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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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obiwanobiwan (248 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
America and Islam...To Quote A Famous Jewish Philosopher:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100908/ts_alt_afp/usattacksreligionislam Really, first the protestations over that plan to build a mosque near the site of the WTC attacks, and now "Koran Burning Day???" I don't really care about any Holy Book, but I don't think it's AT ALL appropriate to burn them...flag burning's questionable but you can AT LEAST say it's maybe a prostestation against the government; this is attacking individuals's belief!
58 replies
Open
Tolstoy (1962 D)
06 Sep 10 UTC
Sun Tzu, Jomini, Clausewitz, Machiavelli, Mahan...
What is the single most important classical work on political and/or military strategy to read for the purpose of becoming a better Diplomacy player?
17 replies
Open
Ges (292 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
Chaos Italy and Fleet Rome
I apologize if this is old and boring for the forum, but I was wondering about experiences that folks have had playing these variants. Are they fun? Balanced? Fleet Rome (Italy starts with a fleet in Rome instead of an army) in particular looks like a promising way to give Italy a few more options in the early going. Thoughts?
yebellz (729 D(G))
08 Sep 10 UTC
Fleet Rome also seems to reduce some of Italy's options. It basically forces him into an alliance with Austria, by eliminating his ability to attack Trieste with two armies and weakening his ability to protect Venice should Austria try an early attack. However, even in the classic game, I am of the opinion that Italy and Austria are better as allies, so having the extra fleet does help improve Italian prospects in that scenario, since he could then bid for Greece as well as taking Tunis for free.

Keeping that in mind, I think it makes for a much more interesting game, albeit at the expense of Italy potentially getting off to weak start, to play the classic way with an army in Rome. It creates more diplomatic options and possibly intrigue in that the only way Italy can get two builds in 1901 is to take either Trieste, Marseilles, or Munich.

A major supporter of fleet Rome variant was Richard Sharpe, a player that is heavily biased to favor Austria and Germany as they are his favorite nations to play. His personal biases come across very plainly in his book "The Game of Diplomacy" (out of print, but you can find the full text free online).

What exactly do you mean by Chaos Italy? Are you talking about some sort of custom build variant?
tarspaceheel (503 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
I'm up for any variant that gives Italy more options than just:

(a) Lepanto
(b) Attack Austria.

But that problem isn't really solved by a fleet in Rome. Yes, it gives Italy more options, but now an attack on Turkey is almost assured, while an attack on France is still suicidal. If there were a variant in which Rome bordered the Gulf of Lyon AND had a fleet, then we might see some interesting options, as Italy could actually pose a credible attack against France before 1905.
peterwiggin (15158 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
I think somebody ran statistics on Fleet Rome in PBEM play and found that, while the results were a wash for Italy and Austria, the French suffered greatly and the English improved at the expense of the French.
Onar (131 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
I think the milan variant helps italy more than fleet rome does. Or really, any variant in which tuscany is combined with rome.
peterwiggin (15158 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
Actually, here's the fleet Rome article . . . the results are a bit more complicated than I made them out to be.
http://www.diplom.org/Zine/S2003M/Burgess/Rome.html
orathaic (1009 D(B))
08 Sep 10 UTC
standard gives italy rocky lepanto (which can turn into attack germany, attack france, or attack russia, depending on circumstances)

or just attacking france...

Nobody bemoans the fact that turkey has little option but to moves into the balkans or hammer armenia and black sea...

fleet rome weakens italy's defence against austria, (austria can get two armies and a fleet to attack venice, and italy can't possibly hope to defend) so while fleet rome does make it impossible for italy to attack austria successfully, it also horribly weakens italy's defence, making her a very tempting target for any half intelligent austrian player.
yebellz (729 D(G))
08 Sep 10 UTC
@orathic: I pointed out the weakened defense against Austria. Italy has does have a chance with Nap => Apu, which could then support hold Venice in the fall, but that wastes the potential of that fleet and Austria could always counter that by moving Trieste into Adriatic and the armies in Tyr or Trieste. Italy could also counter that by moving Ven => Tri in order to bounce that follow up army.
yebellz (729 D(G))
08 Sep 10 UTC
@peterwiggin, that is an interesting article. The statistics actually show that Austria has the best results in 99 with fleet Rome. Unfortunately, the writer of that article, Jim Burgess, fails do some basic proper research. He never read the articles that retort Richard Sharp's "Game of Diplomacy" book, and also he states that he is disappointed that Richard Sharp didn't address the fleet Rome variant in chapter 13, which discusses variants, but the author Clearly Missed the fact that Richard Sharp discusses fleet Rome in the "Italy" chapter. Quite an oversight by Jim Burgess. The author clearly attributes the fleet Rome variant to Richard Sharp, at least he got that right.
peterwiggin (15158 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
There are articles that retort the "Game of Diplomacy" book? You mean I'm not the only person that disagrees with all of Sharp's conclusions?
yebellz (729 D(G))
08 Sep 10 UTC
Yes, read the Rome article that you just posted. The author mentions articles by Geoff Challinger and James Nelson that rip Sharp's book apart.

Also, look at the bottom of this page:
http://www.diplom.org/~diparch/god.htm
There are links to two other articles presenting critical opinions on the book.
yebellz (729 D(G))
08 Sep 10 UTC
I don't like Sharp's book either. It's so incredibly biased since he preferred to play Austria and Germany.
McHuff (149 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
I'd settle for an extra neutral border.
orathaic (1009 D(B))
08 Sep 10 UTC
i still prefer standard to any variant, so italy has a weaker start to most, i've seen very strong italys, winning games.

But as stated fleet rome weakens italy's offensive opportunities, while also weakening his defence (against austria in 1901/2) - not what i'd call an improvement, but i don't see the point to begin with.

Chaos italy on the other hand is a rather poor alternative to playing with 7 players. I'd prefer to paly with neutral italy than chaos...
largeham (149 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
What's chaos Italy? Personally, I would like to try Milan, as it makes Italian-AH negotiations easier.

As for Richard Sharp, I think he is a good starting point, but he is too pessimistic concerning Turkey and England.
Chaos Italy: Six players and Italy. Each player writes orders for Italy. Throw die, numbers assigned by country; winner's orders are the ones resolved for the turn.
Perry6006 (5409 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
The Fleet Rome variant is simply not good.
Limiting options for nations (italy) is not fun = not good :)
Ges (292 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
Thanks for all the thoughtful comments!


17 replies
omgwhathappened (0 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
tactical advice for game on another site
before i discovered the awesomeness of webdip, i started an account over at playdiplomacy.com and started some games. I am pretty committed to this site, but don't want to abandon my games over there. Anyway, I have gotten myself in a bit of a pickle, and I would like to ask some tactical advice.

before i go into specifics, is this kind of thread even kosher?
36 replies
Open
Kamen (1935 D(S))
09 Sep 10 UTC
Looking for a sitter
It looks like some people in my game won't vote for pause :-P.
I will be back on 18th. Playing one Ancient Mediterranean game (1 D phase) and one Classic (2 D2h but this one is very close to the end).
Are there any volunteers for sitting in my game?
5 replies
Open
Le_Roi (913 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
ACTA
See within.
3 replies
Open
PunxsutawneyPhil (382 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
New game, ppsc, 24hrs per period, 15D
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=37699

join, if you like :)
0 replies
Open
Andrei (124 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
Live game starts in 13 minutes
diplomacy on, 15 mins turns
2 replies
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
Shalom...and a Happy Rosh Hashanah!
Yep--happy Jewish New Year, everybody!

What that means practically I don't know, if I were religious maybe it'd mean something, but it's still a good excuse to show some New Years good will...and have a New Years celebratory drink or two... ;)
5 replies
Open
Andrei (124 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
live game starting in 4 minutes
especially for new players trying to learn
1 reply
Open
Kusiag (1443 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
1 Person needed for World game
gameID=37550
Check it out everyone!
It has good rules and enough time to diplo with everyone.
0 replies
Open
curtis (8870 D)
09 Sep 10 UTC
live gunboat
1 reply
Open
dave bishop (4694 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
High Pot WTA Chaos Game!!
There's only 24 hours to join, and we need 16 more- so this is a bit of a long shot.
The bet's 50 D, and the total pot will be 2200 as Oli will put an extra 500 in if the game gets going.
http://olidip.net/board.php?gameID=2057
1 reply
Open
Winston (100 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
Is it just me or are the game timers a bit off?
The game timers expire and change to now minutes before they. Acctually hit there deadline on my iPad, is it just me or is it something with the site
4 replies
Open
Rusty (179 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
Classic Game Needs One More
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=36993
Password: brady
1 reply
Open
obiwanobiwan (248 D)
05 Sep 10 UTC
Obiwanobiwan and the Quest For The Rushmore Of Music!
Well, that Philosophers contest almost entirely fun (damn you, Seneca! lol) and I was going to propose a world leaders contest next...but that BAND contest never went anywhere, never ended...so start nominating songs (max 5 per person) and we'll take the first 50 or so (flexible there) and give them 3 D each until we reach our Top 20, then start like last time. ANY genre, from Beethoven to the Beatles to Britain's Anthem to Bieber (OK, THAT will get tossed fast!) ;)
38 replies
Open
curtis (8870 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
gunboat 10 min intervals
3 replies
Open
Baelar (100 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
Bug in gameID=37581
This game bugged out on me. Do I email a mod about it? And how can I get it addressed without revealing which country I am?
1 reply
Open
FriedOkraBlues (100 D)
06 Sep 10 UTC
WebDip's "Black Hats"
Who are the least trustworthy players here? Vote...
15 replies
Open
Winston (100 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
Live games...
What are peoples general opinion on live games? And should there be a rule against advertising live games on the forum outside of the designated thread (ADVERTISE YOUR LIVE GAMES HERE)
3 replies
Open
Pandarus (0 DX)
08 Sep 10 UTC
Live Game Anyone?
Any variant, any setting. Who is up for it?
3 replies
Open
hellalt (113 D)
07 Sep 10 UTC
live guboat NOW
gameID=37581
30 D wta anon gunboat
30 mins to join
8 replies
Open
Winston (100 D)
08 Sep 10 UTC
Live Gunboat
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=37592
5 min phases
30 minutes to join
20 bet PPSC
1 reply
Open
Thucydides (864 D(B))
07 Sep 10 UTC
Minecraft.net
Minecraft.net
6 replies
Open
JOIN
Please join the game War In Europe-6. Game starts in 10 minutes
0 replies
Open
LordVipor (566 D)
07 Sep 10 UTC
Is it poor form to ask...
For someone to join an ongoing game (with annon players, but messaging enabled) in place of a player that has left in order to make the game a bit more balanced?
10 replies
Open
peterwiggin (15158 D)
07 Sep 10 UTC
draw and cancel
If everybody votes both draw and cancel, is the game canceled or drawn?
3 replies
Open
Baskineli (100 D(B))
04 Sep 10 UTC
On metagaming and Diplomacy - a few quotes
It seems that quite a few people here have a negative opinion on so-called "metagaming". Metagaming is a term for using information that is not usually available inside the game.
I think that metagaming IS the real Diplomacy. I've collected a few quotes by famous Diplomacy players that might be interesting for you:

45 replies
Open
Crazyter (1335 D(G))
07 Sep 10 UTC
Join WTA game - we need 2 more- 36 hr phase
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=36828

PM Ebay for the password
5 replies
Open
V+ (5504 D)
07 Sep 10 UTC
Can't see the message board in the game
Any ideas why I can't see the message board in one game (http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=37178) but I can see it in others?
11 replies
Open
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