@djbent - Or just dont grant him a pause request when he asks :)

Should we use the term dick? Wouldn't fornicational device be more proper. There could be delicate eyes on this site.

Just kidding by the way. That is a dickish strategy, if it can even be considered one at all.

But the admin wouldn't have. If I were the only hold out, yes. But he was the only one wanted it unpaused. Yes, it was "dickish", if you like. But it was a valid strategy and it worked. The game was going to end in a draw or continue forever as we were all pretty even (12, 11, 11 was the SC count) and neither of us who wanted the draw were willing to aid the third in the fight. We had played as a three way alliance with the draw being the goal, then he backed out of the draw decision when the fourth player was eliminated.

He was a dick at that point, so we played the dick in return and it cost him.

Of course, it was a gunboat, so there was no formal declaration of intent, but it was implied.

no, it's not a valid strategy. if he doesn't draw, just convince him to, after a few years he'll get bored anyway.

Ok, well that does make a difference then, though I'm surprised you and the other just didn't unpause and eliminate the third party. If it was a true stalemate, then there should have been no valid reason for the third party not to draw.

Is there an agreed upon number of moves (where nothing changes) before there is a consensus regarding a stalemate/draw?

Dammit. That makes a difference again. I didn't know it was a gunboat.

Anything that can't be done in real board game diplomacy is NOT a valid strategy. Since you can't reject unpause you can't use that as a strategy in the game of Diplomacy.

"I wonder if anyone has ever taken the term "backstab" literaly in a F2F game..."
There's a fantastic article in the Diplomatic Pouch (www.diplom.org) about a "no holds barred" game in which one of the participants took to living in a dumpster in order to avoid attacks aimed at his home. I think it's fiction but you can never be sure...

Rejecting a pause is not a valid strategy. This player is childish, I would prefer to never play with him.This is a game and it is meant to be fun. Stabs are part of the fun. Refusing to pause as an act of vengeance is pathetic.

"Pauses can be abused. I was a participant in a pause abuse recently (yes, I'm guilty of it). Three players left in the game, two wanted to draw (me and one other). The pasue request went out and was granted, but we both refused to unpause. Instead we insisted the other player vote to draw. We got our draw."

That is not a valid strategy! Does the concept of good sportsmanship mean nothing to you?

I realize there is a back story there, which might mitigate that action somewhat. But forgetting the real incident, and just taking those words for what they are... wrong!

@Draugnar: Technically, if you're face-to-face, you can't stab them in the back unless you have VERY long arms.

LOL!

Well here I am! Not hiding, but highly bemused by all the torrents of abuse and invective heaped over me, although encourages by some voices of sense and reason, calmly pointing out my unalienable right to pause, or unpause whenever I so choose.

Also, no Constitution anywhere in the World distinguished between saints and Dickheads - they are all assumed to have equal human rights and obligations.

Pauses are a proberbial pain in the butt - many has been the occurrance here that Mods have been begged to unpause Games, because some Dickhead or other forgot to unpause, walked away or whatever.

This Game had just had a one-week pause days before.

All those who want to pause because they go away from any PC, laptop or IPhone for 3 or so days, to them I say: Too fr...kng bad!! Play up, or don't play then, but don't bother 6 others telling (excuse me: "asking"0 then to hold their fire because you want to smell the roses, bury your grandmother, or whatever.

Choose 72 hour Games, or simply live with missing a turn. It's anti-soclal in the extreme (yes, I know it to recignise it...!) to ask 6 others to stop on your account.

This Austrian player backstabbed me right from the start; then did it twice again; I could only rely on him, so in a Christian spirit I told him I forgave him each time, yet he stabbed again, and again.

Then I see his Pause request!! Can no-one imagine my feelings? Are these Games not meantto evboke emotions? Well, with me they certainly do! I was in no mood to grant him a Pause just then, in addition to my antipathy against Pauses generally, explained above, which I am sure are shared by many.

Thanks Draugnar, for breaking a lance for Dickhead actions. Although yours truly did stink, I love it!

All is fair in love and war (and Diplomacy IS war, no matter the name) and Machiavelli would smile from his grave at my action, I am sure.....

So you write half an essay defending ones right to be a "Dickhead" in principle, and then follow up with an Oprah interview for emotional support? :)

My 12-year old niece has similar debating skills... not so sure about Machiavelli :)

If you play FtF and someone has to go to the bathroom do you expect them to consider the right time to stab you beforehand? :)

@ Pantalone- so lets get this straight. After being stabbed by Austria, entirely your fault for your poor opening moves, you decided to trust him and leave one of your supply centers wide open for him and now you are surprised you got stabbed. Really :\

Pantalone: I think you are kinda confused.
1st you say you are against pauses in general, but you paused in that same game before.
Then you make it clear that you just don't pause because austria backstabbed too many times!

I don't think the amount of stabs is a good deciding factor about giving a pause to a player. If it was your ally you would pause it imediatly right?
That's called oportunism and even being war, diplomacy is still a GAME, where people should respect themselves. And about imagining your fellings as you ask, I say: fuck your fellings and pause the game for once.

"This Austrian player backstabbed me right from the start; then did it twice again; I could only rely on him, so in a Christian spirit I told him I forgave him each time, yet he stabbed again, and again."

It's all part of the game. You'll have much more fun if you don't take it personally.

"All is fair in love and war (and Diplomacy IS war, no matter the name) and Machiavelli would smile from his grave at my action, I am sure....."

Not really. You're being childish. Play to win by all means, but that means by good diplomacy, a sound strategy, and clever tactics - within the game. Taking advantage of the fact the another player can't login for a couple of days is really lame.

"but I guess in this day and age of ME ME ME nobody is willing to show some human decency."

Yeah I hate douches who try to make an issue out of someone's failure to indulge their whims.

:rolleyes: Remind me to never give you a pause.

Actually you should give him a pause. Pauses should always be granted. But Pantalone, you have to admit that your real motivation behind not pausing is revenge not any hatred for pauses.

Acosmist: Are you a damned Nazi? "someone's failure to indulge their whims" I've never heard such blatant fascism!

djbent: I can’t even believe you would admit something like that. Wow, talk about wrong!

Pantalone: The game really is about trust and suspicion. Getting stabbed is part of it, if an unpleasant one. It is not fair to other players to force a country to CD. CD’s change the game. It is not fair to punish anyone in this manner either.

I am playing a game where I am at 16 supply centers, where my opponent is at 17 supply centers, and I could win the game with any missed move on the part of my opponent. My opponent asked for a week-long pause, and I accepted. Not only did I accept, but I threatened (slash gently reminded that any missed turn would result in dislodgement) the other power on the board, which only had one supply center, to pause. I wouldn’t say ‘into pausing’, since I don’t know whether or not my comment had any influence in his decision. Then, when the website messed up and wouldn’t pause, I posted the problem on the forums. Why did I do all this for an ‘enemy’? It is because I want to have the pleasure of playing a game to the end: winning or fighting for survival through skill.

By the way, just a question: do pauses still reset every turn?

I think you have djbent's post mixed up with someone else's.

:-) Sorry, Draugnar instead of djbent.

But yes JECE I think that you did the right thing by granting you opponent a pause even though you could have taken advantage of the situation. It would have been a hollow victory if you had won by denying him a pause. You're a gentleman.

In a post related to this thread, anyone interested in picking up a CD Austria?

"You're a gentleman."

What game is this, again?

Yeah this game is pussified.

The game is called Diplomacy. Its about tactics and strategy on the board. Not taking advantage of someone just because they can't log on for a few days.
Lie to me, stab me in the game all you like. Nothing wrong with that. I will still respect you for playing a good game.

my two cents...

I have a policy of never pausing, I have been blackmailed by the 'If you don't agree to a draw I won't unpause' line and I see people on here like draugnar defending such actions. It makes me relunctant to grant pauses. I have stated my policy on my profile and I have stated my views clearly in several other forums on this topic.

Other reasons I don't pause are: - (1) it disrupts the flow of the game, I've had games paused for a week or more and it really affects the dynamic of the game.

(2) people know in advance that if they start a game on here it is likely to take a long time, I never start games within a month or so of my holidays unless they are quicky gunboats.

(3) People can get sitters, it's very easy - just needs a little planning

(4) I know it's only a game, but more serious games I play - like poker - would never stop if a player left the table for a while. His hands are folded and if he misses his blinds he losses some money. He would be laughed out of town if he asked the table to pause whilst he left the table for wahtever reason.

(5) When timed pauses come into effect, I will happily pause for the amount of time requested. I will put up the the downside of pausing, but at least know that I can't then be blackmailed.

By the way - although I have a policy on not pausing - i do break this on occassions, so if you are in a game with me - just ask. You never know.