M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3481 Post by lfischl » Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:38 am

ghug wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:29 am
Nice. Now give me some thoughts on the game.
still trying to catch up on what happened in the night, probably will have more thoughts in the morning.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3482 Post by kgray » Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:40 am

ghug wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 5:34 am
Apparently my grandma beat someone up in her nursing home today.
Dang, how come none of her guts got passed on to you?
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3483 Post by ghug » Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:44 am

kgray wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:40 am
ghug wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 5:34 am
Apparently my grandma beat someone up in her nursing home today.
Dang, how come none of her guts got passed on to you?
I was in a fight once.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3484 Post by ghug » Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:46 am

Hi Boat.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3485 Post by bozotheclown » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:01 am

ghug wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:25 am
President Eden wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:06 am
Chaqa wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:53 am


The selection of the power can be.

If Damo were Oracle and was roleblocked (with me fake claiming), he would not reveal anything, at least based on how I interpret things.

That isn't what happened, so we can safely assume Damo is not Oracle.

Or, at least, I can.
The plain language of the role suggests strongly that it cannot be roleblocked at all:

“… At Night, you may ##REVEAL a DEAD player. If you die from any method, that player’s ROLE and ALIGNMENT will be publicly posted in the game thread, You may change your REVEAL target on future nights. Your ability cannot be roleblocked.

We can be certain that damo is not the Oracle, and almost certain jasnah is not, so we have an Oracle, so in theory we could let you live until the Oracle pops off and reveals damo was the Cop, or until we’re at 9.

That is the only condition by which I would assent to your continued survival. I am not at all impressed by your alleged breadcrumb, which wouldn’t have taken that long to find and make up if you were mafia and decided to claim Cop. I am quite certain you’re mafia, but I recognize this is a pretty good test case for the Oracle’s ability, and so I am fine with voting someone else off on the basis that we will resolve your slot with the Oracle at some point anyway.
I think the Oracle needs to be used on someone whose alignment we didn't know.
I do not think it would be a bad use of the oracle if there is not a cop CC, because in that case finding out damo's role does tell us the alignment of someone whose alignment we don't know (Chaqa), and probably a second as well (Fluminator if damo was not the cop, PE if damo was the cop). I think it is a better alternative to eventually DKing Chaqa despite no cop CC and never knowing who was the real cop.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3486 Post by bozotheclown » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:27 am

Durga wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:28 am
President Eden wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:24 am
Durga wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:20 am


Agh snowy not you and not this. Are you really trying to shade Flum for trying to figure out whether damo is cop?
I think you have it backwards, Fluminator's behavior was quite clearly that of someone who wanted to shut down any meaningful discussion of the idea. He went and cherrypicked the one post from damo that most sounded contrary to the idea that damo was Cop, and ignored the broader body of work (helpfully reposted by bozo) that made a reasonable case.
All I remember is Flum making comments on how he's confirmed scum and then quoting a damo post with little to no context on his end. Calling a quote that very clearly demonstrates damo is unlikely to be cop is not "cherrypicking" - nor do bozo's quotes make a reasonable case but I think I'm not gonna convince you of that one

Where did he shut down meaningful discussion? also, frankly, if he did it was probably for the better because we're not daykilling chaqa without a cc.
I was not trying to make a case one way or the other on whether damo was the cop, I was listing all of damo's posts that commented on PE for reference. The post asking if PE's self voting could be scum indicative does stand out compared to all of his other comments about PE, but I am not sure it rules him out as the cop with an innocent report on PE, he could have thrown that in to make it less obvious to the mafia. I do think that if damo was revealed to be the cop, it would be a safe assumption that PE was his innocent report, and that would be the point of damo's PE crumbs because I do not think damo could have anticipated us trying to determine whether or not he was the cop based on his comments on PE. Looking at damo's D1 posts in general, his certainty that PE was town also stands out, as well as stating in his first post of the game that "PE is town."

I think you made a good point about damo's N1 posts not giving any indication that he knew Chaqa's claim was fake, but again he could have been trying not to give any hints to the mafia.

I do agree that Chaqa should not be the DK unless there is a cop CC, and least until later in the game, and maybe the oracle or JOAT will decide to resolve this issue for us.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3487 Post by TheFlyingBoat » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:36 am

A lot to catch up on, and I am sorry in advance if I missed any question asked of me. Please re-ask if I did. Anyways I wanted to post my reads that I have coming into this day based on old stuff and a combination of VCA at the end of Day 1 and frustration with the possibly fake cop claim. Will adjust based on the catch up I do tomorrow while I lounge around and follow my many fantasy teams.

BesharamSabi:

Slight Town. I used to think think they had a slight scum lean for basically posting a lot of stuff, pretending not to be familiar with things in order to avoid giving opinions and reads on things, etc. The possibility of being scum still exists in my mind, but the townslip on not understanding how the quick topic works seems like something they would be unlikely to forge.

Bonatogether

Slight town. I think Bona's contributions have gotten better over time in terms of actually taking strong stances and he does seem to be more actively engaged in discussions and offering opinions that I can sort of follow. I think they're mostly wrong and his reads aren't very good, but in the end I don't think they're bad because he's scummy, I think they're just not good. Either he's town or a god-tier scum player.

bozotheclown

Slight town. While I disliked his early support for no-kill Day 1 I appreciated him eventually coming around and more importantly I very much appreciated his defense of jasnah. Killing 2 towns in consecutive DKs is bad. Standing against it vociferously is good.


BunnyGo

Town all but clear. He is the Miller almost certainly imo.

Chaqa

Heavy scum lean. I explained in my vote and in response to kgray's question about a potential scum slip that his previous justification for strategy just didn't make sense and seemed to lead to decisions that would be pro scum. Lying about his reasons to go after jasnah coupled with the ridiculousness of his oracle/JOAT waste just made me think he was super scummy. Combine that with the fake cop claim and some of PE's great posts on the matter and I think the dude has to be scum.

Doom427

Slight scum. Did not like their defense of no-killing at all, especially given at the very beginning of the game they were pro killing D1. Then their defense of killing jasnah just didn't make sense though only in slightly scummy, not a super scummy way.

Durga

Slight Town. Read the Durga-PE fights on Day 1 as town on town and have continued to read her as town largely since. I think her reads are pretty decent and I liked her defense of jasnah. I don't like the weird switch off of Chaqa when a wagon started building around him. That gave me some scum reads that weren't quite powerful enough to overwhelm my very strong town reads of her previously.

Fluminator

The immense size of Chaqa's balls to claim his cleared townie was a fellow mafia member is so large to be impossible. For that reason I think Flum has to be town. Also the fact the bot testing he was doing actually found a real issue and was motivated by the fact he realized there was an actual issue neutered some of my animosity towards what I perceived as a waste of time and a failure to hunt.

ghug

Slight town. I really like ghug's posts. I feel like there was a lot I learned that helped me process the Day 1 turns from him and that his posts generally helped contribute to town thinking through things in a thoughtful fashion.

Jamiet99uk

Slight scum. Gut read, something seems off, but nothing concrete.

kgray

Slight scum. I really, really do not like the Chaqa->Jasnah vote. I view voters that had never voted for jasnah that then switched onto her right after the PR claim with incredible scrutiny. She did seem to be seriously scum hunting when going after Chaqa but given that she's incredibly smart in general and seems to receive universal acclaim for their skills as scum, I give her great posts less weight than I give others for better or worse.

lfischl

Null. Is the dude even real?

President Eden

Town. See above for part of the read re: Durga-PE fight. Came off incredibly town vs town. Damo's town clear if we believe that Damo is the cop. Strong posts and thoughts, plenty of original contributions that lead me to believe he's town. I don't like the Jas->Cha vote switch at the end but given he had voted for Jasnah right before voting for Chaqa as the wagon caught fire, I don't think of it as bad of a scum tell. I like his position on day-killing and on miller reveal D1. Showed strong pro town play.

rdrivera2005

Null. See lfischl.

snowy801

Neutral. The guy has buddied me a lot which makes me a little worried he is trying to play me for a fool with idle flattery and the such from calling me great and my haters a bag of dicks to saying I was based and pink pilled. That being said I feel like he has posted a lout of well thought out posts, posted original thoughts, and was in favor of keeping discussions on track and away from shitposts.

TheFlyingBoat

Town. Great guy imo. 10/10 would trust

Tom Bombadil

Null. Dude must be lost in the Shire.

Vecna

Slight town. I liked him shooting down some of the dumber Oracle/JOAT suggestion wrt how to handle the jasnah/bunny miller claim. That bought some red with me. Scum seems predisposed to just letting PRs waste their time there. It's odd how much he wanted to protect worcej, but hey everyone has their town reads and he stuck to his so fair enough.

worcej

Slight scum. Didn't like his no kill position, especially disliked his kill both position which he continued to maintain, view him as generally taking anti-town positions, but the conviction and anger he has seems to often come from a town place. I did like his flavius view of Sabi even though I myself no longer quite share it. I don't like his attempt to make discussion of Bunny being the Miller again and again. I thought it was resolved and I think bringing it up generally serves just to distract town.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3488 Post by TheFlyingBoat » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:36 am

ghug wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 6:46 am
Hi Boat.
Hi ghug
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3489 Post by TheFlyingBoat » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:37 am

just for ghug ##vote vecna
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3490 Post by bozotheclown » Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:42 am

bozotheclown wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:01 am
ghug wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:25 am
President Eden wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:06 am

The plain language of the role suggests strongly that it cannot be roleblocked at all:

“… At Night, you may ##REVEAL a DEAD player. If you die from any method, that player’s ROLE and ALIGNMENT will be publicly posted in the game thread, You may change your REVEAL target on future nights. Your ability cannot be roleblocked.

We can be certain that damo is not the Oracle, and almost certain jasnah is not, so we have an Oracle, so in theory we could let you live until the Oracle pops off and reveals damo was the Cop, or until we’re at 9.

That is the only condition by which I would assent to your continued survival. I am not at all impressed by your alleged breadcrumb, which wouldn’t have taken that long to find and make up if you were mafia and decided to claim Cop. I am quite certain you’re mafia, but I recognize this is a pretty good test case for the Oracle’s ability, and so I am fine with voting someone else off on the basis that we will resolve your slot with the Oracle at some point anyway.
I think the Oracle needs to be used on someone whose alignment we didn't know.
I do not think it would be a bad use of the oracle if there is not a cop CC, because in that case finding out damo's role does tell us the alignment of someone whose alignment we don't know (Chaqa), and probably a second as well (Fluminator if damo was not the cop, PE if damo was the cop). I think it is a better alternative to eventually DKing Chaqa despite no cop CC and never knowing who was the real cop.
I also think finding out damo's role would be reasonable for the JOAT, especially if they have a cop scan from N1 that they plan on reporting soon. There is no guarantee that the oracle will reveal any information before the game ends.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3492 Post by Vecna » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:13 am

Are people really missing me so much that youre just wagoning me?

I was playing diplomacy for ~15 hours yesterday and im watching some of the coverage atm.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3493 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:39 am

Catching up quickly from page 161.

I note from the Bot that a Vecna wagon has appeared from out of nowhere. Curious.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3494 Post by BunnyGo » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:49 am

damo666 wrote:
Sat Sep 25, 2021 7:12 pm
Fluminator wrote:
Sat Sep 25, 2021 6:51 pm
Also yes, we're speedkilling Chaqa if he survives tonight. We won't even give him a chance for final words.
ScummyFlummy
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3495 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:51 am

snowy801 wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:01 am
Chaqa wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:55 am

3. If I were mafia, why would I withdraw my claim?
And I note that you did not withdraw your claim, and very few people actually expected you to for whatever noise you made overnight.
What do you mean Snowy? Chaqa explicitly did withdraw his claim overnight. (And has now resumed claiming it today).

Here was the retraction post:
Chaqa wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:30 pm
Okay so I’m actually not cop, I just didn’t want you guys to vote me.

If jasnah can fakeclaim so can I
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3496 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Sep 26, 2021 9:57 am

Chaqa wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 1:16 am
For a bunch of people that said I should recognize naunce, no one listens to any of the naunce in how I've been playing. It's been a blast. I'm not posting anymore for this phase. Deal with it.
And yet, friends, he would continue to post.

This sounds like grumpy drunk!Jamie post, haha.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3497 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:07 am

President Eden wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:22 am
Durga wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:13 am
Either way no one should be voting for Chaqa without a counterclaim. Even if Chaqa IS scum with a fake claim, we can wait until a cc to make that determination.
There won't be one if damo was the Cop. Oracle really needs to stay fixed on damo for this to work. But I think that's a fair position to take if the Oracle targets damo every night from here on out.
Or the JOAT could do it.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3498 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:15 am

Fluminator wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:02 am
kgray wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:00 am
Fluminator wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 2:59 am

Ghug's post still doesn't make complete sense to me. I haven't parsed his response yet either. I'm in the middle of D&D so I'll get back to ghug later.
wtf Flum why are you here at all when you’re playing DnD? Figure out your priorities, smh
It's been 45 minutes of treasure distribution when I'm a humble monk who doesn't need any
Ah, those times when D&D becomes "fantasy accountancy simulator", hooray.
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3499 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:22 am

kgray wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:36 am
TheFlyingBoat wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 9:57 pm
##VOTE worcej

can't kill the cop
Also, what is this weird justification?

I feel like TFB has been a little too careful about all his reads/votes this game.
Chaqa had claimed cop just before this. What's weird about TheFlyingBurrito mentioning that?
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Re: M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

#3500 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:23 am

Bonatogether wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:42 am
President Eden wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 3:40 am
Refresh me on why you're voting for Chaqa.
As town, he wouldn't be useful, even if he is cop, due to being rbed. If he's scum, keeping him around is strictly negative since he won't slip anything. Therefore, not voting him out is either not-good or bad, so we should vote him out.
This is terrible, terrible logic.
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