M62: PEOPLE'S DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF REVOLUTIONARY MAFIA GAME THREAD!

[BunnyGo]

##vote Neph

Here's the thing about town kgray...don't sheep her early reads. I'm 100% with you Vecna, until here.

What is with you undermining kgray? Like you've spent multiple posts discrediting her and saying her actions aren't scummy tho. I don't see you do that to other players.

Scum kgray I got a good look at last game. Not seeing it yet. Town kgray I’ve had the displeasure of being on the other side of her rage tunnels multiple times. When she’s not doing that, she’s good. But that’s all I’m seeing so far. Which is par for the course D1 town kgray. And now I’ve said it 3 times. Which is enough.

[Durga]

She's not targeting you tho? What do you know about Neph that I don't?

[brainbomb]

Like in the section on brainbomb, I have written null/scumlean in one column.
In the evidence column I have written: claiming to tunnel me, shading me as scum (throwing out a morsel to see if anyone else bites?).

You see yourself as a morsel?

[BunnyGo]

She's not targeting you tho? What do you know about Neph that I don't?

Nothing. I was commenting on ND.

[Durga]

How is voting for ND and then switching to Neph when she found him sus a death tunnel?

[Durga]

She's not targeting you tho? What do you know about Neph that I don't?

Nothing. I was commenting on ND.

Even better. People defending ND are likely scum motivated. Who doesn't want a person who triggers half the game and might be an easy miskill around (if ND is town)

[BunnyGo]

She's not targeting you tho? What do you know about Neph that I don't?

Nothing. I was commenting on ND.

Her Neph vote was then based on that. It’s one big tunnel.

[Durga]

She's not targeting you tho? What do you know about Neph that I don't?

Nothing. I was commenting on ND.

Her Neph vote was then based on that. It’s one big tunnel.

Do you even know what a tunnel is

[Hamilton Brian]

You see yourself as a morsel?

I'm somebody's morsel. Yeah, I forgot I wrote that. Tipsy!

[brainbomb]

You see yourself as a morsel?

I'm somebody's morsel. Yeah, I forgot I wrote that. Tipsy!

Is it fair to say that you see yourself as low hanging fruit?

[Hamilton Brian]

Even better. People defending ND are likely scum motivated. Who doesn't want a person who triggers half the game and might be an easy miskill around (if ND is town)

That's a pretty important word.

I am pretty certain you're town.

[damo666]

Other impressions:

Worcej usually posts what I was thinking. But this time he's posting a lot of sh*t. It's much more annoying than he usually is, but maybe he was bored holding his tongue last game as GM.

ND is annoying, but nothing he's done suggests to me that he knows what's going on.

kgray is not her normal self. I don't know what to make of that. The problem with D1s in general, and ESPECIALLY a D1 during the holiday. She's normally active, pushing, responding (both as scum and as town). So I guess it is holiday?

Aarodactyl is roughly what I'd expect him to do either as town or scum. I expect he'll be pretty decent at this game if he commits to it. I have no read on him though.

Yoyo has not surprised me yet, I still expect the slot to change hands.

ghug seems a little off to me. I don't recall him ever making votes just because someone he didn't scumread annoyed him.

Flum seems like town Flum.

Durga seems like town Durga.

Vecna seems like town Vecna.

you (CELAPH) are town.

bozo isn't normal bozo yet. I'm waiting for him to clown it up.

what are scum flum and scum durga like?

I have a scum durga tell which for obvious reasons I will not disclose, however she has not yet portrayed it, if she is does I will scream out loud her scumitudiness.

Has flum ever been scum?

[Durga]

Everyone and their mother has a secret scum Durga tell they won't reveal.

[ND]

Maniac stated, paraphrasing, “ND is the poor man’s Krellin” now I wager a lot of you don’t know who Krellin is. But, it’s not something that I disagree with. Krellin is a provocateur and so am I. There used to be a time on this website where provocation was understood. It apparently is no longer the case. Everyone sits down with their furry hat on, sipping on their juice, holding mommy’s hand.

“OH MY GOD THE BAD MAN ND!” seems to be the general vibe from these care bears

Obviously, when times change and one person is playing in what is now an unacceptable way that person is going to be the odd man out. I get a lot of hate for it. And, if I die because of it then so be it. I’m proud to shake things up even if it’s for one day. It might hurt some feelings, but in the end it is justified. More on this in a second.

I’ve seen Vecna reference a few times my previous and most recent games before I quit. He argues that I am playing in a similar way. Yes. true. This is a good analysis. But I would counter the point by stating that in the last few games I played, regardless of alignment, in a provocative way whether that was in a bizarre way or more in your face aggressive manner. At best me being provocative is NAI. I would continue my counter by stating that I deeply believe that playing in a provocative way is the best way to play D1. Especially if you have a longstanding history with people in the game. Or even with new people to test their response. Being provocative allows you to get reactions that would fall outside the normal bounds of the game discourse. That’s why I do it. Maybe the way people responded to my provocation will be important later in the game, maybe examining their reaction will aid in my analysis of the data later in the game, maybe it all turns out to be nothing. Either way, it’s something that I can re-examine if need be at a later point in time if I am not killed or someone else can down the road. Maybe they crack on the spot and there is an instant result.

But, to say that my provocation did not already lead to something would be an understatement. It has already shaped the D1 discourse. That is something I am happy about. It worked and it may yield future dividends.

In my skim of the pages since Thanksgiving yesterday I’ve seen a few people ask about my townreads or why I play the way I do. People like Hamilton/Kgray, etc.

Townreads aren’t necessarily super important D1. On D1 you only have one piece of information (in most games) and that is individual players posts. Now, an accomplished player who has a history playing with the same set of players can produce a meta read or series of them. Hence, my vote on Vashta. A player can only cast judgement based on their opinion. We can say:

1a) Oh X is being toxic and we don’t like him. To hell with his alignment. It’s a popularity contest so let’s daykill him.

1b) Oh Y, I have a strong meta read on him so I am going to cast a vote on him. His post pattern backs up my read!

1c) Oh Z, Z scumslipped! See this is a scumslip his post refers to knowledge that is not learned in this thread but outside the thread (mafia qt, mafia role, etc) This is a scumslip!

1d) Oh ZZ, ZZ’s posts are scum indicative! This is my argument, etc. Or ZZ! ZZ never posted so let’s policy lynch ZZ!, etc.

Maybe some additional variables, but those are the main kinds of D1 votes. Day 1’s townreads don’t necessarily matter. No one cares who you townread in the first 3 hours or the first 24 hours etc. Town Reads only become important after the first day. Why? Because after the first day you get the first set of results: data/votes, vote movement late in D1, N1 actions, etc.
Town Reads become increasingly important as the game progresses. How did X vote? Did X move their vote (bussing?) did X lead a wagon, did X question and support a wagon? Did X just fall in line? Data driven analysis compared to how someone posts is how you get a solid town read. It’s also how you get a solid scum read that stretches beyond a D1 opinion. So to answer those people, do I have townreads? None that I am going to share beyond what I already shared and yes I did in my longer post mid-way thru D1. Because I don’t think they are important to share.

Why my vote on Vashta? Do I have a game number? No. I remember in my read here that Brainbomb says he only recalls Vashta being scum once on game 17 or something. I don’t have a game number in my mind. He’s been scum for more than one game but then again Brainbomb doesn’t play every game. This vote is purely based on my recollection of the games as a whole stretching back six years. I’ve been away from the website for a year and maybe Vashta has played something since I am unaware about that has changed the narrative, but from my experience when he is scum he is quiet, he doesn’t post much at all, he hides, and he will make a few posts to meet minimum. What he did this game confirms my take on his scum play. Now maybe he changes that by entering the game or comes up with a theory of a player/game that changes my vote. Right now though he has done nothing to change my vote. In either event, if I do die D1 then someone needs to pressure Vashta because if he makes it to the end game as scum playing this way that is how the scum win. He’s done it before, I don’t remember the #, but it has to be watched.

Lastly, about my wagon, as there has been some debate on it. I honestly do not fault Ghug/Durga for putting their votes there. There is a lot of hatred on both sides. But, both of them are extremely lazy in doing this and by starting the wagon and putting their votes there it gives them an excuse not to scumhunt or really do much of anything. I view them, personally, as NAI. HOWEVER, if they are successful in daykilling me and continue to do the same thing (a) not reading the game, b) being lazy, c) not questioning people, d) putting votes on people because ‘popularity contest’.) then you all have to remove them from the game. Also anyone who joins the wagon needs to be examined because my wagon, if they are successful in making it a ‘popularity contest’ is going to be a great place for scum to hide. Someone will need to look at EVERYONE who joins this wagon late in the day and examine their reasons for doing so. While I may die (sad for me) the wagon may turn into a gold mine for future data driven scumhunting (good for us/town). Lastly, Brain posted a little analysis on me a page or two ago. It is true that I view myself as an outsider against the world. But, it is a false statement to say that I have no reason to feel disenfranchised. I quit this community and website because I felt that way and if it wasn't for one or two people who I still talk too I would not have come back to play this. So, your premise is incorrect even if you did stumble your way into a few things I do feel.

Nuff said

[teacon7]

I hope your food comas were good. Mine was.

I started reading one ages ago, but then life happened and it got dropped. What's a good solid game that yall would recommend?

I personally am most proud of M22.

I've done mafia and werewolf before - a lot of in person stuff, where it's much easier to tell if someone's lying because of their voice or their usual strategy. This is my first forum game, so I don't know anyone's strategy. I'll probably binge read a game or two to figure people out.

That's a decent idea, but practically speaking... it'd be surprising if anyone could binge read an entire game or two, just to get a sense of strategy. You're better off just playing a couple games.

Why did you pick these three as the ones who've done jack?

I looked at peterbot, and they seemed like the ones that people expected more posts from. Vashta and Dargo haven't been mentioned in ages.

Darg's a GM. Could be why he's not posting as much.

[teacon7]

##vote neph

Can you summarize your thoughts on Neph in one post for tired ghug? I'm leaning town on both of you, so I find this interesting.

It's mostly what I just said to Balki - he defended ND's actions in a weird way that wasn't accurate and seemed to assume he knew why ND was doing what he was doing without any reason to back it up.

@kgray - Is this the post in question?

ND seems town

Bitter and angry for probably out of games reasons

But town

ND supports red state policies and candidates. Lots of people do, even here in the game, but ND has the tenacity to be open about it. Given current events in American politics, it's not difficult to imagine why he might be on edge. My take on ND so far is similar to Neph's.

[brainbomb]

hmmmmmmm

[Durga]

Gee, who knew relentlessly attacking and insulting someone without provocation would make them vote you.

ND: Durga only votes based for personal reasons
Also ND: *first post of the game* ##vote Durga

[brainbomb]

@Durga

do you see anything of merit in what ND is arguing?

[Durga]

@Durga

do you see anything of merit in what ND is arguing?

What part?