Mafia XXXV - The WebDip Class Reunion

[bo_sox48]

Hey, there you go.

[rdrivera2005]

A tie will buy us time in a exchange of a town, probably Pounce.

Bozo tying is NAI, he could do that either as town or scum.

[bo_sox48]

That's funny because I was really hoping I wouldn't have to deal with this game anymore after today. Oh well.

[DemonRHK]

***DAY HAS ENDED, PLEASE HOLD***

[bozotheclown]

Hopefully rdr will look again tomorrow.

[DemonRHK]

FINAL VOTE COUNT:

rdrivera2005(2): bo_sox48, Pouncy Silverkitten, bozotheclown
bozotheclown(2): thamrick, rdrivera2005

-----

Unwilling to make a concrete decision, the alum retire for the day with no bloodshed.

Night 6 has begun, 24 hours remain.

[bozotheclown]

On phone, will be back online later.

[thamrick]

Any reason not to hammer the night phase?

[bo_sox48]

Nope.

##END

[rdrivera2005]

That's funny because I was really hoping I wouldn't have to deal with this game anymore after today. Oh well.

Me too. At least the next EOD isn't on Easter.

Good Easter for you guys.

[thamrick]

Nope.

##END

I think you have to PM the GMs. I've PM'd my hammer. If they want it here though,

##END

[bo_sox48]

Lol I did, I just posted it here to get the ball rolling

[thamrick]

Also, compare the D1 votes. It's easy because we all only voted once D1:

tham's:

Yeah. I'm really not understanding Jamie's play. I think xorxes deserves some attention too though. Very surface level play. Unfortunately, I'm heading to a St. Pat's party with my future in-laws so I'm not expecting to be around for the rest of the day.

##VOTE xorxes

Jamie is fine, but I think this is a better counter wagon than any of the 1 vote holders. Haven't seen anything that flags me with Bo.

bozo's:

As questionable as Vecna's move was, lynching a confirmed town is not is town's interest.

##VOTE Jamiet99uk

rdrivera's:

Jamiet reaction is completelly bullshit, but is it Scum? Why scum will make this kind of threat and try to lynch Vecna (that obviously won´t be lynched).
Bozo isn´t a bad option for a vote, his jump on Jamiet look really like an oportunistic scum vote, but he is alrady getting the pressure he deserves.

Bo´s reaction was also interesting, he came out of nowhere (hadn´t post in a while) and reacted exactly how I think a smart scum would react, being dismissive of Jamiet´s tantrum, but not pushing him hard.

Durga´s reaction was also odd, she seems to not fully believe Vecna is the Deputy, but also think Jamiet got to be scum.

@Durga - Care to explaing this, or it was just a joke?

For now ##vote bo_sox

I had this typed before the EoD, but figured no use posting it with 5 mins left. Not enough time to even discuss anything.

Discuss away now though: whose vote is scummier?

[bo_sox48]

Out of context, rdrivera's, by far, but that is in part because there are more aspects of his vote to consider scummy. For example, he voted me without questioning me and yet gave Durga the opportunity to explain herself, even offering her the out of it being a joke. That said, it's plain to see now that both Durga and I are town, so it's harder to say that this was anything other than maybe buddying. He also based the rest of his analysis, including his vote on me, on the presupposition that Jamie is town, which I think was fairly easy to tell at that point but not so easy to tell that you could take it as fact. Obviously, there were enough people that thought otherwise as well.

Bozo's vote was, as rdrivera said, opportunistic. In context, it looks even worse. It was his second-to-last post of D1, with the last one coming with 2 minutes to go in the day, over 30 hours later. Not to mention that it had no teeth to it. He was just jumping on board. I don't think he could defend against that.

Your vote, tham, is only bad if you're scum, and that's a can of worms I hate opening. Your reasoning for voting xorxes was 100% legitimate, but that doesn't mean it was well intentioned.

[DemonRHK]

##GM NOTE

Nighthammers are to be PMd to both GM, and MUST be unanimous.

[bozotheclown]

Yeah, I see the logical flaw, but I don't understand what conclusion you're drawing from it. Is xorxes being wrong incriminating?

xorxes is generally pretty good at analyzing things, correct? That's the "meta" book on him imo.

Why would he incorrectly analyze something to make bozo look good?

I also think that that may have been exactly what Bozo's plan was. Claim a peek D1 so that if someone did happen to cc FLUMINATOR, he could argue that Durga must have Oracle'd him. Durga was dead and she didn't say who she Oracled.

I don't know if xorxes made a mistake or he deliberately stated something he knew was not true, but what xorxes is doing here is trying to pocket me. Here is what xorxes said in his reads N3 after almost getting lynched D3 and a likely lynch D4:

EON reads, from towniest to scummiest:

Durga: She was the only one present for EOD yesterday, and seemed really torned when she had to vote ghug over me to avoid a tie. I doubt she was faking that.

bozo: good performance all around, makes solid arguments and is actually trying to solve this. I think he was correct that we should have lynched Fox rather than ghug, but I had a much stronger scumread on ghug.

Thamrick: Probably town, misguided town. His argumengts for voting for me (joke vote on Ezio and my asking brainbomb not to tunnel me) were weak, I think he just had made up his mind that he wanted to vote for me and then went looking for anything to justify it. But his conviction that I'm scum feels real.

Ezio: Not contributing much. The main argument against him (change of mindabout Jamiet) is actually something that I find more townie than scummy since scum tend to be careful to avoid voting against their previous reads.

rdrivera: He makes some contributions but nothing very memorable. Could be scum but I lean town.

Fox: Now that ghug flipped town it looks more likely that he is the roleblocker. A point in his favour is that he claimed DD before ghug confirmed that he wasn't, so he must have peeked and that's a risk for scum even if he knew he had much better odds than anyone else of not being BO_SOX.

nesdunk/dargo: By POE he is near the bottom of the list. I was ready to lynch nesdunk yesterday, but maybe he will change my mind.

reedeer/Poncy: Same as above, not much info but POE suggests at least one of them is likely scum. If both are scum. their lack of participation may explain why there has been so little EOD movement in the wagons.

bo_sox: He continues being my top suspect for the reasons I already gave. Also, asking people to contribute when he has been one of the least contributors...


General analysis: D3 was TvT and D1 probably was as well. Scum just sat back and enjoyed the show since they disn't care which way the voting went, and that's why they didn't even bother to be present at EOD (only Durga was around yesterday besides ghug and I). D2 was just a bureaucratic procedure.

Disclosure: Yesterday when it looked like I could be lynched I peeked at my nametag in case I was BO_SOX and thus could prove I'm town, but I wasn't, I'm KRELLIN. I think we should all peek today since we're at lylo and we need all the info we can get to make the right choice.

Here xorxes is trying to pocket me again. Considering the pressure he was under, he was hardly making me look good by town reading me like this.

[bozotheclown]

Also, compare the D1 votes. It's easy because we all only voted once D1:

tham's:

Yeah. I'm really not understanding Jamie's play. I think xorxes deserves some attention too though. Very surface level play. Unfortunately, I'm heading to a St. Pat's party with my future in-laws so I'm not expecting to be around for the rest of the day.

##VOTE xorxes

Jamie is fine, but I think this is a better counter wagon than any of the 1 vote holders. Haven't seen anything that flags me with Bo.

bozo's:

As questionable as Vecna's move was, lynching a confirmed town is not is town's interest.

##VOTE Jamiet99uk

rdrivera's:

Jamiet reaction is completelly bullshit, but is it Scum? Why scum will make this kind of threat and try to lynch Vecna (that obviously won´t be lynched).
Bozo isn´t a bad option for a vote, his jump on Jamiet look really like an oportunistic scum vote, but he is alrady getting the pressure he deserves.

Bo´s reaction was also interesting, he came out of nowhere (hadn´t post in a while) and reacted exactly how I think a smart scum would react, being dismissive of Jamiet´s tantrum, but not pushing him hard.

Durga´s reaction was also odd, she seems to not fully believe Vecna is the Deputy, but also think Jamiet got to be scum.

@Durga - Care to explaing this, or it was just a joke?

For now ##vote bo_sox

I had this typed before the EoD, but figured no use posting it with 5 mins left. Not enough time to even discuss anything.

Discuss away now though: whose vote is scummier?

This was D1 and there was not much to go on. I voted for Jamie because he was trying to lynch Vecna when it was obvious Vecna was the deputy. Here is Jamie's last post before I voted for him:

Anyone not lynching Vecna does not want town to win.

I do not require to post again in this phase.

If town does not lynch Vecna, I will ask to sub out.

There was no town reason for Jamie to try to lynch a confirmed town, and I am used to more reasonable play from him. Later he backed off, but I thought he might be trying to cover for his suspicious push on Vecna, and I did not see any better options.

thamrick's vote for xorxes is suspicious only in the he was the first to vote for xorxes, beginning his run of always landing on scum.

I do not know what to make of rdrivera here, but that is a lot of reads based only on reactions to Jamie.

[bozotheclown]

Yeah, I see the logical flaw, but I don't understand what conclusion you're drawing from it. Is xorxes being wrong incriminating?

xorxes is generally pretty good at analyzing things, correct? That's the "meta" book on him imo.

Why would he incorrectly analyze something to make bozo look good?

I also think that that may have been exactly what Bozo's plan was. Claim a peek D1 so that if someone did happen to cc FLUMINATOR, he could argue that Durga must have Oracle'd him. Durga was dead and she didn't say who she Oracled.

I said I checked my nametag D1 because that is when I check it and I thought it could be important for town to know in case my nametag had changed. I checked my nametag D1 because I thought it would be beneficial for town to know if they had any of the hidden powers.

[thamrick]

Yeah, I see the logical flaw, but I don't understand what conclusion you're drawing from it. Is xorxes being wrong incriminating?

xorxes is generally pretty good at analyzing things, correct? That's the "meta" book on him imo.

Why would he incorrectly analyze something to make bozo look good?

I also think that that may have been exactly what Bozo's plan was. Claim a peek D1 so that if someone did happen to cc FLUMINATOR, he could argue that Durga must have Oracle'd him. Durga was dead and she didn't say who she Oracled.

I said I checked my nametag D1 because that is when I check it and I thought it could be important for town to know in case my nametag had changed. I checked my nametag D1 because I thought it would be beneficial for town to know if they had any of the hidden powers.

What hidden power were you hoping to discover you had? When would you have revealed that hidden power? Also, did you consider that you could have been BO_SOX?

[thamrick]

@Bozo - still think I'm scum?