M54: Not a Carrot Conspiracy

[Jamiet99uk]

If Balki's balls were the size of his ego he wouldn't be able to get out of the house.

[rdrivera2005]

This exchange between Fox and Balki is starting to remember me one between Teacon and Xorxes where both were town.
I think you two should take a break and look other things. Even if you are right there is another scum to catch and the Traitor. Because you are just hijacking the thread.

[rdrivera2005]

If Balki's balls were the size of his ego he wouldn't be able to get out of the house.

Lol. I wish I can +1 this.

[Foxcastle]

If Balki's balls were the size of his ego he wouldn't be able to get out of the house.

Lol. I wish I can +1 this.

+2

[Foxcastle]

This exchange between Fox and Balki is starting to remember me one between Teacon and Xorxes where both were town.
I think you two should take a break and look other things. Even if you are right there is another scum to catch and the Traitor. Because you are just hijacking the thread.

I took Flum up on his offer to reread someone (you). Who (or what) would you have me dig into?

[Foxcastle]

This exchange between Fox and Balki is starting to remember me one between Teacon and Xorxes where both were town.
I think you two should take a break and look other things. Even if you are right there is another scum to catch and the Traitor. Because you are just hijacking the thread.

This possibly has recently entered my mind for a very specific reason.

[rdrivera2005]

Balki, get a better strategy than town reading people who scumread you. Do you essentially copy and paste that every game lmao? Now I know why you refuse to scum read Chaqa. You probably just got lucky this time if Fox is scum.

Dude -- I know it's crazy, but I'm telling you! It is surprisingly effective. I can't play a bunch of games back-to-back, I think, cause it would be pretty easy for scum to just decide to come after me to get a town read from me, but...somewhat shockingly, I have found this tool to be very effective.

I've caught a bunch of folks over at Playdip using the same frame of thinking.

Could be that I am totally off track this game, and this is the reason, but I think the principle is sound: Scum, in general, avoid confrontation with people who they think will expose them, avoid major conflicts, and try to blend. Town flails around in the dark, does not shy away from making people mad, doesn't keep as good of track over what their various and shifting views are of everyone's alignment. It's all part of the same general framework.

#IhopeIdontlookdumbinthegodthreadrightnow

I don't agree with you, specially here where meta is so important. People like Brain, Jamiet, Ghug, ND and others will be confrontational either as town or scum because it's his meta and playing differently will make them obvscum.

[Balki Bartokomous]

So this whole "non-confrontation" thing that you've been pushing me hard on for most of game. You now say it's NAI?

Ah, I misunderstood.

No, I mean your discussion of my meta is NAI for me.

I still think that level of confrontation, effort to blend, and effort to please, are alignment indicative for many players, including you.

Here in this game, it was a bit more nuanced though. The thing that really stood out to me was when you called me your strongest town read. I just didn't believe it. I don't think it reflected the sort of paranoia that I would have expected from Scum!Fox. And I think that was part of your effort (perhaps subconscious or perhaps not), to stay out of a fight with me. Which, as I stubbornly believe, still, is something that most scum try to do.

But your behavior on Day 3 with respect to the wagon that flipped scum (once we saw the flip), is really driving the bus on my read of you now. I can't say I was super confident before the Bob flip. I have a lot more confidence now.

And then your complete 180 on your read of me, after I started calling you, looks really bad too. It reinforces my thinking that your initial "Balki is my #1 Town read" thing was insincere.

[Balki Bartokomous]

Yeah, I think this makes more sense.

In M1006, town-Balki sees my play as avoidant/non-confrontational/etc (which is similar to reads I often get). He uses it to successfully push me as scum.

I was searching for "confrontation" and not the terms he actually used when I reviewed that game, so thank you for pointing that out, Balki, because this is a much clearer indication that you are scum.

InM46, scum-Balki sees that behavior again, but he knows I'm town. Still, he knows it can work, he knows it's probably going to stick because I do behave the way he's going to scumread me. And so he does.

What makes Balki scum in this game is that he should know that me being "non-confrontational" is NAI, and if he were actually town, he would not have pushed that as part of his read. The fact that he is pushing it is scum indicative.

No, that's dumb.

You are assuming that Scum!Balki in whatever game that was was being sincere. I obviously wasn't. I was lying. I was scum.

[rdrivera2005]

This exchange between Fox and Balki is starting to remember me one between Teacon and Xorxes where both were town.
I think you two should take a break and look other things. Even if you are right there is another scum to catch and the Traitor. Because you are just hijacking the thread.

I took Flum up on his offer to reread someone (you). Who (or what) would you have me dig into?

Could you re-read Xorxes, specially D2 and see if I am wrong on expecting Xorxes to behave differently over Vecna lynch? Also, could you see if he was trying to shade me and set me as a myslynch?

[Foxcastle]

Yeah, I think this makes more sense.

In M1006, town-Balki sees my play as avoidant/non-confrontational/etc (which is similar to reads I often get). He uses it to successfully push me as scum.

I was searching for "confrontation" and not the terms he actually used when I reviewed that game, so thank you for pointing that out, Balki, because this is a much clearer indication that you are scum.

InM46, scum-Balki sees that behavior again, but he knows I'm town. Still, he knows it can work, he knows it's probably going to stick because I do behave the way he's going to scumread me. And so he does.

What makes Balki scum in this game is that he should know that me being "non-confrontational" is NAI, and if he were actually town, he would not have pushed that as part of his read. The fact that he is pushing it is scum indicative.

No, that's dumb.

You are assuming that Scum!Balki in whatever game that was was being sincere. I obviously wasn't. I was lying. I was scum.

You've missed the point.

[Fluminator]

I was planning on making a post that Rdrivera was playing this day exactly right if he was town, but then I notice him trying to take the heat off Balki/Fox, and according to the bot he changed his vote to Xorx???

Rdrivera, what happened to like, all the good stuff you were saying earlier in the day?

[Fluminator]

I think we should probably lynch someone on emc wagon or emc himself today.
The scummiest to me is Fox, but I will try to ISO the others too.
##vote Fox

???

[rdrivera2005]

I was planning on making a post that Rdrivera was playing this day exactly right if he was town, but then I notice him trying to take the heat off Balki/Fox, and according to the bot he changed his vote to Xorx???

Rdrivera, what happened to like, all the good stuff you were saying earlier in the day?

I started to think Fox x Balki could be town x town because both had chances to get the heat off, specially with easy other targets like me or EMC and they didn't.

And I scumread Xorxes since D2 and he slowly shading me with ridiculous reasons (and there is good reasons to vote me) make my read even stronger.

[rdrivera2005]

I was planning on making a post that Rdrivera was playing this day exactly right if he was town, but then I notice him trying to take the heat off Balki/Fox, and according to the bot he changed his vote to Xorx???

Rdrivera, what happened to like, all the good stuff you were saying earlier in the day?

And I am playing as town because I am town. I assumed I will be lynched (today or tomorrow, doesn't matter) and decided to just give any insight I might have.
If you have time you can also look at Xorxes like I asked to Fox.

[xorxes]

This exchange between Fox and Balki is starting to remember me one between Teacon and Xorxes where both were town.
I think you two should take a break and look other things. Even if you are right there is another scum to catch and the Traitor. Because you are just hijacking the thread.

This possibly has recently entered my mind for a very specific reason.

What specific reason?

[Balki Bartokomous]

@rdrivera, why do you assume you will be lynched today or tomorrow?

@chaqa, why do you assume there is exactly one scum between Balki/Fox? I understand why you rule out SvS. Why do you rule out TvT?

[xorxes]

I was planning on making a post that Rdrivera was playing this day exactly right if he was town, but then I notice him trying to take the heat off Balki/Fox, and according to the bot he changed his vote to Xorx???

Rdrivera, what happened to like, all the good stuff you were saying earlier in the day?

I started to think Fox x Balki could be town x town because both had chances to get the heat off, specially with easy other targets like me or EMC and they didn't.

And I scumread Xorxes since D2 and he slowly shading me with ridiculous reasons (and there is good reasons to vote me) make my read even stronger.

emc is not an easy target because he is not here and won't show up until EOD. He will become an easy target at EOD, but there's not much more we can do with him until then.

Which reasons against you that I brought up do you think are ridiculous, and what are the good reasons (besides the obvious one that you moved your vote off of Bob?)

[xorxes]

Yeah, I think this makes more sense.

In M1006, town-Balki sees my play as avoidant/non-confrontational/etc (which is similar to reads I often get). He uses it to successfully push me as scum.

I was searching for "confrontation" and not the terms he actually used when I reviewed that game, so thank you for pointing that out, Balki, because this is a much clearer indication that you are scum.

InM46, scum-Balki sees that behavior again, but he knows I'm town. Still, he knows it can work, he knows it's probably going to stick because I do behave the way he's going to scumread me. And so he does.

What makes Balki scum in this game is that he should know that me being "non-confrontational" is NAI, and if he were actually town, he would not have pushed that as part of his read. The fact that he is pushing it is scum indicative.

No, that's dumb.

You are assuming that Scum!Balki in whatever game that was was being sincere. I obviously wasn't. I was lying. I was scum.

Do you really lie when you are scum, or do you pick and choose which truths to put the focus on?

[Chaqa]

If Balki's balls were the size of his ego he wouldn't be able to get out of the house.

Lol. I wish I can +1 this.

+2

+3