Sicarius, you are an idiot.

Wait... is this for real?
Trying to stimulate the economy?
That's the only justifiable reason for that bill to make sense, and it's still wrong.

IF YOU HAVE EVER GONE TO A FARMERS MARKET YOU ARE NOW A CRIMINAL

I beg your pardon? Criminal law rarely acts retrospectively.

I'm not sure where in the bill these criminal acts are specified - can you provide a link to the specific section?
As far as I can see, any food which is illegal is defined either at:

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode21/usc_sec_21_00000342----000-.html

or

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode21/usc_sec_21_00000343----000-.html

Criminal law CAN'T be retroactive. That's called ex post facto and is unconstitutional.

The bill seems to be designed to improve food safety, which in itself isn't a bad thing. The bad thing is the tapestry of regulation attached.

This is a bad law and the wrong way of going about keeping the food supply safe, but your demagoguery really turns people off. I assume you just copy and pasted some one else's article, so I won't blame you for the moronic statement that a potato from the ground will be illegal.

Also, it's just a House bill. It still needs to be reconciled with a Senate bill and will probably be much diluted.

How do you expect to be listened to when you talk like that, or rather steal from people who talk like that? You're almost right on principle here, but you're going about it like some rabid lefty. No one likes a rabid lefty.

Sic, can you please point to the parts of the proposed law that outlaw the three things you claim will be outlawed? I tried to find it in there but the reading was so dry I was quickly deterred.

I don't usually bite on this kind of thing, but I find bureaucracy interesting. And Sic, there's nothing in this bill about what you're saying. Sorry.

include, with respect to growing, harvesting, sorting, and storage operations, minimum standards related to fertilizer use, nutrients, hygiene, packaging, temperature controls, animal encroachment, and water;-is this saying that you have to have a minimum use of nutrients etc

Organic farms would be a "variance", as allowed for in the bill.

Family gardens are exempt if the food grown does not get sold to markets and enter the general food supply.

i tried reading the bill. i find the word organic is not even in there (ctrl+f let's you find words)

then i tried manually looking but it was so boring.

i do not think something like this will pass.

ditto with invictus on ex post facto

oh
@ dipperdon

where did it say no selling organic food into public markets?
someone give numbers and sections please.
espescially you sicarius. or else i'll believe invictus about your copying something.

Is there anyone here who thinks restaurant inspections and food safety training for restaurant employees is a huge problem and an example of "food police"? I doubt it.

Basically, this bill appears to treat any farm production the same way you want your restaurant treated. Workers would have to have a type of food handler card, meaning they go through basic sanitary and food handling education. That way, they'll understand they're not supposed to take a dump behind a row of wheat or tomato bushes, contaminating the food and getting people sick, like keeps happening with salmonella outbreaks. The farms will be inspected for food safety, just like your local restaurants. Sounds like a good idea.

Yes, there may be minimum standards for food production and handling. Probably a good thing. Do you think your local grocery knows whether the water used to grow the lettuce they sell came from a contaminated ground water supply or from treated potable water? No way.

The only real problem I have with it is that the bill requires states to follow and enforce whatever the new federal department lays down. That seems to be a major infringement of state's rights.

Sic, it strikes me that this regulation would actually prevent future Monsanto evil deeds rather than encourage them... government regulation often comes in when it is believed that an industry has externalities.

You guys may want to look up Morgellon's disease as it relates to GM foods.

Really? I just asked a neurologist (I'm assuming you're referring to the disease characterised by delusional parasitosis?) and he didn't mention anything about GM Foods.

Also, does anyone think Sicarius actually wrote most of that little rant? Doesn't look like his writing style to me.

Of course he didn't. He probably didn't even actually read the bill, either.

I only glanced at it. I can't imagine anything more boring than agricultural regulation reform. It seems bloated with a lot of kooky make work bureaucracy but not the tyrannical processed foods coup Sicarius seems to think it has. Again, I didn't read much.

The source he stole that little blurb from is quite far from reliable if it thinks past actions can be made a crime. That's just about the only place the Constitution is crystal clear. No ex post facto.

To say nothing about claiming potatoes become illegal if the new law passes...

If this bill came close to infringing on Farming rights or methods in any meaningful way, say to deprive farmers of profits or of their initiative, than you can bet that the Farm Lobby (fifth or sixth largest nationwide, last I checked (last year)) will have it's tentacles all over it, and NONE of the mid-west reps will vote for it, for fear of losing their constituencies. Yes, lobbies still work in politics. Anyone remember the Iron Triangle?

I think the point he's making is that the bill supports big agribusiness to the detriment of private farmers.

Did I just defend Sicarius?

I'm against this bill for basically the reason in Invictus's last comment. It also creates a new federal bureaucracy and invites it to go where no federal bureaucracy has gone before. Whether you're a small-government right-winger or an anti-corporate left-winger, you should be against this.

But man, Sicarius, the exaggeration is really annoying. Thanks for bringing it up, I guess.

Sicarius when you exaggerate you undermine your credibility. You might even have some good points/ideas tucked away within some of the nonsense you post, but you make it hard for people to see the wood for the trees.

Sicarius, please don't use your cheap marketing ploys here with us. It's insulting and degrading. But, yes, thanks for bringing our attention to the matter.

@toby bartels

Me am anti-anti-anti-anti-anti corporation.
Big government people!
There are 5 antis by the way ("double negatives" grammar nostalgia anybody?)

So, you are against the people who are against the people who are against the people who are against the people who are against government. Nice.

Yes I read the bill
Yes I wrote the rant.
I'm quite aware of constitution, when I said 'you are now a criminal' I meant you will be if this law passes.
if this law would prevent monsanto evil, why are they pushing so hard for it.
Look, This bill is sitting in committee and I am not sure when it is going to hit the floor. One thing I do know is that very few of the Representatives have read it, lik most of you who are critisizing. As usual they will vote on this based on what someone else is saying. Devastating for everyday folks but great for factory farming ops like Monsanto, ADM, Sodexo and Tyson to name a few. I have no doubt that this legislation was heavily influenced by lobbyists from huge food producers. This legislation is so broad based that technically someone with a little backyard garden could get fined and have their property siezed. It will effect anyone who produces food even if they do not sell but only consume it. It will literally put all independent farmers and food producers out of business due to the huge amounts of money it will take to conform to factory farming methods. If people choose to farm without industry standards such as chemical pesticides and fertilizers they will be subject to a vareity of harassment from this completely new agency that has never before existed. That's right, a whole new government agency is being created just to police food, for our own protection of course.
DO NOT TAKE MY WORD FOR IT, READ THIS LEGISLATION FOR YOURSELF. The more people who read this legislation the more insight we are going to get and be able to share. Post your observations and insights below, that is if any of you take the time to read it.

Pay special attention to
Section 3 which is the definitions portion of the bill-read in it's entirety.
section 103, 206 and 207- read in it's entirety.

Red flags I found and I am sure there are more...........
-Legally binds state agriculture depts to enforcing federal guidelines effectively taking away the states power to do anything other than being food police for the federal dept.
-Effectively criminalizes organic farming but doesn't actually use the word organic.
-Effects anyone growing food even if they are not selling it but consuming it.
-Effects anyone producing meat of any kind including wild game.
-Legislation is so broad based that every aspect of growing or producing food can be made illegal. There are no specifics which is bizarre considering how long the legislation is.
-Section 103 is almost entirely about the administrative aspect of the legislation. It will allow the appointing of officials from the factory farming corporations and lobbyists and classify them as experts and allow them to determine and interpret the legislation.
Who do you think they are going to side with?
-Section 206 defines what will be considered a food production facility and what will be enforced up all food production facilities. The wording is so broad based that a backyard gardener could be fined and more.
-Section 207 requires that the state's agriculture dept act as the food police and enforce the federal requirements. This takes away the states power and is in violation of the 10th amendment.

There are many more but by the time I got this far in the legislation I was so alarmed that I wanted to bring someone's attention to it.

now lets please have an intellectal disscussion where you stop attacking me personally, on somekind of banana in your ear defense, then perhaps for once we can all work together and sort through this instead of devolving into some sort or immature shouting match.

phew

also Ihave no illusons that the current government would honor ex post facto, and in fact didnt, which is how many nazis were tried and convicted under war crime laws that didnt exist when they were committed.
not to mention violation of the posse comitatus act, and the constitution in general in such misdeeds as the patriot act, the military commision act, th invention of executive orders, te violation of the 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 10th, amendments, and others, the 1917 espionage act, the constitution free zone, the use of private contrators (like blackwater, oh sorry I mean xe, and wackenhut) the creation of the federal reserve, the nationalization of the national guard, having a standing army in the united states, and having military do police work. just for starters.

You're nuts.

No, he coocoo










































for coco puffs