Sigh, fine then. Would a better example be if Colombia up and invaded Panama? Or the UK invaded Ireland?

Another correction/intervention: Crimea formed part of the RSFSR until 1954, when Khrushchev ceremoniously transferred the Peninsula to the Ukrainian SSR in commemoration of a 1654 event.

I have to ask... Ssorenn, what is your native tongue? It clearly isn't English.

@Goldie - if the US up and decided to invade Canada, then the Canadians are FUCKING DUMBASSESA FOR BEING TOO STUPID TO DEFEND THEMSELVES.

Nations have a responsibiltiy to DEFEND THEMSELVES. That is the FIRST and PRIMARY responsibility of a government.

Any moron that thinks *their* precious nation is safe is a moron, and deserves to die a miserable death at the hands of invaders.

@Goldie -- and your "they were allies up 'til a month ago blah blah blah..."

Whatever dude...open up a fucking history book. There is NOTHING NEW about what is going on here.

And anyone that thinks what has just happened is some earth-shattering, first-in-history event is just an under-educated sheep ready for the slaughter.

"@Goldie - if the US up and decided to invade Canada, then the Canadians are FUCKING DUMBASSESA FOR BEING TOO STUPID TO DEFEND THEMSELVES."

Annnnnnd I'm done here. If you can't grasp the concept that some nations can and will steamroll over others no matter what they do to prepare for it, then there's no point. The entirety of the EU put together would have trouble defending itself from Russia, so give Ukraine a break - especially after they've been ruled by a Russian puppet for three years who nerfed their military capabilities

I'm guessing English is right because you clearly understood me.

Draugh. Yours sometimes is green and chunky, probably with a little blood from your ulcer from constant throw up.

If this was a game of Diplomacy we'd all be applauding the Russian stab.

@jamiet: i don't think we would. it'd be the stab for the solo, and everyone else would finally turn on russia.

@ssorenn - I can understand the broken English spoken by my Russian bosses, but that doesn't make it their first language.

Change jobs

If it was a game of Diplomacy I'd be feeling sorry for the Russian player who's spent so much effort trying to retake Ukraine, only had 3 of his home centres, and had spent the past 3 years desperately trying to keep his unit alive in Syria.

Why would I change jobs? I like my job and my bosses (the CTO and VP of Product Development) are cool guys. You mistake my asking what your native tongue is for being xenophobic when nothing could be further from the truth.

K

quick question to those in favor of crimean independence: do you think that basque should become independent? that's what they want after all, don't they?

I'm in favor of any collective who wants their independence to get it. Self rule by representation of a collective is the highest form of freedom. But there are issues with A) determining how to do it in a mixed population like Israel and Palestine and B) being certain they truly want it and aren't being coerced or threatened.

"Nations have a responsibiltiy to DEFEND THEMSELVES. That is the FIRST and PRIMARY responsibility of a government.

Any moron that thinks *their* precious nation is safe is a moron, and deserves to die a miserable death at the hands of invaders."

So now we learn krellin was actually a time-traveling, drunken and severely-pissed-off Thomas Hobbes this whole time!

@golfinger, panama is a funny example, as obviously america has invaded them...

Does anyone else feel like what we're seeing is part of a bigger independance movement - the idea that people don't want to be part of a nation any more?

Countries have been decreasing in size, splitting and fighting for independance greatly in the past few decades. Now the individual is emphasied by social media rather than the propaganda entity of the Imperium.

Eventually won't we all be independant again? A return to nature?

there goes crimea

To SYNAPSES point...constant referendums by those French fucktards in Quebec. Those silly backwards 'tards in those British Isles always whining about wanting to be indepentdent...blah blah blah. Oh...wait...I guess the desire to determine your own free will as a group of people is OK is you are western European decent, right? But god forbid that backwards assholes in Eastern choose their own fate.

fuck you all.

Russia rejected a proposal to send neutral peacekeepers to protect Russian speakers and ensure the will of the people.

Whereas Obama, when his bluff was diplomatically called, showed enough principle to accept the proposal (Assad's gasses).

Food for thought.

Well, i've gone back and have done some additional research, and while I still support to some extent the right of the Crimean people to have self determination and choose which country they are to be part of, the Russian Federation's actions are illegal.

While the media has exaggerated a military 'invasion', there are no more than 25 000 Russian Federation soldiers in Crimea/Ukraine. The thing is, there was always such a strong military presence in Ukraine in accord to the agreement between the two countries regarding the black sea fleet.

If you are aware, Russia itself alongside with GB and the US agreed to respect and insure the territorial integrity of Ukraine, Belarus and Kazakhstan. (budapest memorandum) In return Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons stockpile. Of course, through Russia's intervention, they clearly broke the deal.
That is the major issue, that the Russians went back on their word (common practice for Russians...) on such an important agreement which ended up in making Ukraine give up it's nuclear stockpile, a very useful tool.

imo, I don't think any intervention will happen, and hopefully none will happen, but this just serves as an example exposing Russia's douchebaggery and lack of a word.

I wish the best for Ukraine, but due to these recent events, it's accession to the EU will be harder, because as the Romanian president recently said in an interview, the EU has learned from Cyprus not to accept countries with territorial conflicts...
Also bear in mind that Ukraine financially is fucked, and without Russian gas are screwed.

Also, Krellin you can't be more wrong lol. Wtf are you saying
"FUCKING DUMBASSESA FOR BEING TOO STUPID TO DEFEND THEMSELVES"

"Well, i've gone back and have done some additional research".

And it shows.

Well Socrates, I was just trying to come up with a quick analogy on the spot, and remembered that panama gained its independence from Colombia with a bunch of help from the US, so I figured it could be a comparable thing

^lol, I've been taught since a young age, "only talk if you know what you're talking about", I kind of went back on that with my first posts, but hopefully I'll redeem myself :P (although I'm still not yet fully knowledgeable....)

"Also, Krellin you can't be more wrong lol. Wtf are you saying"

No, krellin is 100% right. You said it yourself, the moron in the Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons in exchange for the west....the West (ahhhhh ha ha ha ha ha) agreeing to defend them.
1. they are not a part of NATO - we have no obligation to defend them.
2. we are *never* going to war with Russia over some old piece of the soviet republic.

they were *morons* and they deserve to lose the Crimea.

Krellin is 100% correct, and ****facts on the ground**** prove me right.

You blowhard pussies with your astute analysis, blah blah blah "look how smart I am as I analyze this" douchebaggery are the sorts of morons Obama surrounds himself with.

We live in a world ruled by the aggressive use of FORCE...not pretty speeches and empty promises. Morons, all of you.

If krellin was president, I would already be dead as a conscript in his Race War. Count your lucky stars, boys.