M1020 — Speed Run Mafia GAME THREAD [HIDDEN]

[Bonatogether]

Bona, did you at least come to any conclusions in the VCA post you didn't write?

eod was TvT
squigs/snowy scummier for how things went, but probably only one of them is scum

Your conclusion was that Bo and yourself were town while two of your biggest wagon proponents were scummy.

Nice!

fmpov eod has to be tvt

but the question is how did it become tvt? is town incompetent? have we been bamboozled? is scum too good?

the people who would have saved sqoogs/snowy are damo, ghug, jamie, sabi (in theory, probably not in practice), dl

[Bonatogether]

bona how do you feel about the flood of people who wanted to save you near the end?

i'm just cool

what can i say?

[Bonatogether]

##VOTE Squigs

Although foodcoats was wrong about me, I suspect the mafia had a specific reason to want foodcoats eliminated.

what was the reason?

[bozotheclown]

oh no he's too smar

##vote Bona

@Bozo why I voted Bona

a) Sabi was gaining no traction
b) I didn't like the response above
c) I didn't want to vote snowy
d) I thougt making it a 3 way tie would be more interesting than voting bo

Bonatogether was the only player you town read all of D1, did that one comment change your mind?

[bozotheclown]

##VOTE Squigs

Although foodcoats was wrong about me, I suspect the mafia had a specific reason to want foodcoats eliminated.

what was the reason?

Perhaps because foodcoats suspected Squigs.

[Bonatogether]

##VOTE Squigs

Although foodcoats was wrong about me, I suspect the mafia had a specific reason to want foodcoats eliminated.

what was the reason?

Perhaps because foodcoats suspected Squigs.

when was the last time people killed someone on d2 on the suspicions of the n1 kill?

[bozotheclown]

what was the reason?

Perhaps because foodcoats suspected Squigs.

when was the last time people killed someone on d2 on the suspicions of the n1 kill?

That is a good question, I will look into that. In this game, there were no mafia concerns with PR hunting or trying to avoid a doc save. foodcoats is a good town player, but why not take out someone who at least suspected one of the mafia? I suppose foodcoats could have been town reading all of the scum team and they wanted to lock in his reads, but it seems more likely they would pick someone they suspected might cause them problems D2.

[snowy801]

Who else did foodcoats scum read, bozo? Who would've been the attempt to town lock, if that's what happened?

[Bonatogether]

Perhaps because foodcoats suspected Squigs.

when was the last time people killed someone on d2 on the suspicions of the n1 kill?

That is a good question, I will look into that. In this game, there were no mafia concerns with PR hunting or trying to avoid a doc save. foodcoats is a good town player, but why not take out someone who at least suspected one of the mafia? I suppose foodcoats could have been town reading all of the scum team and they wanted to lock in his reads, but it seems more likely they would pick someone they suspected might cause them problems D2.

Armchair mafia theory means shit. Killing to get sus thrown on their reads hasn't happened with this group before, so it's not likely as an explanation now. No one has learned anything.

The last sentence is kind of the same idea, but I'm more somewhat more partial towards it. However, aren't scum more likely to flip longer-term threats (kgray, for example) than food? Food's good but it's a weird kill

[ghug]

when was the last time people killed someone on d2 on the suspicions of the n1 kill?

That is a good question, I will look into that. In this game, there were no mafia concerns with PR hunting or trying to avoid a doc save. foodcoats is a good town player, but why not take out someone who at least suspected one of the mafia? I suppose foodcoats could have been town reading all of the scum team and they wanted to lock in his reads, but it seems more likely they would pick someone they suspected might cause them problems D2.

Armchair mafia theory means shit. Killing to get sus thrown on their reads hasn't happened with this group before, so it's not likely as an explanation now. No one has learned anything.

The last sentence is kind of the same idea, but I'm more somewhat more partial towards it. However, aren't scum more likely to flip longer-term threats (kgray, for example) than food? Food's good but it's a weird kill

Why is kgray your example?

[snowy801]

kgray's not in the game, bona. Who'd be the equivalent in this game?

[ghug]

Also I'm confused. bozo's arguing that food was killed by someone he scumread. Bona's arguing that we don't daykill people because the nightkill suspected them. Those aren't in opposition with each other.

[ghug]

kgray's not in the game, bona. Who'd be the equivalent in this game?

I'd kill u bb

[bozotheclown]

I am not going to be available the rest of the day until close to EOD. I have had very little time to look at the game so far, but in my defense I did not expect the game to start until tonight. I will have more time to participate if I make it to D2.

celaph or damo would be my choice for the DK today, but I am not "tunneling" them as foodcoats suggests, after all, it is only D1, and I have spent very little time looking at the game. I just see less town motivation in their posts that others.

After the last game I was in, I was glad to draw town this game, so I hope I am not eliminated today for lack of participation. If that happens, just remember that I was an easy vote for the mafia.

Wow a post from bozo that isn't a one liner, it's a Thanksgiving miracle.

Bozo I'm going to send you some questions, hopefully you don't die before you can answer them:

Why do you think food thinks you're tunneling damo and celaph?

What about their post seems to have less town motivation? Like what is triggering this vibe?

Why do you think you're an easy vote for mafia?

Like I said I hope you don't get day killed before you can answer these questions. Appreciate it!

In case you still feel these questions are relevant:

foodcoats said he thought I was scum because I tunnel as scum and that I had not updated my initial guess at the scum team, so I took that to mean he thought I was tunneling them.

It was a very preliminary opinion on the posts of the players I mentioned, it was just a general feeling I had after reading the beginning of the game.

I think I was an easy vote for mafia D1 because there is usually a push to DK lurkers.

[celaph]

Celaph, can you elaborate on your EoN reads a little?

Definitely.

ghug's apathy feels really scummy. Be really careful with this one.
I called ghug out in M67 for the way you were so willing to vote Chaqa off without any indication that you thought he was actually scum and purely because of a voiced distaste of his playing style. Feel free to read my original post:

[Posting calling out scum ghug behavior]

The short version is that ghug's behavior is not only based on his dislike for his other players. In the above post, I highlighted how over a series of 8 games with both Chaqa and ghug, scum ghug always voted for Chaqa D1 while town ghug never voted for Chaqa D1. Another example would be comparing his attitude towards ND (another player ghug dislikes) between M62 and M63. Granted, ND's lack of participation in M63 weakens this comparison some, but town ghug in M62 demonstrated a belief that the person he was voting for was scum. Scum ghug in M63 did not. Now look at this game, ghug demonstrated no belief that he was killing scum. That's scum ghug.

My opinion of Snowy is still trending towards scum.
I spoke about this earlier in the night, but I was unimpressed with how Snowy in such an active EoD did virtually squat in the last 15 minutes. That suggests that he was equally content with either wagon dying which feels scummy.

I will add that I have sense read DL's EoD Notes and liked his comment on how Snowy townread his cws D1. That is a good point which I had not yet considered though I still have Snowy on the scummy end of things.

snowy townreading basically all his competing wagons and pushing for a new one is positive signal (unless it's specifically snowy/bona, which seems less likely given bona's EOD), although I'm not sure he genuinely felt threatened by the daykill which weakens this a little

Don't just kill Bozo because he is inactive.
I spoke about this in a comment on Sabi's post, but I think that there are a lot of scumreads going in Bozo's direction because of his inactivity without making great cases that he has been especially scummy. I'm fine with having him be null/someone who needs to be pressured. But I worry that town will default kill the inactive player because they can't argue for themselves and end up killing one of their own.

Still liking Squigs.
I think that there is certainly an argument that Bo was making that Squig's approach to my wagon was suspicious, but I don't rate the chance highly and either way I don't think that he makes a great kill today. I expressed the things I've liked about his play D1 and I also felt that he was looking good in his argument towards the end of the night with food.

I wouldn't personally push food that much as you plan to kill him as mafia, but then again I'm not good at maf so perhaps someone else should discuss whether Squigs looks good or back post food flip.

Anyone who kills Sabi is stupid.
Sabi is still my strongest townread. My opinion on that matter hasn't really changed much over night though I just wanted to express it again given how surprised I was to see her name being thrown around at EoD1.

DL/Jamie probably town.
This is most naturally split into two parts:

DL I rank as more town than Jamie. I think he has been both expressive of his opinions and has justified them well throughout the game. I feel like on the whole he has had good and unique takes. As I noted above, I hadn't read his eon post when I made mine, but his comments have made me feel even better about my read here.

Nothing about Jamie has felt off so far. I feel like he is unhappy with the game state currently and has been working to change that. I've liked a number of his takes so far (see his comment to Bona on Squigs crosspost, read on Snowy). General vibes feel right atm.

[bozotheclown]

Who else did foodcoats scum read, bozo? Who would've been the attempt to town lock, if that's what happened?

foodcoats scum read me and Squigs and apparently town read those not in "celaph/ghug/snowy/Jamie/DeathLlama".

[celaph]

Celaph might be the most self aware person I've seen play this game and I'm not sure how to feel about it

[bozotheclown]

Also I'm confused. bozo's arguing that food was killed by someone he scumread. Bona's arguing that we don't daykill people because the nightkill suspected them. Those aren't in opposition with each other.

I don't know that Bonatogether is arguing not to DK a player suspected by the NK, I thought he was pointing out that it does not typically happen.

[bozotheclown]

Celaph might be the most self aware person I've seen play this game and I'm not sure how to feel about it

Who is pocketing who now.

[BesharamSabi]

That's not gonna register.

I'm guessing it's a joke

Everything Sabi says sounds like a bad joke.

Oh. That hurt a bit.

Might as well call you Jamiet 2.0 or jhug or game due to the fact both of you can't take a joke I make. Sad