M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

[Chaqa]

The NK probably implies one of my supposed towncore is scum.

@ghug silly reaction test

Chaqa no longer scum suspect

@Demo you just want to look at total wordcount as a metric

@Jamie from what pov and at what stage?

Basically 1 - ((PlayerCount-Bcount)C5/PlayercountC5)

I hate this post.

Damo, how can it be a silly reaction test if you now no longer suspect Chaqa of being scum? Would you have felt the same way if Chaqa claimed and nobody counter-claimed?

Also while I understand the interaction between Chaqa and ghug can be convincing, we cannot rule out that scum RB'd DeathLlama. There's only two PRs, and if they thought DL was one, it's a 50/50 chance its Doc. If I was scum I'd be roleblocking my kill every night. Why is nobody else even mentioning this possibility?

If your theory is that Chaqa and ghug are both scum fake claiming the RB, I like it, that is the kind of thing Chaqa would want to try as mafia. Then ghug calls out their teammate Bob for not believing his RB claim.

I like this observation from Bozo. It’s wrong, but I do think that’s the kind of thing a Chaqa-ghug scum team would do, and I don’t think scum!Bozo would put this theory forward

[bozotheclown]

They were the games we played together where we weren't both scum, I think?

So Bob was able to recall or look up the 3 games you played together where you were not scum in 3 minutes?

I mean, I play every game, so he just has to remember what games he played, right?

I checked and there were other games since M64 you both played where you did not claim a roleblock and potentially could have, yet Bob responded to your question with the 2 games that he was in where you claimed a roleblock, by game number, 3 minutes after you asked the question.

[celaph]

- The actually interesting switch is DemonRHK, who voted damo -> celaph -> flum
[details]
(if you already kinda townread the whole flum wagon, why did you like the donny wagon more? why did you try to flash damo and celaph?)

For the record, I don't think RHK was trying to flash me. He said as much as the time.

[celaph]

I give up on the formatting on that one

There is a preview button to help spot errors for the future.

[bozotheclown]

I subsequently went and searched, but my initial point was it was an impression, not a set of events in my head.

So it was a coincidence that you mentioned M64 and M69 in your first post?

Yes it was purely a lucky guess, and I found it very amusing.

That is either very coincidental or you already had that information for some reason.

[celaph]

Damo, HR, Bob, DL, Donny are all top scumreads...with a big question mark for Maniac as well.

why exactly is HR here?

[...]

Second, he also deflected heat from damo, Bob and Donny (all of whom I scumread) towards the end of the day as people like Durga were searching for alternative wagons.

In my opinion, all of our wagons at the end of the day were town.[...]

Can you clarify what you think about Bob? You both describe him as scum and think all the wagons (presumably including his) were town.

[Chaqa]

So it was a coincidence that you mentioned M64 and M69 in your first post?

Yes it was purely a lucky guess, and I found it very amusing.

That is either very coincidental or you already had that information for some reason.

I like this observation a lot.

DeathLlama was also a Bob voter. Eliminating a potential PR that was also onto something. Perhaps?

##Vote Bob

[goldfinger0303]

Here's the TLDR for my post

Ghug, Jamiet, blamp, bozo, and bona, are all pretty high townreads for me...roughly in that order.

Damo, HR, Bob, DL, Donny are all top scumreads...with a big question mark for Maniac as well.

Vecna and celaph left *zero* impression on me. Say what you will about that. Durga is an enigma to me, as always.

Lack of Chaqa read here is surprising given his earlier comments. @goldie where would you put Chaqa?

At the point in time which I wrote that, I was mixed on Chaqa. I gave him a good chunk of scum reads early on, but then ~p60 he pushed Durga fairly hard on her doubt about Flum being scum. Which I'm not sure a scum Chaqa would do with a town Durga. And since I didn't have a read on Durga's alignment, I leaned off the scumread for a bit.

Now, I'd say Chaqa is up there in a group I'd vote for today.

[goldfinger0303]

Okay, these are the people who, to the best of my 2am ability, aside from me who even remotely detected that something was different about Llama's game than normal. Feel free to add if you have more. Trying to stick to comments that generalize, not go into specific reads of DL's.

I vibe with blamp so far. Also DL8 surprisingly, after that start.

DL feels like he's still shit posting as if the game just started but we're 2 hrs from deadline.

What about deathllama's return was interesting to you? HR is right, you literally only responded to the part about llama scumreading you

The mere fact he returned when he did. He makes a post in which he says he won't be able to play at all until Monday night/Tuesday morning, +1s ghug's post and no one else's as far as I could tell well prior to his eventual posting return, comes back after receiving pressure and tries to shade precisely one person to deflect pressure, someone he thinks he probably can turn into an easy town kill if ghug's pressure continues. The three other defenses he makes weren't particularly response inciting in terms of content or nature as the bozo debate had already been heavily hashed out that I had seen prior to that post end the defense of Flum and donny were blippy so didn't draw much focus either.

[celaph]

That's dumb, I'm super towny. Flum has never incorrectly townread me and I don't do this much as scum.

In a same line as Goldie's earlier comments about you being wishy washy, you haven't been the most confident at times. I still have you as town, but there is a mental note to check back later.

[celaph]

Yeah. tbh ghug saying my case was very compelling when I asked why he scumread you but not commenting on it before really took the energy out of this read.

Though it's a little weird that you brushed aside bob's wagon because he was sleeping and made no other references to him whatsoever throughout all of D1... Even when he was a bigger wagon near the end... But maybe now I'm really just tunneling.

You're really changing your read on rdr because I liked your case?

You liking kgray's case on rdrivera is the most suspicious thing I have seen so far in this game.

Why would this be?

[celaph]

I wouldn't worry too much about kgray, she only wins as scum when I'm on her team

What are people's thoughts on Maniac? Long gone are the days where he posted a lot, but I feel like he's lurking more than he normally would.

Lean town, but getting worse the more I think about it. I liked his arguments around Bob and Flum mid-D1. That said, he has been coasting hard on his Bob read without elaborating further.

@Bob, why did you not ask Maniac to share his reason for voting you last night? Looking ahead at your iso, you upgraded your opinion to him from bad to fiiiine. Why?

[BusinessLamp]

That's dumb, I'm super towny. Flum has never incorrectly townread me and I don't do this much as scum.

In a same line as Goldie's earlier comments about you being wishy washy, you haven't been the most confident at times. I still have you as town, but there is a mental note to check back later.

why is lack of confidence a scum indicator

[Donny Dude]

Rip dl
Other than the ghug rb, which I believe, Bob seems worried about how he is going to get voted for dl's death. There is that consusuin from bob again like eod1.
hr vote for Celaph, which is interesting.
Kgray on Durga and ghug on hr despite liking Hr's reads??

Ghug, do you feel Hr is trying to say what you want to hear than an actual thought process?

Kgray says celaph is k also, which feels a bit like whoever is fine by her.

Kgray, why do you feel this way on Celaph?

I find Kgray's repsonse interesting on giving up on hr defending saying to leave to himself because she just drops it suddenly.

Kgray, do you feel hr is beyond needing your help or do you feel there is no point?

During the kgray Durga exchange Jamie appears and starts to complain about it being endless.
I do like that Hr wants to move on with the conversation and move on to other topics.
Jamiet then picks up on Hrs suggestion of Celaph and how hr feels about it.
He then got really angry about not wanting to waste towns need to flip kgray Durga unless they resolve their issues.

I feel like this is quite controlling and a strong reaction from him for a rather short exchange, like I could see scum jamie doing it to disrupt a convo that may lead to negative result like the point of hr.

Jamiet, were you trying to prevent another flum situation with that?

Kgray moving on to Celaph suddenly saying shes good with durga?

Seems sudden to move on to someone she thought was lukewarm on particularly after Jamiet came barging in.

Kgray was there something that prompted this?

Chaqa with a rb also ,so now both him and ghug.
ghug retracts as a reaction post claim.
I do agree with ghug on chaqas response.
Kgray now moving off celaph feeling that needs to change??
Not sure I like kgray moving this much without much reasoning.

[BusinessLamp]

This is my trust tell. (It's banned on mafiascum but not on webdip yet)
If you look at my two scum games on this site I never once posted I was town, while I regularly do in my town games.

Therefore, I activated my trust tell that I'm town and you can put me in as a lock.

Bozo gets it.

So you are town because of a trust tell?
Why reveal that?

In retrospect I actually really like this immediate reaction of "Why reveal that?" instead of doubting/confirming the trust tell. Feels very town-motivated.

[ghug]

Rip dl
Other than the ghug rb, which I believe, Bob seems worried about how he is going to get voted for dl's death. There is that consusuin from bob again like eod1.
hr vote for Celaph, which is interesting.
Kgray on Durga and ghug on hr despite liking Hr's reads??

Ghug, do you feel Hr is trying to say what you want to hear than an actual thought process?

Kgray says celaph is k also, which feels a bit like whoever is fine by her.

Kgray, why do you feel this way on Celaph?

I find Kgray's repsonse interesting on giving up on hr defending saying to leave to himself because she just drops it suddenly.

Kgray, do you feel hr is beyond needing your help or do you feel there is no point?

During the kgray Durga exchange Jamie appears and starts to complain about it being endless.
I do like that Hr wants to move on with the conversation and move on to other topics.
Jamiet then picks up on Hrs suggestion of Celaph and how hr feels about it.
He then got really angry about not wanting to waste towns need to flip kgray Durga unless they resolve their issues.

I feel like this is quite controlling and a strong reaction from him for a rather short exchange, like I could see scum jamie doing it to disrupt a convo that may lead to negative result like the point of hr.

Jamiet, were you trying to prevent another flum situation with that?

Kgray moving on to Celaph suddenly saying shes good with durga?

Seems sudden to move on to someone she thought was lukewarm on particularly after Jamiet came barging in.

Kgray was there something that prompted this?

Chaqa with a rb also ,so now both him and ghug.
ghug retracts as a reaction post claim.
I do agree with ghug on chaqas response.
Kgray now moving off celaph feeling that needs to change??
Not sure I like kgray moving this much without much reasoning.

I think HR's response is fine. I'm apparently the only person seriously scumreading him, so monopolizing the threat to talk about it isn't a productive move for him as either alignment. It's not productive for kgray either, but I think her reaction to me is more obnoxious than scummy, sadly.

[BusinessLamp]

I was roleblocked

Seems legit.

what could possibly make this seem legit or not

[Donny Dude]

alright on page 109 now
Interesting that bob goes on Celaph after Kgray moves on him.
I do buy that bob knows about ghug rbing and the precedent.
Maniac and damo vote for bob.
I see maniac is continuing his held pattern on bob.
I have to admit I agree with bozo on the bob knowledge.

[celaph]

##VOTE celaph

Say more.

[celaph]

That's dumb, I'm super towny. Flum has never incorrectly townread me and I don't do this much as scum.

In a same line as Goldie's earlier comments about you being wishy washy, you haven't been the most confident at times. I still have you as town, but there is a mental note to check back later.

why is lack of confidence a scum indicator

It's not. For kgray specifically, that aspect of her play feels atypical, though not scummy hence why I've left it as a mental note on a townread. I think it might also explains (rdr not with standing) a good deal of the hesitancy around people townreading her.