MAFIA 71: "PAPERS PLEASE" - GAME THREAD [Hidden]

[TheMadMonarch]

I could also go for a squiggs wagon if that happens. BB has convinced me he could be "evil".

[TheMadMonarch]

Bozo, I am thinking about your survey. I'm just not sure enough on some of the slots. It should be in by EOD.

[brainbomb]

what did you think of that whole macca has buddied brainbomb remark?

[ghug]

Macca, two questions:

You still haven't told me what happened when you appeared online for a while during the night but never graced us with your catch-up post.

Why are you voting for me?

By night, I'm going to assume you mean night phase. In which case I made 7 posts. None of them large by any means. But I don't understand what you mean here?



1. you're a bit scummy
2. I think you could be scum with Durga
3. kgray told me to
4. OMGUS

You were on the thread for a long time and didn't post until sometime noticed you. I had assumed you were doing your delayed catch-up thing, but those posts never came, so I'd like to know what you were actually doing.

Are you aware that I was kgray's fourth biggest scumread, and her parting comment was a long-running joke?

[bozotheclown]

Mafia team predictions:

bozo: lfischl/ghug/snowy, Foxcastle/Fluminator
Squigs: damo/captainmeme/TFB, Fluminator/lfischl
TheFlyingBoat: Fluminator/lfischl/captainmeme, ghug/Macca
ghug: bozo/Tom/Fluminator, captainmeme/Macca
rdrivera: Fluminator/Foxcastle/Squigs, captainmeme/bozo
Foxcastle: Tom/bozo/brainbomb, lfischl/TFB
brainbomb: Fluminator/lfischl/Macca, BesharamSabi/Squigs
BesharamSabi: damo/snowy/Fluminator, rdrivera/lfischl
Tom: TFB/brainbomb/captainmeme, ghug/lfischl
snowy: Fluminator/Tom/Macca/damo/TFB

[bozotheclown]

Bozo, I am thinking about your survey. I'm just not sure enough on some of the slots. It should be in by EOD.

OK, thanks.

[bozotheclown]

Macca, two questions:

You still haven't told me what happened when you appeared online for a while during the night but never graced us with your catch-up post.

Why are you voting for me?

By night, I'm going to assume you mean night phase. In which case I made 7 posts. None of them large by any means. But I don't understand what you mean here?



1. you're a bit scummy
2. I think you could be scum with Durga
3. kgray told me to
4. OMGUS

You were on the thread for a long time and didn't post until sometime noticed you. I had assumed you were doing your delayed catch-up thing, but those posts never came, so I'd like to know what you were actually doing.

Are you aware that I was kgray's fourth biggest scumread, and her parting comment was a long-running joke?

It must be frustrating getting votes for NKing kgray if you NKed Durga instead.

[TheMadMonarch]

what did you think of that whole macca has buddied brainbomb remark?

Eh. I thought I had made that opinion clear in previous games.

[TheMadMonarch]

Macca, two questions:

You still haven't told me what happened when you appeared online for a while during the night but never graced us with your catch-up post.

Why are you voting for me?

By night, I'm going to assume you mean night phase. In which case I made 7 posts. None of them large by any means. But I don't understand what you mean here?



1. you're a bit scummy
2. I think you could be scum with Durga
3. kgray told me to
4. OMGUS

You were on the thread for a long time and didn't post until sometime noticed you. I had assumed you were doing your delayed catch-up thing, but those posts never came, so I'd like to know what you were actually doing.

Are you aware that I was kgray's fourth biggest scumread, and her parting comment was a long-running joke?

I posted things around when I found them. Some posts I left for a page or two to make sure I didn't ask a soon to be answered question. I was simply reading through.

[TheFlyingBoat]

So this re-read is admittedly late, but I will chalk that up to diplomacy tournaments running late and the post game recriminations going on even longer. Anyways, based on my reread here's how I am viewing things. Sorry in advance for verbosity. I only get worse as I lose sleep.

Sabi: Durga took too rollercoaster-y of a commentary on Sabi for them to be part of Durga's scum team in my view, as I think scum!Durga would be much more content to let scum!Sabi just coast on the rep they've built up. Though perhaps one could take it as open coaching during the day (which I don't think Durga would do) or just giving Sabi a relatively honest treatment that one would expect scum to show in a multi game where they're hunting for other scum. Durga's "coaching" didn't seem directed at protecting herself from Sabi saying something that would implicate her, which I think is the only thing Durga would bother to coach because the one intolerable thing would be them sinking the scum team If they are scum (which I think is exceedingly unlikely given I don't think they faked a slip in a way that other players could more easily) I am inclined to believe they are not on Durga's team and do believe they are town at the moment.

Squigs/Eden: So some people have made the argument that Squigs could be mafia based on the close linkages between the two, corrections that could be open coaching, etc. But something about that seems off.

I agree with (I think rdr?) whoever said Tom was NAI. Having two scum teams makes it annoying because scum are also scum hunting.

Rdr did say this in agreement with a post of mine. This is the second time you've agreed with a post of mine without realizing it

Damn

More importantly I don't think this is a comment a same scum team squiggs makes to Durga if they are on the same team unless you think HE is openly coaching her to reduce the linkages between the two. While plausible, I think that's an interesting play. That being said, I don't know if Durga would respond that simply to it if it were her teammate calling it out as I feel like she would be more indignant/trying to create distance and/or be a little pissed that a scum team partner would a) openly coach her or b) draw such attention to something that could be glossed over by would-be hunters. I think Eden was pretty towny, but if he is scum, once again likely not on Durga's team. Squiggs not gonna lie comes off a little more in neutral-scummy land, but that may be just me not really following him.

Fluminator:

His post discussing his view of M70 and how it caused him to re-read me prompted me to re-read him. After unfolding everything in that game, I realized most of the triggers that made me feel something was off about him were basically what he was doing this game as well, which also featured him pushing me and damo heavily at various points. I can't access the quick topic to find out if he was a PR or not (though at least from vague recollection I don't think he was), but at least given he was NKed I know he was town, which gives me some pause. That being said I can't put my finger on it here, but something just still seems off here, but then again my mafia vs town pr radar isn't perfect given how certain I was kgray was scum (until she convinced me she wasn't) and she turned out to be the oracle so meh. If he is scum I could definitely see him being a member of either scum team given I didn't see any interactions between the two that made it look like an interaction she'd avoid with a scum player of Flum's caliber if they were on the same team.

Macca:

I must have been high as a kite when I put them on the same team as Durga. What I thought was coaching just seems like a blatant attack on reread and I think it's fair to say that Macca is not on Durga's scum team. That being said I still the odds of Macca being on the OTHER scum team is fairly high and would be happy to kill them today. I do hope I am not overthinking things here as it would be funny if Durga actually bus driver'd herself to death by swapping a kill shot meant for someone else here, but I think the odds of that are low and that someone on Macca's team wanted to take a shot at a) a strong player, b) a player unlikely to be DKed, and c) a player that was coming after one, or more likely TWO of their players. Which leads me to the next guy

Meme:

I think I saw someone say Durga's frustration seemed like one directed at a failing teammate. That being said I don't think Durga busses them in Day 1, instead waiting for Night 1 to have some sort of conversation with Meme about increasing activity plus some private yelling. Especially in a multi game, I don't she puts that much public pressure on him, letting him run up to 5 votes and only pulling it after the wagon had collapsed to 2. She also rejoined it a lot, so I am inclined to think she thought he was someone genuinely unproductive or a scum lurker. I think he is someone who thinks it would be fun to kill Durga and would do so to protect himself. My one issue is he straight up didn't give a shit that he was under pressure while CLEAR issues against him were being stated that he could have fixed or addressed.

lfischl:

Generally low activity, someone who coasts through games, and surprised us with activity Day 1. The way Tanya handled him from posts like the one where she argued with bozo seems like way a mafia member would try to defend a townsperson (or in this case someone they at least didn't know to be mafia) while still leaving them open as an easy wagon possibility for the future. I am inclined to lean town, possibly other mafia, but do not think it is likely he is in Durga's team

ghug:

Something about him just pinged me as off, and when gray jokingly asked for it, I figured why. On doing an ISO of him, something still just doesn't sit right, but I think part of it may be due to thinking he was scum for a lot of 1020 when I was watching and spending a lot of time reading M1020 to try and remind myself why I did. That being said I can't as easily reconcile those signals and vibes had watching 1020 from the sidelines with that I see here and I think there is good reason to believe Ghug is a likely NK target for the other mafia team if he is mafia, so I am pretty comfortable, and a probable target for either mafia team if he is town therefore not DKing him for another day or so honestly seems like a good idea the more I think about it. Then again the other part of me thinks about how he plays scum and how dangerous he is when it comes to generating miskills before he dies. Ugh. Decision paralysis is real

Tom Bomb:

Not sure why there were so many early town reads on him and after a re-read I still can't exactly figure out why. What is even weirder to me is how quickly large parts of the game then switched to that conclusion. I still don't know how to read that sort of reaction swing, but it is weird.


Snowy:

Guy has seemed to be insanely critical about bad town, which seems like frustration boiling over from last game and into this one. I think he is pretty town oriented honestly. From skimming Durga as I am getting too tired for this shit, I don't see any reason he couldn't be in either team, because I don't think his vote on Durga seemed to have much weight or thrust behind it and I don't think Durga had any interactions with him which suggested they couldn't be teammates either.

rdr:

Has looked really good to me this game, has been really active in terms of posting his reads, and his interactions with Durga didn't seem off. I think the fact he publicly offered to take her lead and had her follow him once seems to me to be behavior of town trusting scum and scum following town. I don't think rdar would be on Durga's scum team. Might be on the other one, but I learn town.

Fox:

Looking back I do think it was weird how early he wanted to focus on consolidation and it seemed like he wanted to put a lot of pressure on Bona while saving one of Flum or Ghug (but not both) and trying to damn one of Bona or lfischl because to him both were not on his team so he was fine either way. At the very least I would not put him on a team with lfischl

Bozo:

Durga seemed like she wanted to be very nice to Bozo in terms of drawing people away from killing him but in a loud way that points to the way a scum would treat a non-team member to help gain their trust, enable their mistakes, etc. The way she asked him to expand on ghug/kgray scum reads seem designed to get that discussion point to dominate the discussion and point attention in that direction by him. Given that I am inclined to believe that ghug being on her team is likely and that it is probably Bozo isn't either and is probably on town, but the latter is more a vibe thing.

Brain:

Either town or other scum team. He did a really good job of/got very lucky calling Durga as scum early and kept on hammering the shit out of her, calling her out as scum repeatedly and then asking others to read her in a focused manner as well. I doubt he'd open so aggressively against his partner, but also something about him just seems townie. I do find it funny his response to being berated was to finally flip to town, but I think that was a genuine switch by a townie getting blown away by Durga's offensive. I do think he was overly harsh at various points towards her but that just indicates town!brain more to me tbh based on what I've heard in this thread.

Damo:

Damo seemed a lot more like Damo after his reread and I think the fact that he put Durga as his second most town read person after is a little weird since I feel in my experience scum tends to put their fellow scum at 2/3 with the obvious town read just above them to avoid suspicion while giving them the global cloak needed to help them. That being said Damo's ridiculously high levels of self-confidence and brashness in declaring it was the Damo I expected and remember as a townie so I really like him too. If he is scum. see him being in a team with Durga.

Will need to compile a new top 5 from this some time tomorrow but right now I am really tired so see ya some time before EOD.

[TheFlyingBoat]

Oh right ##vote Macca. Hope to get some clarity in the analysis with added pressure. Good night for real this time

[Jamiet99uk]

=== MINISTRY of ADMINISTRATION ===
+++++ VOTE COUNT 2.2 +++++

ghug(5) - damo666, Cáptainmeme, snowy801, bozotheclown, Macca573
Macca573(4) - Fluminator, ghug, brainbomb, TheFlyingBoat
lfischl(2) - BesharamSabi, Foxcastle
brainbomb(1) - Tom Bombadil
bozotheclown(1) - rdrivera2005
damo666(1) - Squigs44

GHUG has an appointment in the salt mines.

Lfischl needs to vote.

10 hours 50min remain in Day 2.

[captainmeme]

Excuse me it's actually çâpţăïñmémè

[Foxcastle]

id like to talk to foxcastle but I dont think theyve hardly even
mentioned me most of the game so far.

fox do you have any opinions on my reads: sabi, squiggs, lfischl, flum and macca?

Squiggs is the towniest of those, and lfischl is the scummiest. I am skeptical that sabi is scum after the eden thing and all the supposed coaching—if they are, it's been a pretty masterful performance. Flum could be, I'd even vote him. Macca is not on my list to kill.

You could also be scum, and in that case, I think your list probably contains one of your teammates, probably ifischl, flum, or macca. But that's a lot of speculation on multiple levels.

[Foxcastle]

I don't think bozo's logic is dismissably faulty

Just like normally faulty then?

Most mafia logic is faulty, but nothing bozo is saying deserves unilateral dismissal

Do you think it deserves the level of confidence he seems to be giving it, though? It seems to be the basis of how he's viewing the game rather than a "oh, that could be something, let's keep an eye on it."

[damo666]

For Bozo:

Durga Squigs TFB
ghug capt snowy

Pretty low level of confidence in this though

[damo666]

If we assume

i) Durga didn't bus
ii) the entire durga team were not on Bona

then there has to be at least one Durga team member in:

Sabi Bozo Flum rdr TFB Tom

I townread most of these though.

[damo666]

For Bozo:

Durga Squigs TFB
ghug capt snowy

Pretty low level of confidence in this though

This can't be right, capt and snowy would currently both be bussing ghug.

[damo666]

Other team

Capt snowy FishFox?

[damo666]

##vote captainmeme