Repercussions for quitting
Repercussions for quitting
I don't know if this happens to other players, but when I play with people and they start losing (especially people who have a higher GR) - they often sub out of the game rather than just losing with dignity. This is not only pathetic, but throws off the existing balance of the game making it unnecessarily unfair (in press). I understand when people have legitimate reasons to quit, but it is really frustrating when you know they're doing it because they're afraid of losing. One time, someone subbed out of the game and specifically subbed in someone I absolutely disliked because he was losing, and to spite me (other subs were available). Is there anything we can do to prevent people from doing things like this, or at least putting in some penalty for GR or CD record?
-
- Posts: 4028
- Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:16 pm
- Location: The Five Valleys, Gloucestershire
- Contact:
Re: Repercussions for quitting
Hang on... If you get subbed you don't lose any GR? How does that work? I always assumed if you were replaced it counted as a loss.
Re: Repercussions for quitting
Nope, you don't. It counts as nothing if you sub out. You should honestly lose GR if you sub out.
Re: Repercussions for quitting
Sadly, one of the limitations of GR is that it only operates with knowledge of who controlled the power at the end of a game.
Giving the mods an option to mark a forced CD against a player's record could be feasible, though it would still require a bit of dev work.
Giving the mods an option to mark a forced CD against a player's record could be feasible, though it would still require a bit of dev work.
-
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 4:37 pm
- Contact:
Re: Repercussions for quitting
The flip side of this is that people who take over losing games and get defeated shouldn't have it count against GR.
-
- Site Moderator
- Posts: 1669
- Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2017 3:17 pm
- Contact:
-
- Silver Donator
- Posts: 217
- Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:56 pm
- Location: On an Island. In an Ocean. Surrounded by Water.
- Contact:
Re: Repercussions for quitting
Not to hate on GR, but maybe site resources would be well spent on developing a site rating system that works with the site more seamlessly??
GR fills a need, but that need only exists because we don’t have a viable rating system here. Now I have no immediate suggestion and I feel it would probably take a lot of trial and error, but the above issue as well as a few other issues could probably benefit from this fix.
GR fills a need, but that need only exists because we don’t have a viable rating system here. Now I have no immediate suggestion and I feel it would probably take a lot of trial and error, but the above issue as well as a few other issues could probably benefit from this fix.
Re: Repercussions for quitting
I think that has been on the wish list for quite a long time - I remember ATC talking about. My understanding, however, is that it is quite challenging and the developers feel like there are more pressing issues at hand.CommanderByron wrote: ↑Thu Feb 08, 2018 6:13 amNot to hate on GR, but maybe site resources would be well spent on developing a site rating system that works with the site more seamlessly??
Personally, I've played on this site for 7 odd years now and have never felt that this was an issue. I've definitely played in games were people subbed out but never read it as a malicious workaround of GR. More often than not, people get sitters instead of sub.
-
- Posts: 4028
- Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:16 pm
- Location: The Five Valleys, Gloucestershire
- Contact:
Re: Repercussions for quitting
What I want to know is what lame arse poodle happily takes the GR hit on behalf of the kind of chinless wonder who'd use subbing to cheat their way up a ratings ladder?
Re: Repercussions for quitting
This is definitely worth doing, but currently there's not a lot of history present in a game.
Perhaps we could implement a system whereby any CD (including mod forced) counts as a loss from the perspective of GR? What do people think?
Perhaps we could implement a system whereby any CD (including mod forced) counts as a loss from the perspective of GR? What do people think?
-
- Lifetime Site Contributor
- Posts: 1099
- Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:20 pm
- Contact:
Re: Repercussions for quitting
I'd disagree from the mod forced perspective. There are many very valid cases where people need to leave games and someone is willing to fully sub in for them, or cases where we simply need to force someone into CD for testing or for training purposes. I think the point of this system would be to punish people who are habitual CD'ers/NMR's who rarely lose GR due to the free takeover system. So allowing mod discretion on not being punished seems like the more fair approach.
Re: Repercussions for quitting
I agree. Some people are force CDd for tournament, or special rules reasons (like the Pacifist Game) some people are also wrongly banned, and ave their games taken over. I think CDs caused only by NMRing should count.
Re: Repercussions for quitting
It would be handy to allow mods to choose to ignore CDs rather than making mod-forced ignored and all others not.
As for GR in CDs, having the player who starts the game bet some percentage of the rating being gambled could be a solution. Seems less than justified mathematically, but GR is that already.
As for GR in CDs, having the player who starts the game bet some percentage of the rating being gambled could be a solution. Seems less than justified mathematically, but GR is that already.
Re: Repercussions for quitting
never late to start a log of CDs. That seems quite easy to implement! Isnt it?
and then it could be incorporated into the ratings, be it with pro-rated strenghts by phases played, expected values, and points won from the game;
note it would also solve the problem of the guy that helps, the guy who ends the game as substitute, who should never have his GR / GRV2 (YR) penalized, specially benefic to the whole community as general stimulous for replacing condemned powers, the simple rule "in the case of a replacement player, he would NOT lower his rating based on that game -- it would remain unchanged.
and then it could be incorporated into the ratings, be it with pro-rated strenghts by phases played, expected values, and points won from the game;
note it would also solve the problem of the guy that helps, the guy who ends the game as substitute, who should never have his GR / GRV2 (YR) penalized, specially benefic to the whole community as general stimulous for replacing condemned powers, the simple rule "in the case of a replacement player, he would NOT lower his rating based on that game -- it would remain unchanged.
-
- Posts: 937
- Joined: Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:17 am
- Contact:
Re: Repercussions for quitting
Someone who wants to try a difficult or even desperate position and at the same time sees it as a service to the community helping a game to continue instead of waiting for a substitute.
-
- Posts: 4028
- Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:16 pm
- Location: The Five Valleys, Gloucestershire
- Contact:
Re: Repercussions for quitting
No, I don't think so. People looking for a challenge / exercise in masochism have plenty of opportunities in taking over from CDs. I doubt even someone with the gall to engage in GR fiddling would publicly advertise the fact by requesting subs in the forum, so it would have to be a personal favour rather than community minded, I would have thought.PRINCE WILLIAM wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:29 pmSomeone who wants to try a difficult or even desperate position and at the same time sees it as a service to the community helping a game to continue instead of waiting for a substitute.
Re: Repercussions for quitting
@Octavious, from personal experience I say this.
When I joined webdip, not much long ago, I used to take over lots of hopeless positions, in some I fought hard to find a place in a draw, in most I was simply eliminated or survived to a solo.
When I figured out there was a GR and it could be used to set up seedings in tournaments, for example, or purely as a measure of my own skills, I simple stopped doing so.
Though I do can have some fun in such challenges, I figured out I was looking like a player who always loses - while I could see a few big draws I made into, as victories for otherwise hopeless powers, that seeemed not recognised in my ratings, instead pulled it down a lot. This is why my vdip ratings are high, while my webdip ratings are median (there are not much replacement opportunities in our sister site!).
When I joined webdip, not much long ago, I used to take over lots of hopeless positions, in some I fought hard to find a place in a draw, in most I was simply eliminated or survived to a solo.
When I figured out there was a GR and it could be used to set up seedings in tournaments, for example, or purely as a measure of my own skills, I simple stopped doing so.
Though I do can have some fun in such challenges, I figured out I was looking like a player who always loses - while I could see a few big draws I made into, as victories for otherwise hopeless powers, that seeemed not recognised in my ratings, instead pulled it down a lot. This is why my vdip ratings are high, while my webdip ratings are median (there are not much replacement opportunities in our sister site!).
Re: Repercussions for quitting
I totally agree. vDip has vDiplomacy Points, which basically works like GR. So there is a framework for php already.CommanderByron wrote: ↑Thu Feb 08, 2018 6:13 amNot to hate on GR, but maybe site resources would be well spent on developing a site rating system that works with the site more seamlessly??
GR fills a need, but that need only exists because we don’t have a viable rating system here. Now I have no immediate suggestion and I feel it would probably take a lot of trial and error, but the above issue as well as a few other issues could probably benefit from this fix.
-
- Posts: 79
- Joined: Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:09 pm
- Contact:
Re: Repercussions for quitting
The developers are volunteers working on the parts of the site that they think would be interesting or personally rewarding to develop. If you want that system, you should integrate it yourself.CommanderByron wrote: ↑Thu Feb 08, 2018 6:13 amNot to hate on GR, but maybe site resources would be well spent on developing a site rating system that works with the site more seamlessly??
GR fills a need, but that need only exists because we don’t have a viable rating system here. Now I have no immediate suggestion and I feel it would probably take a lot of trial and error, but the above issue as well as a few other issues could probably benefit from this fix.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users