THAT DOESN'T CHANGE FACTS.

EVERYTHING OBAMA AND REID HAVE SAID HAS BEEN A LIE --
1. THEY SAID THEY WON'T PASS PARTIAL FUNDING, BUT THEY HAVE
2. THEY SAID THEY WON'T NEGOTIATE - BUT THEY ARE
3. THEY SAID THAT THEY WON'T CHANGE THE LAWS...BUT THEY ARE TRYING TO CHANGE SEQUESTRATION.

EVERYTHING THEY HAVE SAID TO YOU IS A LIE...AND YET YOU MINDLESSLY REPEAT EVERYTHING THEY SAY, LIKE A GOOD LITTLE SHEEP.

IT'S LAUGHABLE WHAT A GULLIBLE FOOL YOU ARE.

You're the pawn here, and you're the one ignoring facts. This is no way to govern a country. The world is laughing at us. The behavior of the GOP in this shutdown discredits their policies which are necessary to save this country from the coming reckoning on our debt, policies which require a Republican in the White House and majorities in both houses.

I just hope the crushing loss the GOP experiences today or tomorrow shakes people like you back to reality.

Caps lock is cruise control for cool.

And by "cool", I of course mean "unhinged and rabid"

So Harry Reid's the problem. How do you get rid of Harry Reid? Elect more Republicans to the Senate. How do you do that? Not by shutting down the government and destroying the party's image, that's for sure. And not by letting kooks win primaries and lose winnable races in two cycles.

Funny thing is, Invictus, is you haven't refuted a thing I say. Just further evidence that you are the abused sheep here, mindlessly following your Democrat overlords. But I guess taking orders is easier than thinking for yourself.

You not worthy of any more of my time.

Krellin, as a left leaning individual myself...

Please. Keep it up. The more unhinged and insane you and your cohorts rant, the easier it is going to be for us to pick up the pieces and govern like adults.

So by all means, continue to obstruct, and blame it on others. I'm laughing all the way to the polls.

And there's Jack Klein....ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK goes the Liberal attack dog.

Jack, too, doesn't have anything to refute the facts I have presented, which clearly demonstrate Obama and Reid as the problem.

My work here is done...you two are proven before all to be the docile, mindless sheep, the thoughtless followers that the Democrats rely on to stay in power.

As Jack Klein is heard mumbling to himself, "Illiteracy if FUNZ!", to which INvictus rubs his hiney and gives him a lollipop.

Have fun children.

What you're saying isn't relevant. The original sin is the shutdown itself. I can't blame the Democrats for stabbing Republicans after they're given a sword.

Jack....go ahead....refute any of my points above with fact, not Democrat talking points.

Invictus - the original sin? Oh....you mean the original sin of Harry Reid not taking a vote on ANY of the Republican budgets that have been passed this year....any one of which would have prevented a shut down?

Thank you, again, for pointing out that Harry Reid is wholly responsibile for the shut down.

Facts are a bitch, aren't they Invictus? Sucks to be you.

Also, the Senate has been requesting a budget conference repeatedly, since April.

The House refused, and then suddenly wants one now that they've fucked up and shut down the government.

Pass a nice clean continuing resolution for say... three or or four months. Lock in taxes and spending at current levels, and then we can negotiate. But when the House Republicans are hostage taking... there is no reason to negotiate, because that validates shutting down the government and threatening default on our debts. That should not be a negotiation tactic.

And the fact that the Republican types seem to think it is is a big reason they're getting annihilated in the court of public opinion.

You can't expect a Democratic Senate to pass a budget defunding Obamacare. It's just not going to happen. It's magical thinking.

What's it called when you do something over and over again and expect a different result? The thing to do was allow Obamacare to go into effect, watch it fail, and run against it in 2014.

To be specific, there have been 18 separate rejections to go to budget conference by the House since April.

Invictus raises a legit point that I've brought up in discussions amongst my friends.

If Obamacare was such a terrible idea, then why does it seem the Republicans are so terrified of it going into effect? I mean, if its bad, then they get a huge windfall, sweep into office on a tide of public support. Really, if its that bad, its in their interests to sit back and reap the rewards.

My conclusion from this is that they're terrified its going to be a success, and they don't dare let go into effect, because they'll look like idiots ranting about a program for years, and it turns out to be excellent.

There's no danger of Obamacare being a success.

Republicans can reopen the govt whenever they want by voting on a clean bill which would pass if brought to a vote AND is the draconian levels the Republicans wanted and PASSED already in March. See, judicious use of caps, not foaming at the mouth. No more spin and vote.

Well, we'll see.

I do have to thank the Republicans for creating some political theater right during the rollout. There was bound to be teething troubles with a new system. And there was, but nobody is paying any attention due to the shutdown.

Thanks, Republicans! :)

The back-and-forth between krellin and Invictus is a perfect microcosm of what is currently happening in the Republican party.

Sad bad losers .....

Our problem is electing leaders who run on a platform of govt doesn't work... we should not be surprised that they sabotage the gov't to prove their point. Bush administration case in point and the current republicans in congress. No interest in governing....