M70 - THE BASKIN-ROBBINS CONSPIRACY [HIDDEN]

[rdrivera2005]

I just feel like you're saying she's town but she should die anyway because she did something you didn't like.

While point 1 is important, point 2 and 3 are more critical. 2 says there's a good chance Jasnah is a baddie, and 3 says we have to deal with a player in the game who has a good chance of being a baddie. While I get that people are saying they think this is a town play, the fact remains that day 2 or 3 when we could talk about night time plays, instead Mafia could push the conversation back to Miller. (and it remains a solid thing for a townie to push for, if they haven't come up with any other solid scum reads)

Yeah I understand these points, I just don't really agree that we should kill someone who is likely to be town (and I strongly disagree that someone being capable of doing something as a baddie means they have a good chance of being a baddie just because they do that thing).

If people disagree that jasnah is likely to be town, that's one thing. But killing a townread just to get it out of the way because Mafia could bring it up later isn't worth it, imo. If people have no better scumreads later, then we can kill her later.

I know I can trust my spokesperson.

[lfischl]

At this point jasnah lack of effort in this game is kinda disappointing. At this point I am leaning towards voting for her solely so we could all move on.

I agree with this tbh, why would you hardclaim miller and just not say anything else.

[BunnyGo]

It's two-fold:

1) I don't like having teammates make life hard for the team. This game is hard enough.

2) I *do* think Jasnah is capable of this play as scum.

3) I think that resolving this sooner is better than later.

I just feel like you're saying she's town but she should die anyway because she did something you didn't like.

Considering Jasnah said more or less the same thing about Bunny this isn´t so unexpected, is it?

Do you think so little of me?

[Doom427]

She hardclaimed miller. She can't back out of that and you can't try to spin it in any way. Her vague quasi-retraction doesn't mean shit to me.

I've begun to observe that no one really respects hard claims anymore.

I respect a hardclaim when it´s done under pressure or with other relevant information (like who you targetted or something like that). But a Miller hard claim on middle of D1 isn´t exactly a claim that should be taken that seriously.

Ok, but that only makes sense if we're talking about a real power that actually helps us. If I'm saying "HARD CLAIM, I'M THE DOCTOR", I don't think that should be respected, b/c like you said there's no reason for me to claim it. But miller is a shitty anti-role that's only power is hurting town scans. There had been quite a bit of chatter about how Miller should hard claim in the middle of D1, even without pressure. The only drawback is maybe the Mafia shoots the Miller if everyone trusts them. Oh no.

[BesharamSabi]

At this point jasnah lack of effort in this game is kinda disappointing. At this point I am leaning towards voting for her solely so we could all move on.

I agree with this tbh, why would you hardclaim miller and just not say anything else.

The lack of gamesmanship is disheartening tbh. What's a vote end thing, is it before or after vote hash tag?

[kgray]

It's two-fold:

1) I don't like having teammates make life hard for the team. This game is hard enough.

2) I *do* think Jasnah is capable of this play as scum.

3) I think that resolving this sooner is better than later.

I just feel like you're saying she's town but she should die anyway because she did something you didn't like.

Considering Jasnah said more or less the same thing about Bunny this isn´t so unexpected, is it?

Yeah, maybe true. I guess I just feel like since Bunny is engaging I'd expect him to want to avoid killing town, whereas I don't get the impression jasnah really cares at all.

But people have made their thoughts on the situation clear, it's just that I don't agree with them.

[BunnyGo]

At this point jasnah lack of effort in this game is kinda disappointing. At this point I am leaning towards voting for her solely so we could all move on.

I agree with this tbh, why would you hardclaim miller and just not say anything else.

The lack of gamesmanship is disheartening tbh. What's a vote end thing, is it before or after vote hash tag?

##vote person ##end (you can also have the ##end in a different post)

[rdrivera2005]

My issue is that as this is a no-flip game, we will never know if Bunny is Miller if/when he dies. Likewise for jasnah. If we flip jasnah, at some point the JOAT can autopsy or the Oracle can reveal, and then we will get two people's roles/alignments for one, basically.

If jasnah comes up as Miller -> Bunny is scum
If jasnah comes up as scum -> Bunny is Miller
If jasnah comes up as town -> Bunny is Miller

See the value?

Additionally, two hardclaims cannot exist independently. This is a big issue for me and I'm surprised others aren't making a big deal out of it. Egos, mostly.

It's possible jasnah is town doing this, but I can't see any reason for town!jasnah to fake hardclaim Miller and I can't see any reason for scum!Bunny or nonMillerTown!Bunnyt to counterclaim.

This means Bunny must be Miller and jasnah is probably scum, to me at least.

So, you can´t see a reason for town Jasnah to fakeclaim (which I don´t agree but can see your point).
Could you point the reason you see for scum Jasnah to fakeclaim Miller when she did?

[Durga]

You know him better than I do. Do you think my meta on him is wrong?

Which meta?

That normally as town he freely calls out people he thinks are scummy D1 and generally gives a lot more reads than a random unexplained tunnel on damo and whatever this omgus is on me.

Hmmmm. I don't recall

[kgray]

I'm glad you're here Rivera <3

[Doom427]

I just feel like you're saying she's town but she should die anyway because she did something you didn't like.

While point 1 is important, point 2 and 3 are more critical. 2 says there's a good chance Jasnah is a baddie, and 3 says we have to deal with a player in the game who has a good chance of being a baddie. While I get that people are saying they think this is a town play, the fact remains that day 2 or 3 when we could talk about night time plays, instead Mafia could push the conversation back to Miller. (and it remains a solid thing for a townie to push for, if they haven't come up with any other solid scum reads)

Yeah I understand these points, I just don't really agree that we should kill someone who is likely to be town (and I strongly disagree that someone being capable of doing something as a baddie means they have a good chance of being a baddie just because they do that thing).

If people disagree that jasnah is likely to be town, that's one thing. But killing a townread just to get it out of the way because Mafia could bring it up later isn't worth it, imo. If people have no better scumreads later, then we can kill her later.

No matter who we kill it's likely to be town. It's 4 bad to 17 good. So anyone who thinks there is a 25% chance Jasnah is scum, should be voting Jasnah. Unless someone else is higher (and that's wild if it is), there isn't really a better person to vote

[Durga]

Oh no not another math guy

[rdrivera2005]

I'm also shocked how much I'm agreeing with bozo's take on things. I feel like I should be concerned about this.

Considering he is voting you how are you agreeing with him so much?

[kgray]

While point 1 is important, point 2 and 3 are more critical. 2 says there's a good chance Jasnah is a baddie, and 3 says we have to deal with a player in the game who has a good chance of being a baddie. While I get that people are saying they think this is a town play, the fact remains that day 2 or 3 when we could talk about night time plays, instead Mafia could push the conversation back to Miller. (and it remains a solid thing for a townie to push for, if they haven't come up with any other solid scum reads)

Yeah I understand these points, I just don't really agree that we should kill someone who is likely to be town (and I strongly disagree that someone being capable of doing something as a baddie means they have a good chance of being a baddie just because they do that thing).

If people disagree that jasnah is likely to be town, that's one thing. But killing a townread just to get it out of the way because Mafia could bring it up later isn't worth it, imo. If people have no better scumreads later, then we can kill her later.

No matter who we kill it's likely to be town. It's 4 bad to 17 good. So anyone who thinks there is a 25% chance Jasnah is scum, should be voting Jasnah. Unless someone else is higher (and that's wild if it is), there isn't really a better person to vote

I am saying I think jasnah's actions made her more likely to be town and therefore there is less than a 25% chance she is scum.

[Fluminator]

@Sabi

You don't know my meta, which is fine, but I habitually always attack votes on me. In this case, the wagon was indeed fucking awful.

What would you consider your meta to be?

[kgray]

Which meta?

That normally as town he freely calls out people he thinks are scummy D1 and generally gives a lot more reads than a random unexplained tunnel on damo and whatever this omgus is on me.

Hmmmm. I don't recall

Do you have a read on him? I feel like you're trying to avoid saying anything concrete here.

[Durga]

That normally as town he freely calls out people he thinks are scummy D1 and generally gives a lot more reads than a random unexplained tunnel on damo and whatever this omgus is on me.

Hmmmm. I don't recall

Do you have a read on him? I feel like you're trying to avoid saying anything concrete here.

I don't like to be wrong. My heart says townread flum but my heart just wants that because I love flum. I'm frankly a little unsure and he's null. I can usually read him really well. I don't want him to get killed today there are far better options

[lfischl]

Yeah I understand these points, I just don't really agree that we should kill someone who is likely to be town (and I strongly disagree that someone being capable of doing something as a baddie means they have a good chance of being a baddie just because they do that thing).

If people disagree that jasnah is likely to be town, that's one thing. But killing a townread just to get it out of the way because Mafia could bring it up later isn't worth it, imo. If people have no better scumreads later, then we can kill her later.

No matter who we kill it's likely to be town. It's 4 bad to 17 good. So anyone who thinks there is a 25% chance Jasnah is scum, should be voting Jasnah. Unless someone else is higher (and that's wild if it is), there isn't really a better person to vote

I am saying I think jasnah's actions made her more likely to be town and therefore there is less than a 25% chance she is scum.

##vote jasnah
I still think its a good idea to vote her though because of the low contribution. i probably won't be here for EOD, so my vote will stay on her unless someone gives me a reason to change it soon.

[Fluminator]

If I was scum, I'd feel too guilty about tricking Durga and would not let her defend me.

[Chaqa]

My issue is that as this is a no-flip game, we will never know if Bunny is Miller if/when he dies. Likewise for jasnah. If we flip jasnah, at some point the JOAT can autopsy or the Oracle can reveal, and then we will get two people's roles/alignments for one, basically.

If jasnah comes up as Miller -> Bunny is scum
If jasnah comes up as scum -> Bunny is Miller
If jasnah comes up as town -> Bunny is Miller

See the value?

Additionally, two hardclaims cannot exist independently. This is a big issue for me and I'm surprised others aren't making a big deal out of it. Egos, mostly.

It's possible jasnah is town doing this, but I can't see any reason for town!jasnah to fake hardclaim Miller and I can't see any reason for scum!Bunny or nonMillerTown!Bunnyt to counterclaim.

This means Bunny must be Miller and jasnah is probably scum, to me at least.

So, you can´t see a reason for town Jasnah to fakeclaim (which I don´t agree but can see your point).
Could you point the reason you see for scum Jasnah to fakeclaim Miller when she did?

I don’t really see any reason for jasnah to fake claim there at all.

Maybe Bunny is the fake, but he’s contributing and has more genuineness to his claim.