hmm, still makes me wonder what happens to the other players involved n a PPSC game.

even if you can only get as much points as you get for 18 centers, you still reduce the amount of centers of another player. Wouldn't that player get less in that situation ? what happens to those points ?

Mmm, didn't know that. Thanks!

@ Akroma. Points are split among the other survivors proportionately to the center count. It's always a zero-sum game.

Bad taste to try to take more than 18 centres? What rot! This is a game of complete european domination - if you can go from 17 to 22 in a year, why not?

@Ivo, that makes very little sense.

i mean it is supposed to be PPSC, so if you wipe someone out they get less as they didn't survive, if you get to 21 and don't wipe anyone out an ndividual player will get less for the trhee extra sc you took from him, but you will get no more.

actually, you're right, that does seem kinda dick-ish. But WTA is how you should play dip. No-one who lets a solo happen deserves any points.

I think the code works like this:

Pot*18/total SCs owned by non-CD players goes to the winner
Then the remainder is split between the survivors.

18SCs is the win condition because it represents having over half of Europe, so you should be able to conquer the rest, so getting 22 is no different, you will still conquer Europe.

I don't think it in bad tastes. What about this scenario:

its the spring and you have 17 SC. There are 2 centers you could possibly take, but both centers are basically guess work, because the 2 other people in the game are not telling you anything. So you attempt to take both, as they are on opposite sides of your territory, hoping you will get one and solo. When Fall turn is processed, it turns out you got both because of bad tactics, and stupid chance, or a miscommunication, but regardless you have not won with 19 SCs

Is that bad taste?!

By the way, just for complete clarity - before the 0.9 update, you DID get more points for winning with more than 19 centers. But now you don't.

now won*

i won a game with 23 before... that was fun ;) i'd do it again too if I had a shot...

but in my case, it wont matter, i play pretty much only wta anyways ;)

The idea is to discourage SC grabbing by the winner at the end and stalling the game. If you can legitimately get 23 SCs without stalling the game for a year or two to pull it off, do it. It's fine. But some people complained that others were stalling at the 17 mark to get in position to grab as much (not just the win) as they could in that last year.

ahhh... well then its a good policy change...

no, I just had a great end of game stab along with an enemy that CD'd netting me 7 dots in one year ;P it was my highest ever gain in one year.

i think the arguement for it being bad taste is a situation where you specifically try to hurt one player (reducing his points by taking three extra SC from him which you didn't need to win, say) when it would be easier to jst grab 18 and win.

That the player is not getting his fair reward (in a PPSC game) for surviving with the second most supply centres (or however well he did)

@Ivo: Correct me if i am wrong in my assumption about what you meant.

Delay of game to get more SC (and therefore more points is in bad taste IMHO)

but i still claim that you should all play WTA and then none of this matters. That is to say, there is no value in holding out and coming second, Dip is a game with one winner and 6 losers, or a draw which is N loser and (7-N) people who agreed to a draw and didn't win or lose.

should mention - it was not on here... it was in a PBEM game... so maybe it dosn't count... my highest on a php app was 21 I think... dont know if it was here or on FB.

although, on FB, I do have a game that I feel is my most impressive ever win... a win with Russia in 1904... I was at 11 in 1903 and got 7! in 1904 for the solo... =P

i should mention i can understand why beinngers might want to play PPSC so they feel that the yare getting some reward from good play, but i think it messes with the mid/end game play by making people more willing to accept a draw and a strong second instead of fighting the leader to stop them from soloing.

also @Babak, 1904 with Russia? i kinda want to see that game, can you link FB games from here?

Timmi, if you take 2 centres but had to guess, of course that is fine, its just when you're delaying the game to try to get over 18 centres that its really not good.

I dont know if this will work:

http://apps.facebook.com/phpdiplomacy/board.php?gameID=4539

but on FB - you dont have the arrows under the map that you do here (one of the reasons I made the switch)

but you can click the button to make it a 'big map'... then in the address line, change the number from '7' to '0 through 6' to see S1901 to S1904 moves...

i hope you understood what I was saying and it was not confusing...

@orathaic, I think WTA leads to more draws as it encourages the allies to draw if they all want to get points and to be fair to each other, where as PPSC allows for more wins with strong seconds because the second is willing to get the points he or she earned. Look at the number of draws in the leagues and in general and I think you'll find WTA has a higher draw percentage than PPSC.

Draug is right... thats the way the game is supposed to be played... it ends with more draws... Wins should be rare things, because they should be REALLY hard to get... and once someone does Solo - they should be given the high accolades they deserve...

winning b/c one of your supposed competitors is perfectly happy being a loser (albeit in 2nd place) is really pretty lame... i mean, can you imagine a foot race, where most of the racers say, well, its ok if I dont win... as long as I tried my best and at least didnt finish last... what kind of win is that?

@Babak - they call those races marathons :-) Seriously, most marathon runners are in it to complete it and have no illusions that they will actually win it. Likewise, the cars at the back of an IRL, CART, or NASCAR race don't delude themsleves and think they'll win, they are running for season points and to get the most they can from their starting position. Only the front 5 or 6 rows tend to strive for a win.

Proportion of games drawn grouped by average G-Rating:

G-Rating range.50-100.100-150.150-200.200-250.250+
PPSC................0.18......0.23.........0.25.......0.41........0.40
WTA...................0.28......0.27.........0.44.......0.51........0.75

I've won with 26 SC's once. I just did it to show everyone that I could.