Mafia 88: Murder at the Meadery - GAME THREAD

[dargorygel]

In case no one announced... bot is ALIVE

Yes, thank you, very good work.

I won't take credit, that I know of

[Bonatogether]

Ok, yeah...I get that now.

Could we say that IF sweet were mafia, had seen those crumbs, cop would have been dead N4?

if sweet is mafia then cop is just nked and doesn't bring any crumbs up

That did not happen, did it?

Therefore by your own theory, Sweet is not Mafia.

So, why are you voting for Sweet?

that's assuming scum!sweet actually found a cop's crumbs. as outlined, i don't think scum!sweet (or scum!anyone) knowingly lets a cop live any longer than possible. i also don't believe town!sweet would take it upon himself to out a copscan instead of sitting on it and trusting the cop

[sweetandcool]

if sweet is mafia then cop is just nked and doesn't bring any crumbs up

That did not happen, did it?

Therefore by your own theory, Sweet is not Mafia.

So, why are you voting for Sweet?

that's assuming scum!sweet actually found a cop's crumbs. as outlined, i don't think scum!sweet (or scum!anyone) knowingly lets a cop live any longer than possible. i also don't believe town!sweet would take it upon himself to out a copscan instead of sitting on it and trusting the cop

Like the first part, don't like the last part.

Would love it if you managed to untunnel.

[Jamiet99uk]

if sweet is mafia then cop is just nked and doesn't bring any crumbs up

That did not happen, did it?

Therefore by your own theory, Sweet is not Mafia.

So, why are you voting for Sweet?

that's assuming scum!sweet actually found a cop's crumbs. as outlined, i don't think scum!sweet (or scum!anyone) knowingly lets a cop live any longer than possible. i also don't believe town!sweet would take it upon himself to out a copscan instead of sitting on it and trusting the cop

So, your theory is that Scum!Sweet is pretending to have found cop crumbs that do not actually exist, as a way to get town!Vecna miskilled?

But that would mean Sweet would be a 100% nailed-on daykill tomorrow, because if Vecna flips town (and is not the Miller, which scum!Sweet could not possibly know) then Sweet will be exposed as a liar.

You think scum!Sweet would sacrifice his own life, to get Vecna killed?

[Bonatogether]

That did not happen, did it?

Therefore by your own theory, Sweet is not Mafia.

So, why are you voting for Sweet?

that's assuming scum!sweet actually found a cop's crumbs. as outlined, i don't think scum!sweet (or scum!anyone) knowingly lets a cop live any longer than possible. i also don't believe town!sweet would take it upon himself to out a copscan instead of sitting on it and trusting the cop

So, your theory is that Scum!Sweet is pretending to have found cop crumbs that do not actually exist, as a way to get town!Vecna miskilled?

But that would mean Sweet would be a 100% nailed-on daykill tomorrow, because if Vecna flips town (and is not the Miller, which scum!Sweet could not possibly know) then Sweet will be exposed as a liar.

You think scum!Sweet would sacrifice his own life, to get Vecna killed?

obviously vecna hasn't come back yet, but 1) it could be that sweet is setting up a fakeclaim 2) it could be that it's an elaborate bussing scheme, or whatever

i just don't see why any reasonable town player would ever trumpet that there are visible crumbs in the thread, except with the intent of flushing the PR out

[sweetandcool]

That did not happen, did it?

Therefore by your own theory, Sweet is not Mafia.

So, why are you voting for Sweet?

that's assuming scum!sweet actually found a cop's crumbs. as outlined, i don't think scum!sweet (or scum!anyone) knowingly lets a cop live any longer than possible. i also don't believe town!sweet would take it upon himself to out a copscan instead of sitting on it and trusting the cop

So, your theory is that Scum!Sweet is pretending to have found cop crumbs that do not actually exist, as a way to get town!Vecna miskilled?

But that would mean Sweet would be a 100% nailed-on daykill tomorrow, because if Vecna flips town (and is not the Miller, which scum!Sweet could not possibly know) then Sweet will be exposed as a liar.

You think scum!Sweet would sacrifice his own life, to get Vecna killed?

To be fair, I was nearly the DK yesterday.

So the answer would probably be, "yes".

[Jamiet99uk]

If Sweet is lying, the real Cop will know that.

In that scenario, should the real cop claim, and condemn Sweet?

I am not sure.

Balki, you've gone quite quiet. I would like your opinion on all of this.

[Balki Bartokomous]

If Sweet is lying, the real Cop will know that.

In that scenario, should the real cop claim, and condemn Sweet?

I am not sure.

Balki, you've gone quite quiet. I would like your opinion on all of this.

I answered this question earlier. If the real cop has a guilty scan on Vecna, he should say nothing. If the real cop does not have a guilty scan on Vecna, and has scans results that are worth claiming for, he should probably claim.

But mainly, we just need to trust our Cop to do the right thing. He has an awful lot more info about the game state than the VTs have.

[Hamilton Brian]

I've come around and I've got faith.

##Vote Vecna

[Hamilton Brian]

I'd say the team consists of Vecna, King, and one of Bona or Dip. That's my gut.

[bozotheclown]

Lastly,

I did have one epiphany during night, one wondrous nugget.

This game was notable in that rdr pocketed me. I don't think that has ever happened and is a bit suspicious.

On top of that, before I got sidetracked by thinking the team was Vecna, LoW, Bozo, rdr was also listed as a top candidate.

Now I literally forgot why that was the case, but now that I have access to the bot I will review him because:

When Dip took over for rdr, he quickly assessed the situation and "correctly" decided to vote LoW. I think for a new player joining, psychologically speaking, it would have been very likely to place the traditional vote against the fake claimer Ham, rather than parse the arguments against it.

Particularly, if Dip was filling a scum slot, then regardless of Ham's alignment of course he would support the LoW wagon.

I think he must be scum. I will review his slot and see what fruit it bears.

PS, while I think the Ham wagon is a mistake, I will recognize that since Town allowed Ham to survive one more day despite wanting him gone, it's only fair for me to "return the favour", so to speak.

##VOTE Ham

This looks scum motivated, why start a wagon on a player you do not think is mafia?

[bozotheclown]

##VOTE SWEET

Excellent, Dip has revealed his true colours. I do appreciate the scumteam making this game easy.

##VOTE Dip

Okay, so the real mystery is who is the third Mafia? I still think it could be Ham.

Mafia could think damo is cop without believing him to have scanned Ham.

In fact, ##END

I couldn't be more confident.

This is when I started suspecting sweetandcool again during D4. I don't think a town sweetandcool would react to getting voted this way.

[bozotheclown]

Early D3:

Is anyone interested in flipping Bozo or Damo?

I could maybe flip Bozo.

Strongly prefer LoW or Vecna, but I could see Bozo being the third teammate. Would increase the chances LoW is Mafia if Bozo flips Mafia.

I'll just try it for now. But remember, Bozo wagon is what caused the tie yesterday.

##VOTE Bozo

But we have better options.

Then I voted for sweetandcool:

I am revising my mafia prediction to Bonatogether/Jamie/sweetandcool. They may not seem to fit too well together based on D1 voting, but there are some interactions between them that seem unusual to me.

Since sweetandcool seems to be the more widely suspected of the 3:

##VOTE sweetandcool

Then this:

Bozo: Quotes old reads list from beginning of D2 where sweetandcool towns them.
sweetandcool: But I scumread you because you saved your scumbuddy LoW (amongst other things), which happened EoD2.

Okay, I'm just going to ignore Bozo's smear campaign since it's pointless to waste my time on it.

Calling it now, scumteam is: Vecna, LoW, Bozo.

We just need to make sure to consolidate on one of them today. I have an extremely slight preference of LoW or Bozo because one of them being scum pretty much confirms the other, however we can't go wrong with Vecna either, so I am happy with that as well.

How could you be so certain about me and LoW being on the same team?

You withheld your vote in an attempt to either tie the vote or get someone other than Bozo or LoW.

You could have voted sweetandcool, which would have possibly saved yourself and your top Townread, LoW. But you saw it wasn't quite likely you could get a favourable result, so you withheld your vote until the last second in case you needed to accept a bad result and bus.

##VOTE Bozo
##END

[bozotheclown]

Hey Bona, if I can present a case that convinces you beyond a shadow of a doubt that I would not bus Will D1, would you be convinced I am not scum?

Or are there other greater reasons?

a self-case?

is there a more definitional case of wifom?

Yeah yeah, I get that. But N2 I thought of an ironclad case.

A sordid affair: The history of sweetandcool as Mafia

1. My first game as Mafia, M83, I got axed D1 by Ham. Okay, tough go, but I'll be ready next time.

2. My second game as Mafia, M84, my ENTIRE team of ghug, worcej, and Will hellbussed me into oblivion on D1. I was a bit upset that yet again I didn't get to really participate as Mafia, but at least I helped my team win.

3. My third game as Mafia, M86, Will unnecessarily bussed me to death on D1, despite me being the Godfather. After I entered the God Thread I was so upset I talked about just taking a very long break from the game. Worcej and probably others can vouch for how terribly upset I was.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, after all of that disappointment and anger over being bussed and not allowed to even enter the Mafia Chat and have fun making plans with my teammates, I decide this game to bus the Godfather of my team?

Absolutely not.

To believe I would do something like that you would have to believe:

Case 1: I wanted to get payback at Will.

Case 2: I came up with the genius plan of ignoring my feelings and natural mental state to bus my GF knowing that I could absolve myself of being a potential busser by posting this amazingly convincing argument.

Case 3: I'm secretly some sort of unfeeling psychopath.

Case 4: ???

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

In conclusion, anyone who thinks I would have bussed Will D1 either thinks incredibly highly of me or just doesn't understand basic human behavior.

I was completely off your case for a bit there, but those posts actually made me feel its much more likely you did in fact bus Will.

You trying to pass it off like its completely unrealistic that you'd feel its your turn now to get a good game as scum by getting some early bus cred after Will did it twice to you, because of some emotional argument simply does not fly as evidence, because thats just your words which we have no way of checking.

Moreso, you acting like the decision of whether to bus or not was some decision in a vacuum that was only based on your dislike from it happened to you in the past is also completely dishonest, because Will was getting deathtunneled by certain people and it was obvious that Bona was gonna crusade for that wagon to the death.

Also, even without reading today at all, that final thought has been stated at least a few times already in different words.

##vote sweetandcool

hopefully ill randomly check in to a page with a votecount later today.

If not, ill revert back to my earlier assertion.

Every time town sweetandcool changed my mind about his townyness it was with good observations, and attacks on people in his cute little ways, and things that made sense.

This time its long posts talking about his emotional state as a defence with some wifom nonsense.

This whole sequence makes more sense as scum theater than anything else.

[sweetandcool]

Bozo, I know you are certain I am scum, but you really need to untunnel. You are wasting your time on a fellow Townie.

[Bonatogether]

i think in all cases, there needs to be a recognition that sweet gains no town points for this - because an external player outing the cop is obviously inadvisable, we can't verify that he's not simply bullshitting, and even if the cop is proven to be what sweet is referring to, that he found a crumb is not evidence that he's town

[sweetandcool]

i think in all cases, there needs to be a recognition that sweet gains no town points for this - because an external player outing the cop is obviously inadvisable, we can't verify that he's not simply bullshitting, and even if the cop is proven to be what sweet is referring to, that he found a crumb is not evidence that he's town

I agree.

If I am not telling the truth (I am), then the next most likely case is that I am either trying to take out Vecna before I go down or PR hunting before I go down, or both really.

Or possibly trying to earn Town cred with a bus on my teammate Vecna. Although it seems Bona and Bozo won't be convinced in that scenario.

[Balki Bartokomous]

Yeah but where’s Vecna?

[Jamiet99uk]

Yeah but where’s Vecna?

He has not logged in to the site since Friday.

[Vecna]

but i am logged in now