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SrgtSilver64 (335 D)
09 Feb 09 UTC
Is it poor sportsmanship or what?
What would you call it if a player who is obviously going to win because they have 17 supply centers decides not to take a supply center, but is instead intent on letting a weaker "friend" take you completely over from 13 SC's to 0. Just wondering and I would love to see your answers.
56 replies
Open
MatGB (100 D)
11 Feb 09 UTC
France with 5SPs CD in '03
http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=8591

The game's in the early stages, but I only just took England from CD in '02, giving Germany a massive advantage.
0 replies
Open
ungaro (1114 D)
11 Feb 09 UTC
Suicide
Not what you think ...
8 replies
Open
mwalton (2561 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Please for unpause for gameID=8461
This was a game that was paused when Concorde left. He is back, but we have alteast 1 country that has not logged in since Sunday (who would be CD by now).
4 replies
Open
V+ (5470 D)
11 Feb 09 UTC
Support for another power's attack in a gunboat game?
Does that seem suspicious to you? Check out this board (http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=8544). Ita supports (Tur) A Bul-Gre and (Rus) A Tyr-Vie. In a gunboat game, that's either uncanny anticipation or dodgy coordination. I'd bring it up in the game's global chat, but I don't want to break silence.

10 replies
Open
abab (1312 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
top tournament
Looking at the Hall of fame, it is striking to me how many very high pot people is there. There is "material" for a over-2000 tournament (31 players have more than 2000 points), or even an over-3000 tournament (13 such players; with one more volunteer, two full games could be launched)..
As a very interested spectator (not enough time to be an active player currently), I wish such a tournament organization might happen.
6 replies
Open
Ivo_ivanov (7545 D)
11 Feb 09 UTC
Two players needed - 287p to join - 24h PPSC
This is the game link
http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=8660

4 hours left and hopefully we'll not have to start with CD Italy/Germany
3 replies
Open
RBerenguel (334 D)
11 Feb 09 UTC
Game vanishing
I created a game but forgot to give it a name... as it had password, I just have created another. What will happen when time runs out and only one player (me) is left in it? I get my points back and the game disappears, I hope/guess. But... is it true?
2 replies
Open
sswang (3471 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
/unpause
How does it work? message inside
28 replies
Open
Maniac (189 D(B))
10 Feb 09 UTC
Does anyone know if
the player facing bush fires is safe?
2 replies
Open
superchunk (4890 D)
11 Feb 09 UTC
Great 15hr game about to start in a couple hrs!!
http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=8661

Hurry, 15hrs, 15pts!!! Lets play quickly.
0 replies
Open
Babak (26982 D(B))
04 Feb 09 UTC
A suggestion for Kestas and other developers
I wanted to suggest that you split the "games" tab into "CD openings" and "pre-game" or whatever. and I think you should only allow players who have FINISHED a game to play a CD position. (more explanation below)...
Babak (26982 D(B))
04 Feb 09 UTC
first - I tried to post this on the developer's site - but it required me to create an acct. I didnt want to do that.

also - I wanted to get wider community opinion/feedback before submitting it "formally" b/c I'm sure the idea can be improved on.

now to the reasoning:

1) too many newbies pick up CD positions only to CD. it does not help the game...

2) allowing new players to take CD positions turns them off to the game as a whole. many come through and have horrid experiences picking up an untenable CD country then decide this game sucks and leave. that does not help the hobby or the community.

3) requiring ONE finished game before being allowed to take CD countries ensures other players in a CD-stricken game that the new player is 'serious' and not just another dip-tourist. this helps promote people taking over CD countries as they can expect to be taken seriously. its a tough enough job without the albatross of lowered expectations from other players.


now some additional ideas to make taking over CD countries less 'costly':

A) separate 'normal' games and 'CD takeover' games in player's records. many 'good' players wont take CD games because they know they'll just get 'eliminated' or 'survive' at best and it would hurt their game record...

B) in other communities - taking over a CD is seen as an altruistic act and is rewarded with more points or by some other mechanism. people will take over CD nations and help balance out games making all games more worthwhile on the site... figure out a way to 'reward' CD-takovers in some way - make them cheaper to take - or give some sort of brownie points or something... (this is an idea that could certainly be fleshed out.

anyways - I'm sure many here have some ideas to share... or maybe can rip apart my idea if i'm missing some negatives.
Dexter.Morgan (135 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I like your idea of blocking new accounts from joining games in a CD position. I think that could definitely help the situation. The other ideas of tracking CD takeovers differently in our records and offering some kind of reward for the altruistic act has been brought up before (but merits repeating). I suspect that most would agree with these concepts... but the devil would no doubt be in the details - both in picking a particular solution and in properly coding it.
Babak (26982 D(B))
04 Feb 09 UTC
maybe I'm not familiar with how tough the coding can me - can someone shed some light on that element?

as for the risk/reward factor - I'll say this - I took one 2-dot CD Austria and turned it into an 8-dot 'survive' AH in a ppsc game (and I would suggest I improved the game). But now it is still a blemish on my otherwise perfect record (only in my own eyes - but still)

I wont take a single CD position again b/c I dont want all those 'survive' and 'eliminated' showing up as games played...

I dont think I'm the only one either.
RBerenguel (334 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
Well... if you really are that purist (and by the way, I share your opinion... I would be playing quite a few low pot CD's just to sharpen skills if I weren't sure they would show off as "defeated") you can write in your info some kind of detailed stats? Like

Austria 1 win 1 draw
CD Austria (2) -> (8) survived
France 1 defeated 1 draw
CD France No games

Or something along these lines.

chelseapip (303 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I agree with banning Newbies from taking over a CD as this would also get rid of many multi accounting accusations
TheClark (831 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I would like to be able to choose whether a game allows takeover of CDs. In the original rules players would decide at the outset whether takeovers would occur. Or at least agree during play whether the Cd will be taken over.
TheClark (831 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
CDs should be tracked in your history. If you CD then it is on record.
Xapi (194 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I have another idea regarding SCS's that I think might work. We should allow for player to make a second account, with a name like "username-CDTaker", and so that player can take CDs in games without it affecting his regular record. Obviously, if "username-CDTaker" takes a CD in a game "username" is playing, that would warrant a ban.
Ichthys (575 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
How long is it before one goes into CD?

Is it done on amount of time between logins or number of cycles missed?
abgemacht (1076 D(G))
04 Feb 09 UTC
I believe you go CD after missing 3 turns.
Chrispminis (916 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I think this is a decent idea.
alamothe (3367 D(B))
04 Feb 09 UTC
also, if another player takes over your CD, it should still appear as "left" (or "defeated") in your profile!!

anybody disagrees?
Centurian (3257 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I have stopped taking over CD positions because of the effect on my record. Seperate record would be great.
TheGhostmaker (1545 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
The reason I have a dislike of taking over CD is that there is a real problem with penetrating the diplomacy that has already occurred.

I would wager that people would be more likely to take over CDs for light entertainment if they were unrated.

alamothe, yes. Agreed
Robyrt (113 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I just started up a private game where 2 first-time players did not join in time. Thanks to the existing CD takeover rules, they were able to join before Spring 1901 moves with no problem.
Onar (131 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I also like the idea of making it easier to leave a game once you join. Maybe like, a button or something to click to go CD, rather than making everyone wait for you to not finalise.
Jacob (2466 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I also care about my "record". I won't join CD games because of the risk to my record.

I already have three draws and one survival that shouldn't be there... :/
alamothe (3367 D(B))
04 Feb 09 UTC
how did that happen Jacob??
Giwald (521 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
I think splitting the "joinable games" into pre-game and CD is a good idea.

As for the stats: It appears most people care more about the number of defeated/survived/drawn/won stats than the actual (D) points... but that doesn't mean everyone should have two accounts. It just means the set of stats that is being kept track of should be expanded, or basically split in two:

Stats (for games played from Spring '01):
* total:.
* won:
* etc....

Stats (for games taken over from CD):
* total:
* won:
* etc...

That way... we can also keep track of who is good at spotting playable CDs without having to spoil our "regular record" with bad stats for hard CD takeover attempts.

How about that?
Giwald (521 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
Needless to say, games taken over in Spring '01 count as normal games... this happens often when people pause to wait or a player get banned...
TheClark (831 D)
04 Feb 09 UTC
Making it easier to Cd with a command or button should be an option. It would make the situation more manageable. After 3 moves a players position deteriorates past saving.
Jacob (2466 D)
05 Feb 09 UTC
@alamothe - the three draws are from trying to do games with one hour phases... every time someone would drop out and then we'd be forced to draw because it was taking too long. Someone suggested making 24 hour phases next time and having a 15-minute honor time. Then if someone ducks out it would just revert to a normal game.

The survival is my brother's fault. I had to go out of town for a couple days and I left him detailed instructions on what I wanted done. I had just been stabbed but had made some awesome moves to counteract the situation. I was one move from gaining the upper hand. You can guess what happened - my brother forgot to input moves.... That one turn was the pivotal turn - instead of winning that game I died a slow death...that game still makes me more mad than any of my other games, because I had a clear path to victory and it was destroyed by my brother's ineptitude.

Chalks, if you're reading this, yes - I just called you inept!!

Those situations have nothing to do with the request of this thread, but they are blemishes on my record that I wish weren't there...
ag7433 (927 D(S))
05 Feb 09 UTC
Jacob, I think you are forgetting another draw -- I don't remember any of those situations.
Xapi (194 D)
05 Feb 09 UTC
I'd like to elaborate on the idea that I explained yesterday, and why it works better than most:

NO CODING.

We can do this right now, and eliminate many of the CD's replacing them with players.

All we need is for the Mods/admin state that it is OK to have a second account intended SOLELY to taking CD's over, wich has to be clearly associated through the username with the original player.

I know I would take two or three CDs myself is this was allowed.

The rest of the ideas are good, but require coding.

What do you guys think?
figlesquidge (2131 D)
05 Feb 09 UTC
A clever and interesting suggestion indeed, not really sure what I think though!
figlesquidge (2131 D)
05 Feb 09 UTC
(sorry to explain: whilst it has obvious positives, there are a lot of negitive possibilities to it as well - most notably you could just let your own games go CD then farm them up with your CD account)
Xapi (194 D)
05 Feb 09 UTC
Well, the usernames should let the players know that this is what is happening and they could report it to a mod.

There is, however, the posibility that other players take a friend's CD.

Of course, given the amount of users whose only action in this site is "Take a CD, go CD, never come back", I think this sort of problem already exists.

The definitive solution should be a "One CD, All CD" policy, IMHO, but then again, coding.
Babak (26982 D(B))
06 Feb 09 UTC
xapi - I dont think I like it - then I'd have to log-in to two seperate accounts... I like having my games all on one page across the tabs at the top.

as for coding - it might be tough - but they are coming out with a new version sometime this spring if I understand correctly - so we'll see if they include this CD-improvement idea.

but what WOULD be great and quick is if they split CD starts from '1901' game starts. and not allowing new players to pick up CDs... they have no clue what is good and what is a bad CD to pick up.

Chris - glad you like it... what does Kestas think? how is the programing requirement? is it really tough?
paulg (358 D)
06 Feb 09 UTC
Newbies taking over CDs add to the pot. I like it. Also, newbies to the site may be experienced players.
Babak (26982 D(B))
08 Feb 09 UTC
here is a great CD country - I wish I had 4 more pts.

http://www.phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=8304

Russia at 9 dots, France leads with 10, and Turkey at 7 but ready to go into CD also...

someone take this and get some extra points ;) maybe even a solo.
Babak (26982 D(B))
09 Feb 09 UTC
bump - until i get some form of 'official' input if possible.
figlesquidge (2131 D)
09 Feb 09 UTC
What official input do you want? Does that accept anyone other than Kestas?
I think what you're saying is basically that there should be more different options in the statistics. In that case I rather agree, and think it would be nice to have 3 options: Normal - CD Takeovers - Varients
Saying that, I haven't fully thought through the details of the scheme, and it might be rather hard to understand. As far as coding it goes, it wouldn't be hard
Draugnar (0 DX)
09 Feb 09 UTC
PaulG is right. Some of us old Judge players only recently discovered phpDiplomacy. So the limit on new players means your are limiting some potentially good players from filling in the holes.
figlesquidge (2131 D)
09 Feb 09 UTC
There's only two restrictions on new players I know of?
1) You can't start a WTA game until you have over 100 points, but you can join them anyway
2) You only have 100 points, but whats the need of a points system where everyone has all they want?
Babak (26982 D(B))
10 Feb 09 UTC
Chris - here is a thread where a suggestion is given for improving the community... many constructive responses added to the original idea and proposal... and the only response so far from the developers (you) has been a short 5 word 'atta-boy' pat on the head..

just THIS idea alone would improve the quality of all games as CD take-overs by new CDing players are reduced... and new introductions to the hobby are made with brand new games instead of picking up untenable CD situations.
MatGB (100 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Splitting new games and CDs would be a good thing, I'd always rather find a new game, but I also like browsing through CDs.

But blocking new sign ups to the site from taking over ALL CDs? No. I started both on FB and here by taking over CDs, and I'm fine. In fact, I just signed up to this site and am happily negotiating from some nice CD positions.

A warning to new sign ups that novice players shouldn't join CDs would be a GOOD THING. But blocking it completely? When you've got people swithing from the Facebook app or looking for online play that already know the game?

No. No no no. Bad idea, offputting and exclusionary.
figlesquidge (2131 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Babak - in his defence, Chris doesn't develop the code, so why would you expect a more detailed response from him?
I have helped with the code quite a bit, and have posted on several occasions, but you don't seem happy with my views.
When the conversation went to the idea of making a second account, I mentioned a problems - You could easily use this to farm out your bad games. However, your view is that they should be separated in the statistics I believe? I know I mentioned this before but I'll repeat it.
I think it would be a good idea to add some more details to the statistics data on players, and separating the number of games that were CD in this would be a good idea. Moreover, I think there should be many more options when you create a new game, and one of these should allow you to mark a game as being "varient". This would separate these out in statistics as well, helping show the players who are very good, but have poor statistics after playing variant games.

Oh, and MatGB - I totally agree, players should not be banned from taking over CDs. It would be nice to have a rather more expanded FAQ that would cover what CD is and how to deal with it, but blocking people from taking them over is never going to be a viable option
maintgallant (100 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Having read Babak's initial statement, and the first replies, I think his idea is excellent. Also, the forum itself could use a little practical division. I'm embarrassed for the phpDiplomacy community for some of the logs created, and giving an appropriate area for these discussions (like politics) may improve the site atmosphere. The whole process can be improved with a little diversification and division.
kestasjk (95 DMod(P))
11 Feb 09 UTC
The next version has a search panel that lets you specify whether you want to see CD games or pre-game games, or all games you can join, and order them by whatever you want. This feature has been suggested many times on the developer forum, and I've responded to it many times, and I've even acted on it and implemented the change (and had to tell people this many times)

Sorry if you think I shouldn't skip over your feature request, but you'd have saved yourself some time if you had used the developer forum (that's what it's there for)
kestasjk (95 DMod(P))
11 Feb 09 UTC
> I think you should only allow players who have FINISHED a game
> to play a CD position
This is a separate feature request, and responding to many requests in a single thread means when someone else wants to discuss this or has a similar idea you have a whole bunch of discussions in one thread

This stuff is what the developer forum is for, if you don't want to put in the time to create an account, or check that others haven't already suggested your idea, don't expect me to put in the time to carefully consider your ideas

I'm sure you can understand my todo list is already huge (my phpDiplomacy-specific todo list and my general todo list of which phpDiplomacy dev is a single item), and this makes taking part in long discussions about many new ideas an easy thing to cut out.

If you really want your ideas to be counted and considered please use the system we have in place for it and post them in the ideas section on forum.phpdiplomacy.net
Babak (26982 D(B))
11 Feb 09 UTC
figles - my apologies - I was under the wrong assumption that Chris was one of the developers... sorry. - my bad.

on the issue of new players taking over CD positions - there should be a more explicit warning than just on the FAQ page... there seem to be way too many CD positions picked up by random new dip-tourists who then decide thats not what they want and they dip out (yeah that was a pun). i can see the reasoning that vet players might still want CD positions - but still I wonder if its not best for those who are already in the game to know that someone picking up a CD position has at least finished a game - so they can then, with some assurance, engage in diplomacy with them so they are taken seriously.

kestas - thanks for the clarification.




41 replies
Jerkface (1626 D)
11 Feb 09 UTC
Free Fun Language Learning
I've been having a real fun time in the last couple of days learning Spanish on www.livemocha.com. They have other offerings, but it's a pretty darn cool website. You can submit audio and typed samples to get them corrected by natives from all over!
0 replies
Open
Tetra0 (1448 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Game "Enemies Closer"
A new game, pot: 75.

I am creating it mainly so me and a couple (2-3) of my friends at UW-Eau Claire can play diplomacy, but we'll need more players. I can promise (at least on my part) that there will be no metagaming, and I guarantee that we all stab each other pretty often, so no need to worry about "unbreakable" game-ruining alliances.
7 replies
Open
xgongiveit2ya55 (789 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
New Team Tournament
So I had an idea for a new tournament played in teams. All entrants would be grouped into teams of 3, and every game would be between 2 teams with CD Italy. I would use the ghost ratings to assign teams. Does this sound appealing to anyone? Any suggestions? This idea needs refining, and if the tournament happens it won't be for at least a month or so.
28 replies
Open
mapleleaf (0 DX)
10 Feb 09 UTC
new game...
For all of you cheapskates.
2 replies
Open
maintgallant (100 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Yet another Kestas/Developer suggestion
There are individuals that one does not get along with, or has suspicions of multi-accounting/meta-gaming. It would be very useful if during the game set-up process (or even in my own options menu for a more permanent solution) I could make a public game that excluded certain players, or simply have them denied access to games I am playing.
16 replies
Open
mab (113 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Disbands
If someone has no retreats available, or no SCs left (and so the disbands in autumn are a mere formality), why does the game wait for user input?

3 replies
Open
LiesAllLies (160 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
"European Death"
24 hour phases, 30 point buy in, and....idk...join
0 replies
Open
mwalton (2561 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Do Something Different! starts in 4 hours
75 points
18 hour phases

Currently only has 3 players.
1 reply
Open
Troodonte (3379 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Unpause - Beginnings Autumn 1903, Retreats
This game was paused cause one of the players lives in Victoria - Australia and asked for during fthe fires.
Now, that player wrote /unpause, like all the players, except one that has ZERO SC and is not connecting anymore /he has only one more game running and is almost finished too).

Could someone unpause it for us?
2 replies
Open
Concorde (0 DX)
08 Feb 09 UTC
moderators/admin- URGENT- Natural disaster is about to affect my games
Hi-
I live in Vitcoria, Australia, and fires here have killed 50 people and cut off my town as it comes down on us- i need all my games paused- or someone to take em over for a week?
URGENT
57 replies
Open
jwm0112 (100 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
Control (Loss) of Supply Centers
France moved into Spain in the Spring and then on to Portugal in the Fall, and somehow managed to lose "control" of Spain at the close of the Fall turn. I am under the impression that control is maintained until it is taken away. Is the loss of a supply center by moving from it a rule specific to this site or am I missing something?
15 replies
Open
DipperDon (6457 D)
08 Feb 09 UTC
Pre-planned Alliance vs Preplanned Adversary
I've read many comments in other threads saying it is unethical to go into a game with a pre-planned alliance.

What about being a pre-planned adversary?
7 replies
Open
SrgtSilver64 (335 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
"The Most Dangerouse Game"
10 points buy-in
24 hour phases
JOIN NOW!!!.....please
5 replies
Open
Sicarius (673 D)
08 Feb 09 UTC
Help me with history
someone tell me of a country that has created a secret prison system where torture takes place, that didn't eventually turn it against its own people.
modern countries only (last 150 years)
do this and I will come to your house and cook you dinner
98 replies
Open
Sicarius (673 D)
09 Feb 09 UTC
BASH BACK!
I'm curious what some of you think of BASH BACK! and would like to hear your opinions

if you have no idea who they are you can easily find out
6 replies
Open
mapleleaf (0 DX)
08 Feb 09 UTC
New game...
Easy Roasted Fennel.
All are welcome. Try this out. It's a yummy vegetable.
8 replies
Open
superchunk (4890 D)
10 Feb 09 UTC
NEED ONE MORE! hurry.
Gunboat game, 75pts, PPSC, starts in ~2hrs
http://phpdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=8629
0 replies
Open
Lord Alex (169 D)
01 Feb 09 UTC
Medieval Total War II
Does anyone here play it???
68 replies
Open
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