Thank-you, but this is not Sunday school.
Feel free to discuss religion but I think we can read up the Bible ourselves.

Um... Nobody saw Jesus rise from the dead. The found an empty tomb and his robes, but did not see him get up and when they first saw him, none of them recognized him.

Draugnar, that implies someone removed the body of Jesus from the tomb and impersonated him. Who do you think would have done that?

I saw a sign outside a church saying 'Jesus saves' and somebody had scribbled underneath 'but Messi scores the rebound'.
Football is a religion to many and it's not run by men wearing dresses and taking your money in the promise of a salvation you can't be sure will ever come. I can understand why normal working class people can have more faith in a sport than a religion because it's more honest, more transparent, more accountable.

...you've not heard of Sepp Blatter, have you Nigee?

Octavious
Don't talk to me about that crook .....

Football is entertainment not religion.
Football is not a way of living life. Religion is.

Gobbledydook
It's that beautiful naivety about religion that has led to its demise.
I'm sure once upon a time this is what it stood for, we all get seduced by the fairy story but reality bites.
If you can't see how football can be like a religion I guess you're not a big fan yourself.
The day that football players start to abuse little children and their managers try to cover it up could be the day I start to lose the faith

Religion is entertainment in many ways. Think of all the fundraisers, the potlucks, the group circles, the ladies' and mens' nights, the Alleluia parties, etc., and so on. That is just for one part of the Christian Church.

While I am a Christian, I disagree that football isn't religion. You've never probably played, watched, been part of, gambled, or lost on a team. It is as emotional, or more emotional than most anything that happens at church.

Think, too, of how football supports certain people's lives, just as does the church. Both have their superstars. Pele and Beckham are probably names that even non-footballers would know, similar to non-Christians having heard of Jesus.

I know people who live, eat, breathe football. I know people who live, eat, breathe religion. The corollary is that each sport is a different religion to whom devoted believers are obeisant, and that every religion is a different sport.

First, we have to kick down the divide of conceptual propaganda from the heads of large organisations and the church, then we can talk. Till then, we will be trading swats and that is it.

wait i thought that happens already?

Honestly, I don't see how you can claim that football is equivalent to religion. I see the simmilarities, but it makes religion sound much more benign than it really is.

By the way, guys. Here is another translation of the event into modern English:
http://www.bricktestament.com/the_life_of_jesus/the_empty_tomb/jn20_01.html
Everything that's written in black is a direct quote or paraphrasing; anything written in grey isn't. I highly reccomend this version! It has Lego pieces.

JECE
I don't think football is equivalent to religion but for many millions of people it has become more relevant to their lives than religion, something tangible.
I don't think religion itself has failed anyone but the pious fundamentalist zealots that purport to be the messengers have lost touch with the realities of modern day society, they have marginalised themselves, set themselves up as some sort of social elite where as we were led to believe that the meek shall inherit the Earth.
Football is of the people and for the people, if it ever forgets that it will also face an untimely demise. Until then it represents community, togetherness, hope, a sense of belonging, and they've got better songs .........

Sweet Zombie Jesus!

Mujus, please fuck off and stop posting Bible links on the forum. Nobody is interested.

The religious arguing with scripture is pretty similar to Trekkies arguing about the minutiae of shit that happened in different episodes. None of it is relevant to real life because it's all made-up anyway. Oh, really, you found a BOOK that says something? Check out a library sometime, you can find books that will say most things.

@Gobble - Mujus said John's *firsthand* account of Jesus rising. John had a firsthand account of the already risen but not yet ascended Jesus, but not of Jesus rising from the dead. It's a pedantic distinction but an important one nonetheless.

@thatwasawkward I detest that statement. The minutae of Star Trek are extremely important.

'Honestly, I don't see how you can claim that football is equivalent to religion. I see the simmilarities, but it makes religion sound much more benign than it really is.'

do we define things by the category they fall in, or by the qualities they exhibit??

orathaic: That is a good question. Ideally, I suppose, the two would coincide: categories are artificial constructs and only can be natural if they share a specific set of qualities. Since religion is a construct that encompasses constructs (religions) which espouse constructs (e. g. faith, divinity), then calling something a 'religion' probably has no meaning. And all this, by the way, is coming from somebody that doesn't have a very high opinion of philosophy, ha ha.

Jamiet99uk: This is your type of Bible: www.bricktestament.com ;-).

Brick testament is the best bible.

Again, it's not about religion in terms of philosophy or following rules or "being spiritual"... It's about a relationship with God, the real God, the living God. It's not about being "good enough." It's about admitting our need for God. We all need God; those who admit the need can receive what he has to offer, a free gift that changes lives forever.

Kinda begging the question isn't it Mujus?

And I don't just mean about whether or not god is real either. I mean, even if god is real, why do I need to have a relationship with him? Why do I need him? If I had a relationship with another person who was as controlling, arrogant, and draconian as god is said to be, I'd try to limit their contact with them, not make myself dependent on them. Every time I've heard someone describe their "relationship with god" it always sounds like a nightmarishly abusive one to me.

God sounds like a self-help scheme. Religion without responsibility.

Mujus: Sorry, but I really can't debate with anyone about that over a forum. But just so you know, I have never doubted the existence of a god; nor have I seriously considered the existence of one. I am a life-long atheist that doesn't claim to be spiritual. And no, I obviously don't feel like there is any hole in my life.

Mafialligator: In honor of Easter, I ask you to read the following:
http://www.bricktestament.com/the_life_of_jesus/the_empty_tomb/jn20_01.html

@ Mujus: "We all need god".

No, we don't. I don't believe in god and I have a happy and fulfilling life. Thanks.

Also, JECE, good call, I had a look at that "Brick Testament" and did find it quite amusing.