Putin is a big man...he can say "cultural issues", but is too much of a coward and a pussy to identify them directly.

So Puttybaby....what do you think about my sad Golf team experience. My daughters should be put back on that varsity golf team, shouldn't they?

You haven't provided any solution to anything, Tendmote. So doctor, heal thyself.

And you've given Krellin a complete pass, probably even plus+1'd, his horrible posts.

@Putin33 It's also a question of emphasis to what extent issues within that community might create the need for affirmative action. Clearly Krellin feels that's largely the cause, and you mention it only in passing. Probably the real answer is in between you two near-extremes, but it is open to debate.

Why should I offer a solution when I have none? Knowing you have no solution is better than trying to sell a false solution.

Krellin's original post was sensible, if frustrated. After you dismissed him, he did go a bit crazy. I'm giving him a pass though, sure. He's angry.

Puttybaby....keep attacking me. Good job!!! God forbid you actually address anything I actually wrote.

Attack attack attack ....that's what the weak-minded retard does when he has no answers.

No his original post was not sensible, it was replete with racism, and I doubt you even read it.

I was asked about the causes of the test score discrepancy. I gave an outline of all the contributing factors. I did not mention it "in passing". That's your editorializing, as usual.

You don't read, you ask the same dumb questions and offer nothing but criticism and n no solutions and it's really annoying.

tendmote - I'm not angry. It's great fun making Puttybaby dance like a good little monkey. It's fun watching him squirm and rush to the attack when he has nothing of value to say in defense of his overtly racist attitudes that minorities are too deficient to succeed on their own without big white man's help.

Keep on being a good racist warrior, Puttybaby. I'm sure Vladimir is proud of you....especially given your recent stance wherein you hated on women. Damn, all you ahve to do is hate on a homosexual and Russia will be sending you a first class one-way ticket and a corner office.

"tendmote - I'm not angry. "

Yeah you are. You put on a good front and try to be cute but you're a really angry person. Why?

Putty putty.....man up, bitch. Answer something ....just one thing...I said directly.

For example...when black enrollment and black enrollment ALONE dropped significantly at UoM after changes in admission policy....please indicate how this is a "racist" observation, and please tell me how this is anything but a problem within the black sub-culture.

Hispanic culture in this country...in Michigan...probably has a very similar level of poverty as does black culture...so it isn't a socio-economic factor.

So please, oh wise racist Putty...explain this to me.

Or....are you too much of a coward to actually address the truth?

Putty putty putty....there you are....ignoring the topic again, chooising to deflect and attack me.

Ahhhhh....good little dance monkey.

@Putin33

You mentioned this:

"There are also cultural factors such as family structure, parenting, and peer ridicule which may play a role."

That's one sentence against which Krellin wrote an entire frustrated screed on the same topic. I'd say that counts as treating it "in passing" relative to how others see it. Now, you can argue that Krellin is emphasizing this aspect too much, but it is the same that you brought up, with different weight. One sentence vs. a nonstop Krellin-to-Krellin-to-you mega-rant.

Michigan has a negligible Spanish-speaking population, and you have no economic data to back up your claims. It's not a racist observation, your claim that the black community is responsible for the entirety of the achievement gap in education is racist, as you refuse to acknowledge resource gaps, or access to certain curriculum, or the issue of placing black children in vocational curriculum at an early age, or any other factors because they do not comport with your anti-black narrative.

And while we're at it, while don't you finally answer the question I've asked you about 50 times now, and that is what have you ever said that you actually believe? How much of your e-persona is pure fraud, and have you ever told the truth in your life?

Tendmote I don't know why you're making excuses for Krellin's anti-black rants. He didn't mention any other factor whatsoever, not even in passing. The entire problem is black people's fault according to him, and he said nobody should consider the drop in enrollment a tragedy. He's a racist and proved it time and time again. The only person on the planet that makes excuses for him is you.

@Putin33 You should acknowledge that what he said is no different than what you said, except for emphasis and lack of balance with other factors. Then perhaps Krellin can be persuaded, and we can work out some mutual understanding. Putin33, what is it that Krellin should admit in return?

I've got to bring you two together... thesis... antithesis... SYNTHESIS! Tendmote: the negation of the negation.

Putin -- you idiot, the size of the population of Hispanics in Michigan is **irrelevent*.

The Hispanic enrollment at UoM did NOT drop significantly.

You have thrown up a straw man argument because you are afraid to answer the question.

You want to talk about resource gaps...they exist very much so in the Hispanic community, and yet the Hispanic enrollment didn't fall any more than any other minorty group EXCEPT for black enrollment. Black enrollment ALONE fell dramatically.

So are you saying that suddenly the Hispanic population in Michigan is just as economically viable as the White population?

lol God you are an idiot. This is so easy to demonstrate you complete and utter lack of ...well, I'm not sure if it's a lack of integrity, or just plain stupidity.

Anyway, you are a coward. Until you dcide to directly answer anything I have said, I'm done. Your refusal to address my topics directly is tacit admission that I am right, and you are wrong/a liar/a racist.

Thanks for playing, dance monkey.

There will be love.

"and have you ever told the truth in your life?"

I feel like putin is projecting.

Ah I just figured out something about Putin33’s writing style. He constantly complains about people not reading what he writes. People read it, but the condescending preamble comes first and tends to overwhelm the part where he actually says something.

Let’s have a look:

“It's not a racist observation, your claim that the black community is responsible for the entirety of the achievement gap in education”…

Yeah, it was the only thing Krellin mentioned, but I don’t think he was outlining a comprehensive explanation, just speaking his mind.

…“ is racist,”

OK, at this point you’ve just called him a racist for speaking his mind. Interest in what Putin33 is saying… is getting lower… recall of anything that follows is likely to be dim…

…“ as you refuse to acknowledge resource gaps, or access to certain curriculum, or the issue of placing black children in vocational curriculum at an early age, or any other factors”…

He didn’t mention them, but he didn’t deny them either. You’re totally taking advantage of a gap in Krellin’s statements to demonize him. You’re extrapolating this from Krellin’s (in my opinion wrong) equating of Latinos and Blacks in Michigan admissions, but Krellin didn't “refuse to acknowledge” anything.

…”because they do not comport with your anti-black narrative.”

OK, here you just made up a fake reason for the fake thing you created in what Krellin didn’t say. Demonization complete, wait a minute, did Putin33 say anything?

Jesus Christ man, maybe acknowledge the extent with which you agree with Krellin (because at some level you do, it’s clear from the statements) and ask him to acknowledge the things you feel he’s giving light treatment, and indicate clearly how and why Latinos in Michigan are not really in the same socioeconomic category as American Blacks.

This win-the-argument/argument-skill mentality is destroying the value of having any kind of discussion.

@Krellin - your ranting is also unreadable. I didn't read any of it past your initial post.

Hey Putin (or anyone) can I ask a serious question?

Why do we (modern day "whites") have any responsibility to correct for the actions of our ancestors?

Oh no you didn't...

Oh yes he did...

@Chaqa you just totally alienated every non-white person here by equating "we" with "modern day whites"

You also offended ancient day whites who might be on this forum.

I'm referring to the whole "white guilt" thing. I have none. I never was involved in any of this old time racist crap, or slavery, or Jim Crow. So to me, I owe nothing to the black community. So if I were to be denied a spot in college for a lower-performing black student, because of Affirmative Action, or "diversity" I would feel like I was discriminated against.

So explain to me why this should be allowed to happen.

The idea is that whites of today benefit from the discriminatory policies of the past. To some extent I do buy that idea. Homeownership in the mid-20th century was conferred almost like a gift, but Blacks were not allowed to participate in the government sponsored programs, which has a fairly huge impact today as White families often inherit wealth in the form of their parents houses and Blacks do not. There are other examples as well, of course, and the idea that ill-gotten gains can be "clawed back" from people who did not participate in an actual crime occurs in other circumstances as well (investment scams e.g. Madoff, for instance).

Yeah...that damned Oprah could have been a trillionaire if it wasn't for all you damned racist whities!!!

And instead of Obama being President, he could have been Emporer for Life! Fucking racist whites holding the black man down! Damn you all to hell!!

So then why aren't Germans paying massive reparations to Israel?

Why aren't Japanese paying reparations to China?

You can't punish people for the actions of their ancestors.

And think about how much better sports would be if we had a few talented black athletes in there making their millions to throw a ball around. But noooooooo......we have to suffer watching allthose white-only football games. Damned racist whites....

...and thank GOD we don't let them run any businesses....Godfather Pizza would SUCK if a black man started it....

And whewww....can you imagine how much music would suck if we *ever* let black musicians record and sell music. It's damned good thing Elvis had the good sense to ignore all those silly black musicians before him....