"When I've already quit non private games so that I don't have to play with certain players"

Can confirm. She did quit one so she could avoid playing with me

But in seriousness, it would not be a good thing to require the consent of all players, because as ATC said someone could hold the game hostage. Besides, if it's an anonymous game, you shouldn't know who is who anyways. And if it's non-indicative, oh well. I'm sure the player requesting the replacement has something going on IRL that is causing them to be replaced, and you should have enough empathy for them that you can stomach playing with a less-than-ideal replacement, if you don't like that person.

No, it's bullshit really.

If 7 people get together privately and agree to do something, anything, and one of them bows out for any reason, the other 6 definitely have to have a say in the change. The person leaving does not unilaterally have any special right to appoint a replacement.

This seems to be a corner case, but rules for replacement should be spelled out so everyone can agree to a norm and them move one. That way people know what they're getting into when they sign on for a game.

I have sympathy for anyone whose work routine has become more intense, but that doesn't mean their concerns override that of the others who are party to the game.

*move on

*then move on

sheesh

"I have sympathy for anyone whose work routine has become more intense, but that doesn't mean their concerns override that of the others who are party to the game."

Read that again. The bit that says "game" may be a clue as to what matters least.

Just because something is a game doesn't mean it isn't valuable. Diplomacy games take days or weeks to finish, sometimes years. If you commit to that amount of time, you should be able to choose your compatriots to make it an enjoyable experience for all. This isn't quite a "bait and switch" but no one likes those.

I agree that it's a dick move, but what you're advocating is setting up a bunch of rules, which will either require moderation or code changes, for an issue that should effectively be handled by people understanding that this is just a game.

Jeff, this has literally never been an issue in any game I've played in the many years I've been on the site. Subs are a part of the game when you play online, and I only trust (or was able to have) a very few people sitting my account for the game. Or are you going to treat subs and sitters differently? Because for a case like this where it's a month long, there's really no difference between the two.

It's really a non-issue. Your account, your game, your choice. Even moreso if it's an anonymous game, because having everyone choose a sub would break anonymity. If you care so much, set up a special rules game like ATC mentioned. Otherwise one person could just use a personal or in-game grudge to hold the game hostage and - by your rules - that would be perfectly acceptable

And I will again emphasize that in my 7 years on this site and VDip, and my several years as a mod, I cannot think of this issue coming up

I'm advocating that this small issue be addressed with a policy. It could be as simple as the community deciding:

1) Substitutes are not allowed in password protected games--game proceeds with NMR/CD.
2) Substitutes are allowed in password protected games with consent of the other players by unanimity/majority vote.
3) Substitutes are allowed in password protected games and person leaving gets to fill the spot as they see fit.

Pick one of those 3 or any other reasonable option. Then move forward. A policy like this shouldn't require coding or moderation, but IMO there should be clarity with respect to expectations.

Freedom to associate comes along with freedom to disassociate. Forcing one person to go along with others (accepting the sitter or substitute in this case) is disrespectful. Again, set expectations ahead of time. This is the test case.

I don't see a problem with the current private game replacement rules. If you give the password of a private game to somebody, you already put trust in this person: you trust this person will not spread the password to others and you trust that this person is enjoyable to play with. Why wouldn't you trust this person finding a sub that is enjoyable to play with, too?

Friends of friends aren't necessarily friends. Has Diplomacy taught you nothing? ;)

Mercy, games make people bitter. HR and I have met twice in person but he still takes pleasure in pissing me off by subbing out for valis.

Just remember that HR is a busy chef, if he had more time he might leave a bun in your oven rather than subbing in Victorious Valis.

pissing you off seems to be more fun than playing with you DO; or perhaps that is a symptom and not the cause

Brad why are you following me around the forum to try to insult me

I get all the frustration. But at the end of the day Diplomacy is a game. And IRL is IRL. When someone has to step down from a game the proper thing to do would be:
1. Contact mods to have game force paused.
2. Find replacement, if you CHoOSE you can ask the others their input on the replacement.
3. Give replacement to mods to put into game and then be free of the responsibility.

This system works for the most part and this one instance shouldn't change that. Because here's what happens when you require all consent from all players:
1. Code in accept or reject buttons for replacements
2. Announce intent to leave game
3. Announce replacement.
4 if accepted then all is well.
5. If not accepted then try again until accepted.


If I'm leaving a game because I have IRL things that are pressing. I don't have time to "try again". So I'd end up leaving the game on pause and going about my life because fuck the game if I have a family emergency, work responsibilities, or really anything else important.

When we join a game like Diplomacy with a significant time commitment, we all accept the risk that real life may take priority. The penalty for leaving is NMR/CD and a possible reputation hit. In a public game, precisely because it is public, anyone can become a replacement. In a private game, the dynamics are entirely different.

The simplest thing to do is say, "Shit, gotta run. Real life" and accept the consequences.

Next is get mods involved to pause the game so phases aren't missed.

Next is to find a replacement, let the mods know and respectfully let the other players know that something is changing. To do anything else is sneaky and unethical.

If we are protecting the rights of the individual who is leaving, we should also protect those who are staying. Forcing someone to associate with another when they specifically went into a private game to avoid such violates the non-aggression principle so many here are fond of.

Do you really think HR subbed in Valis only to piss you off Demon? I know he asked Captainmeme to replace him first.

I struggle to see his motive being a calculated insult against you. It's much more likely he's busy working a stressful job.

I hope you two patch things up soon. Take a step back though and realize how inane this drama sounds to an outsider.

Dearest Demon Overlord, all behaviours have meaning and can be understood. If Capt Brad has an obsessive need to continually belittle you, then it's not too difficult to join the dots and figure it out. He is almost certainly over compensating for his self perceived inadequacies including a lack of confidence in his own authority. If he can belittle you he believes he strengthens himself. Rather like a puffed up strutting bantam cock announcing to the surrounding world that it is "cock of the roost".
He thought he had muted me, but I recently sent him a PM that was quite conciliatory, about the US Navy's truly impressive aircraft carrier, USS Ronald Reagan which is visiting Australia at the moment. ( and you can bet the whores of Queensland have been busy with all those sailors let ashore to "Bouse up their jibs") But the substance of the message, a compliment to the ship, was completely ignored by the oh so wise Capt Brad, who flew into a rant about how he'd muted me & how dare I send him a message etc etc. Most amusing if you can dismiss him as really not that important, which is what I suggest.
And I would also suggest it's better to be muted by Victorious Visigothic Valis, Demon Overlord, than it is to have our own "Michelin Man" ...HR leave a bun in your oven. LoL ( Michelin Man in the cookery awards caper, not tyres )

i played in that game with valis. he was the only one who did what he said and cooperated with me

Maybe that tells us more about you Capt Brad than it does about Visigothic Valis, I've had slight experience playing in a game with Valis and he was a "straight shooter" and quite honest. And in the few games I played with you Capt Brad, I found that you were untrustworthy and an unreliable ally to other players

Valis once offered a T-bone steak an alliance.

He stabbed it

did he have it with fava beans?

I once sent Valis an excellent blue-eyed soul video from 1987.

He muted it.

i talked to valis a lot, he never muted me

one of the important things we have learned here is that chefs should not play diplomacy - as they are far busier than the rest of our lazy ass professions ;-) one would think my job terminating replicants would be at least as important but no.

Yes, chefs are often far too busy being celebrities and blaspheming these days.

No kidding MM! And heck, food probably tastes better when less chefs -- as they're actually forced to work harder. ;-)