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Finished: 01 PM Mon 09 Sep 19 UTC
Cannonboat III
16 hours /phase
Pot: 100 D - Autumn, 7, Finished
The Ancient Mediterranean, No messaging, Anonymous players, Sum-of-Squares Scoring, Hidden draw votes
1 excused missed turn
Game won by Murder Cat (185 D)
30 Aug 19 UTC Autumn, 3: GameMaster: Game was extended due to at least 1 member failing to enter orders and having an excused missed turn available. This has un-readied all orders.
02 Sep 19 UTC Autumn, 4: GameMaster: Game was extended due to at least 1 member failing to enter orders and having an excused missed turn available. This has un-readied all orders.
08 Sep 19 UTC Hey greece, you played a masterful game there. Nice job keeping Rome in check. I almost thought you guys were the same player there for a bit.
08 Sep 19 UTC GG everyone it was a lot of fun. The opening moves were stacked heavily in my favor with Greece making no play at Dalmatia and Carthage opening towards Egypt. I was shocked to say the least at how little resistance Greece put up, which I think is the biggest reason I went from an advantageous position to a winning one.
09 Sep 19 UTC Hey yall am I wrong but does Greece ever stand a chance in this game? I’ve played a few and Greece always seems to get taken out first. I thought this player’s opening moves to Cher were a good choice but obviously they didn’t pan out. Also was there anything I could’ve done better? I felt like there was nothing I could do getting attacked on both sides. Let me know. Id like to give it a better go next time
09 Sep 19 UTC The last cannonboat I won as Greece
https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=244957#gamePanel

The opening of Mac-Dac to threaten taking Cher is good, but also moving Athens-Mac is playing your hand too early in my opinion. If you make both of those moves, you telegraph that your only option is to go for Cher and Byz in the first year, and Persia might have locked themself into going for Cher and Sinope in the first year, and Cher will just bounce.

It's my view that Greece needs to take Dalmatia in the first year, for a couple reasons. First, if Greece neglects it and moves all in on Persia, Rome snaps up both Vind and Dal and can easily move in on Greece home centers--especially if they are everextending into Persia and leaving their belly exposed. By putting an army in Dalmatia and then Epirus or Illyria, Greece has set a defensive line against Rome who will see that and devote all resources towards Carthage except for the two armies in Vind and Ven. Second, going all in on Persia the first year is NOT required to beat Persia. I believe that Greece has a huge advantage in the fight for Cher and Sinope: The Black Sea. Only Greece can reasonably put a fleet in the Black Sea in the early game, and Northern progress against Persia is swift--especially if Persia is also distracted by Egypt in the South.

In this game, by allowing Rome to take Vind and Dal, Greece left themselves defenseless and with no incentive to not be attacked.

As Carthage, I think it's necessary to open to the Punic Sea and take Sardinia. By attacking Egypt instead and going for Leptis, Rome is allowed to take both islands and Balaeres practically uncontested. As Carthage or Egypt I like to make peace with the other and focus on our Northern neighbors, Rome or Persia respectively, starting in the opening moves. Sometimes I might even let them into Leptis in the second year as a show of good faith. But either Carthage or Egypt attacking the other in the first year gives the advantage to Persia and Rome.
09 Sep 19 UTC Also Cannonboat IV is live if anyone wants to play again. My intention is to keep these running for a while if people continue to want to play them.
09 Sep 19 UTC https://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=246046
09 Sep 19 UTC My mistake in Persia in this game was letting greece take Cher. It is just way to dangerous of a flanking situation and persia has to keep two resources in play to keep Cher from moving into hinterland of Persia. I should have bounced.
09 Sep 19 UTC But this map is all about balance and if one power is weak and lets another power get too strong too quickly, the power balance dynamic quickly changes and frankly everyone should react to counter, as Egypt and I finally started too at the end of the game to try beat back Rome in a situation where we couldn't directly message eo.
09 Sep 19 UTC Frankly to me, Greece's moves were so astounding I had asked the GM if there was a cheating situation going on. Greece's commitment to an eastern move exposing his backside was ....wow. And that allowed Carthage to be crushed so quickly and almost Persia.
09 Sep 19 UTC Cool, thanks a lot for the advice!
09 Sep 19 UTC After a few AM games I have come to the conclusion that an Egypt-Carthage war is bad news for both sides. Progress is possible but it is slow and depends to a great extent on what the other powers do.

Getting stuck into a war with Persia, which I tried to avert by issuing support orders in Autumn '02, stymied me on the other front, and ultimately left him vulnerable to Rome's expansion.
09 Sep 19 UTC I basically made three big mistakes that essentially threw the game for myself. First was the bad opening, as Rome explained in depth above. Next, I should have paid better attention to the board. Carthage not opening to Punic should have rung alarm bells about the dangers of an overly-powerful Rome and I should have stopped at Cher and work to check Rome early. Third was the worst mistake and just kinda an utterly terrible decision. I should have turned around the moment Rome moved. In the time, I was thinking about possibly ending Persia, holding a stalemate in Cherson and Byzantium, and turning it around with Egyptian help. In retrospect, this was absolutely loony and just far, far too optimistic. Time controls might have played a part here as I believe I was low on time, but even that isn’t much of a justification as I should have just taken the missed turn and taken my time to actually think about the situation
09 Sep 19 UTC I basically made three big mistakes that essentially threw the game for myself. First was the bad opening, as Rome explained in depth above. Next, I should have paid better attention to the board. Carthage not opening to Punic should have rung alarm bells about the dangers of an overly-powerful Rome and I should have stopped at Cher and work to check Rome early. Third was the worst mistake and just kinda an utterly terrible decision. I should have turned around the moment Rome moved. In the time, I was thinking about possibly ending Persia, holding a stalemate in Cherson and Byzantium, and turning it around with Egyptian help. In retrospect, this was absolutely loony and just far, far too optimistic. Time controls might have played a part here as I believe I was low on time, but even that isn’t much of a justification as I should have just taken the missed turn and taken my time to actually think about the situation

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

Rome
Murder Cat (185 D)
Won. Bet: 20 D, won: 100 D
19 supply-centers, 16 units
Egypt
diplomat61 (243 D)
Survived. Bet: 20 D
9 supply-centers, 10 units
Persia
edwolliver (131 D)
Survived. Bet: 20 D
6 supply-centers, 6 units
Greece
Acgv (326 D)
Survived. Bet: 20 D
0 supply-centers, 2 units
Carthage
wwar (25 D)
Defeated. Bet: 20 D
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