M1020 — Speed Run Mafia GAME THREAD [HIDDEN]

[Jamiet99uk]

##VOTE bo_sox

##VOTE celaph

Why are you flip flopping your vote around so much?

[BesharamSabi]

@Sabi

how should we deal with lurkers?

I think keep sending them more and more questions to force them to engage. If that doesn't work then start flash wagons and see if that gets them to post. If that also fails then try to hammer them because at that point they are wasting everyone's time and hurting town chances because they don't want to put in the effort.

If you had to flip one person right now purely for info and not alignment, whose flip do you think gives the most info?

At this point it would be either of the two lurkers (bozo and bo). They haven't engaged in this game or said anything of note. I'm sorry for repeatedly tunneling on this but why did bo do that invalid vote. I do get scummy vibes from that action so yes I'm concerned about it. Also bozo, it would be cool if yiu had more than four post that weren't just and cryptic.

What about yourself? What are your answers for these questions?

First off, you skipped my first question

Secondly, what info do we gain from eliminating lurkers? Like if Bozo was eliminated right now, what do we learn? If bo were eliminated, what do we learn?

I'll give my answers after I'm done following up on yours.

Sorry about skipping it, brain is fried from today and haven't eaten anything yet today.

**Who in the game do you think is most deserving of the title "useless town". Someone who isn't really helping but is probably not mafia.**

Ghug and Snowy due to their obsession with joke votes and baiting Jamiet instead of doing anything constructive. I would also add Food to this as well with his joke votes that aren't doing much to trigger a response if he's not making them believable.


Secondly, what info do we gain from eliminating lurkers? Like if Bozo was eliminated right now, what do we learn? If bo were eliminated, what do we learn?


If bozo was eliminated we should get a grasp of his weirdly cryptic post that he has had like his weird out of the blue celaph vote just now. Maybe it will help clear up my nulls if he flips town I dunno. I'm trying to get a better grasp about what is learned when players are dk and flipped.

If bo was day killed and he flipped scum then maybe we will learn that the invalid vote was a bait to start a failed wagon. If he flipped town then idk.

Like I said I mostly understand this game just dunno what to get from flips. I was just hoping to learn alongside yall.


OK now your turn. : )

[ghug]

how should we deal with lurkers?

I think keep sending them more and more questions to force them to engage. If that doesn't work then start flash wagons and see if that gets them to post. If that also fails then try to hammer them because at that point they are wasting everyone's time and hurting town chances because they don't want to put in the effort.

If you had to flip one person right now purely for info and not alignment, whose flip do you think gives the most info?

At this point it would be either of the two lurkers (bozo and bo). They haven't engaged in this game or said anything of note. I'm sorry for repeatedly tunneling on this but why did bo do that invalid vote. I do get scummy vibes from that action so yes I'm concerned about it. Also bozo, it would be cool if yiu had more than four post that weren't just and cryptic.

What about yourself? What are your answers for these questions?

First off, you skipped my first question

Secondly, what info do we gain from eliminating lurkers? Like if Bozo was eliminated right now, what do we learn? If bo were eliminated, what do we learn?

I'll give my answers after I'm done following up on yours.

Sorry about skipping it, brain is fried from today and haven't eaten anything yet today.

**Who in the game do you think is most deserving of the title "useless town". Someone who isn't really helping but is probably not mafia.**

Ghug and Snowy due to their obsession with joke votes and baiting Jamiet instead of doing anything constructive. I would also add Food to this as well with his joke votes that aren't doing much to trigger a response if he's not making them believable.


Secondly, what info do we gain from eliminating lurkers? Like if Bozo was eliminated right now, what do we learn? If bo were eliminated, what do we learn?


If bozo was eliminated we should get a grasp of his weirdly cryptic post that he has had like his weird out of the blue celaph vote just now. Maybe it will help clear up my nulls if he flips town I dunno. I'm trying to get a better grasp about what is learned when players are dk and flipped.

If bo was day killed and he flipped scum then maybe we will learn that the invalid vote was a bait to start a failed wagon. If he flipped town then idk.

Like I said I mostly understand this game just dunno what to get from flips. I was just hoping to learn alongside yall.


OK now your turn. : )

Why are you voting for me if you think I'm useless town?

[BesharamSabi]

Also Sabi, why include Bo as a lurker but not Celaph when Bo has more posts than Celaph?

Celaph has included analysis in their post of the game and has engaged even if it's lower post count and no vote yet. Bo hasn't done much to engaged with the game besides evade questions and do that invalid vote and try to tunnel on Bona unsuccessfully. I'm waiting to see how celaph fares once they are done with the school day and if they continue to post.

I do think that celaph tried to buddy you and food which doesn't seem like a person that is lurking would do.

Does that clear up my criteria for lurker or not. If I'm off base with this assumption please let me know because I'm still learning lol.

[BesharamSabi]

First off, you skipped my first question

Secondly, what info do we gain from eliminating lurkers? Like if Bozo was eliminated right now, what do we learn? If bo were eliminated, what do we learn?

I'll give my answers after I'm done following up on yours.

Sorry about skipping it, brain is fried from today and haven't eaten anything yet today.

**Who in the game do you think is most deserving of the title "useless town". Someone who isn't really helping but is probably not mafia.**

Ghug and Snowy due to their obsession with joke votes and baiting Jamiet instead of doing anything constructive. I would also add Food to this as well with his joke votes that aren't doing much to trigger a response if he's not making them believable.


Secondly, what info do we gain from eliminating lurkers? Like if Bozo was eliminated right now, what do we learn? If bo were eliminated, what do we learn?


If bozo was eliminated we should get a grasp of his weirdly cryptic post that he has had like his weird out of the blue celaph vote just now. Maybe it will help clear up my nulls if he flips town I dunno. I'm trying to get a better grasp about what is learned when players are dk and flipped.

If bo was day killed and he flipped scum then maybe we will learn that the invalid vote was a bait to start a failed wagon. If he flipped town then idk.

Like I said I mostly understand this game just dunno what to get from flips. I was just hoping to learn alongside yall.


OK now your turn. : )

Why are you voting for me if you think I'm useless town?

My original vote was from the throwaway reaction to your "daddy ghug" comment. I haven't changed my vote yet because I haven't figured out who seems the most scummy. I apologize for forgetting to ##unvote. But yea you're not the most scummy in my eyes, just one of the useless non lurkers. No idea if that's better or worse.

[ghug]

Sorry about skipping it, brain is fried from today and haven't eaten anything yet today.

**Who in the game do you think is most deserving of the title "useless town". Someone who isn't really helping but is probably not mafia.**

Ghug and Snowy due to their obsession with joke votes and baiting Jamiet instead of doing anything constructive. I would also add Food to this as well with his joke votes that aren't doing much to trigger a response if he's not making them believable.


Secondly, what info do we gain from eliminating lurkers? Like if Bozo was eliminated right now, what do we learn? If bo were eliminated, what do we learn?


If bozo was eliminated we should get a grasp of his weirdly cryptic post that he has had like his weird out of the blue celaph vote just now. Maybe it will help clear up my nulls if he flips town I dunno. I'm trying to get a better grasp about what is learned when players are dk and flipped.

If bo was day killed and he flipped scum then maybe we will learn that the invalid vote was a bait to start a failed wagon. If he flipped town then idk.

Like I said I mostly understand this game just dunno what to get from flips. I was just hoping to learn alongside yall.


OK now your turn. : )

Why are you voting for me if you think I'm useless town?

My original vote was from the throwaway reaction to your "daddy ghug" comment. I haven't changed my vote yet because I haven't figured out who seems the most scummy. I apologize for forgetting to ##unvote. But yea you're not the most scummy in my eyes, just one of the useless non lurkers. No idea if that's better or worse.

Why are you giving me shit for not casting meaningful votes if you haven't cast one yourself?

[foodcoats]

##VOTE bo_sox

##VOTE celaph

Why are you flip flopping your vote around so much?

bo was a stupid vote.

Celaph, I wanted to see a competitive wagon with yours and one other thing for later.

[ghug]

##VOTE bo_sox

##VOTE celaph

Why are you flip flopping your vote around so much?

bo was a stupid vote.

Celaph, I wanted to see a competitive wagon with yours and one other thing for later.

Voting for stupid does not a stupid vote make.

Why do you prefer celaph to bo?

[Squigs44]

Also Sabi, why include Bo as a lurker but not Celaph when Bo has more posts than Celaph?

Celaph has included analysis in their post of the game and has engaged even if it's lower post count and no vote yet. Bo hasn't done much to engaged with the game besides evade questions and do that invalid vote and try to tunnel on Bona unsuccessfully. I'm waiting to see how celaph fares once they are done with the school day and if they continue to post.

I do think that celaph tried to buddy you and food which doesn't seem like a person that is lurking would do.

Does that clear up my criteria for lurker or not. If I'm off base with this assumption please let me know because I'm still learning lol.

Interesting.

Celaph has 0 votes and 0 scumreads so far. Celaph themselves even said:

Roughly 0 of my posts have been analyzing Bona's actions and only two of them have been asking about others perceptions of him. Whereas I've highlighted things that I've liked from food, llama, and squigs the latter two being my strongest townreads at the moment.

I would characterize Celaphs play more as chiming in on who they like than analysis. Their latest 2 posts are really the only thing that might be considered analysis and it's inconclusive analysis at best.

Now I'm not saying Bo is analyzing or being productive but at least he has 2 votes, and he does share thoughts on food, ghug, myself and bozo, which is about the same level of engagement that we get from Celaph

[Squigs44]

OK now your turn. : )

Useless town candidate: Snowy. I think snowy is probably more likely town based on the abstract play, but it's so enigmatic and elusive that it's not good for town

Lurkers: Lurkers are fine to vote out and eliminate early, but there are usually better wagons. We shouldn't default to piling on lurkers as the wagonomics on that would be awful but it's not a huge loss if they get eliminated. I'd much rather find someone scummy than someone useless.

Info flip: I strongly disagree that lurkers give info. Info comes from interactions and wagonomics. You want someone that is polarizing. Someone who has been both attacked and defended and has both attacked and defended. Flipping counterwagons is usually good later but that doesn't apply here. So I would say right now Bona could be a good info flip. Bona has had 5 votes cast for, has casted 3 votes, has had some people offer defenses/explanations, and has interacted with a decent number of people in interesting ways.

[ghug]

OK now your turn. : )

Useless town candidate: Snowy. I think snowy is probably more likely town based on the abstract play, but it's so enigmatic and elusive that it's not good for town

Lurkers: Lurkers are fine to vote out and eliminate early, but there are usually better wagons. We shouldn't default to piling on lurkers as the wagonomics on that would be awful but it's not a huge loss if they get eliminated. I'd much rather find someone scummy than someone useless.

Info flip: I strongly disagree that lurkers give info. Info comes from interactions and wagonomics. You want someone that is polarizing. Someone who has been both attacked and defended and has both attacked and defended. Flipping counterwagons is usually good later but that doesn't apply here. So I would say right now Bona could be a good info flip. Bona has had 5 votes cast for, has casted 3 votes, has had some people offer defenses/explanations, and has interacted with a decent number of people in interesting ways.

Is your intent day one purely to flip someone for info? Do you have any scumreads?

[Squigs44]

OK now your turn. : )

Useless town candidate: Snowy. I think snowy is probably more likely town based on the abstract play, but it's so enigmatic and elusive that it's not good for town

Lurkers: Lurkers are fine to vote out and eliminate early, but there are usually better wagons. We shouldn't default to piling on lurkers as the wagonomics on that would be awful but it's not a huge loss if they get eliminated. I'd much rather find someone scummy than someone useless.

Info flip: I strongly disagree that lurkers give info. Info comes from interactions and wagonomics. You want someone that is polarizing. Someone who has been both attacked and defended and has both attacked and defended. Flipping counterwagons is usually good later but that doesn't apply here. So I would say right now Bona could be a good info flip. Bona has had 5 votes cast for, has casted 3 votes, has had some people offer defenses/explanations, and has interacted with a decent number of people in interesting ways.

Is your intent day one purely to flip someone for info? Do you have any scumreads?

This was a response to a question about who you would flip purely for info and not for alignment.

My vote is on Celaph because Celaph is my most likely scum read

[Bonatogether]

i don't like sqoogs (1)

historically this means i scumread people (2)

rn i kinda scum sqoogs (3)

not sure if 2 is causing 3 or if there's something legit there

[BesharamSabi]

Why are you voting for me if you think I'm useless town?

My original vote was from the throwaway reaction to your "daddy ghug" comment. I haven't changed my vote yet because I haven't figured out who seems the most scummy. I apologize for forgetting to ##unvote. But yea you're not the most scummy in my eyes, just one of the useless non lurkers. No idea if that's better or worse.

Why are you giving me shit for not casting meaningful votes if you haven't cast one yourself?

Because I'm engaging and trying to figure out who is scummy and you're too busy trying to bait Jamiet with joke votes. There's a difference. I know how yall take vca and I want to make sure after the first 24 hour joke vote fest that my vote is serious and solid. Sorry if that makes me a hypocrite.

[Jamiet99uk]

##UNvote

[Jamiet99uk]

Sleepytime now.

Isle
beeb
ack

[damo666]

G'night Jamie

[foodcoats]

Why are you flip flopping your vote around so much?

bo was a stupid vote.

Celaph, I wanted to see a competitive wagon with yours and one other thing for later.

Voting for stupid does not a stupid vote make.

Why do you prefer celaph to bo?

I think it generates a more interesting situation.

I have no scumread on celaph, or on bo. I’d say both are pretty null for me at the moment.

But I’m interested in both bozo and Squigs, who are (or were on, catching up) celaph’s wagon.

[BesharamSabi]

Also Sabi, why include Bo as a lurker but not Celaph when Bo has more posts than Celaph?

Celaph has included analysis in their post of the game and has engaged even if it's lower post count and no vote yet. Bo hasn't done much to engaged with the game besides evade questions and do that invalid vote and try to tunnel on Bona unsuccessfully. I'm waiting to see how celaph fares once they are done with the school day and if they continue to post.

I do think that celaph tried to buddy you and food which doesn't seem like a person that is lurking would do.

Does that clear up my criteria for lurker or not. If I'm off base with this assumption please let me know because I'm still learning lol.

Interesting.

Celaph has 0 votes and 0 scumreads so far. Celaph themselves even said:

Roughly 0 of my posts have been analyzing Bona's actions and only two of them have been asking about others perceptions of him. Whereas I've highlighted things that I've liked from food, llama, and squigs the latter two being my strongest townreads at the moment.

I would characterize Celaphs play more as chiming in on who they like than analysis. Their latest 2 posts are really the only thing that might be considered analysis and it's inconclusive analysis at best.

Now I'm not saying Bo is analyzing or being productive but at least he has 2 votes, and he does share thoughts on food, ghug, myself and bozo, which is about the same level of engagement that we get from Celaph

I guess I'm viewing the engagement differently. I suppose you're right and I might be too forgiving or I guess the better word is lenitient to celaph engagement with this game.

I do need celaph, bo, and bozo to post something of value. Also need celaph to actually vote as well.

OK now your turn. : )

Useless town candidate: Snowy. I think snowy is probably more likely town based on the abstract play, but it's so enigmatic and elusive that it's not good for town

Lurkers: Lurkers are fine to vote out and eliminate early, but there are usually better wagons. We shouldn't default to piling on lurkers as the wagonomics on that would be awful but it's not a huge loss if they get eliminated. I'd much rather find someone scummy than someone useless.

Info flip: I strongly disagree that lurkers give info. Info comes from interactions and wagonomics. You want someone that is polarizing. Someone who has been both attacked and defended and has both attacked and defended. Flipping counterwagons is usually good later but that doesn't apply here. So I would say right now Bona could be a good info flip. Bona has had 5 votes cast for, has casted 3 votes, has had some people offer defenses/explanations, and has interacted with a decent number of people in interesting ways.

Thank you also for explaining info kills vs liker kills vs useless town kills. I appreciate it. I dunno if I agree with killing off Bona for info because he has proven to be useful for scumhunting in the late game. But that was a one game experience I had with him so I could be wrong.

Anyway I'm sorry about the delay. I got my dinner and have to go gm a virtual face to face game soon. I will be back later on but my brain is a bit oversimulated with mafia stuff.

[foodcoats]

OK now your turn. : )

Useless town candidate: Snowy. I think snowy is probably more likely town based on the abstract play, but it's so enigmatic and elusive that it's not good for town

Lurkers: Lurkers are fine to vote out and eliminate early, but there are usually better wagons. We shouldn't default to piling on lurkers as the wagonomics on that would be awful but it's not a huge loss if they get eliminated. I'd much rather find someone scummy than someone useless.

Info flip: I strongly disagree that lurkers give info. Info comes from interactions and wagonomics. You want someone that is polarizing. Someone who has been both attacked and defended and has both attacked and defended. Flipping counterwagons is usually good later but that doesn't apply here. So I would say right now Bona could be a good info flip. Bona has had 5 votes cast for, has casted 3 votes, has had some people offer defenses/explanations, and has interacted with a decent number of people in interesting ways.

I think bona is a bad choice. I’m not against info-wagons, but I think bona picking on a small detail of an interaction between two players as a way to catch scum, as he picked on between ghug and Squigs, is very much in bona’s scumhunting wheelhouse, and therefore I’m quite inclined to think he is town (whether or not his picking there was correct)