M68: Guns N' Roses GAMETHREAD [hidden]

[damo666]

There are therefore three scum in this pool:

1. Damo666
2. ghug
4. Worcej
5. BrainbomB
7. Prez Eden
8. Macca573
9. Rdrivera2005
10. Hamilton Brian
12. EMC
14. Johnny Big Horse

I agree with this. I can eliminate 1. I think 2 4 5 and 14 are town. So this leaves:

PE
Macca
rdr
HamBrian
EMC

Please walk us through why you think Worcej is town?

There were a couple of posts of his that felt close to obvtowning to me. I'm afraid I haven't time to find them now . Will do tomorrow.

Off to watch the big game in the pub. Hopefully I won't be post when I get back!

[damo666]

Yeah my anger was alcohol fuelled and my posts were ott for which I apologise.

As snowy says I'd rather put in behind us

Vecna made post entreating us to adhere to our agreed code of behaviour and that is good enough for me.

PS It was not fake and I am town.

Cheers,

Damo

I also apologize for what I said. Civility should not be conditional, and I often forget that. Sorry.

Accepted. Thank you.

[Jamiet99uk]

Off to watch the big game in the pub. Hopefully I won't be post when I get back!

"won't be post"

What does that mean?

[Jamiet99uk]

there is only one time where eden ever mentions damo all game and its n1 where he says he is probably town. there is only one momen where damo ever mentions eden and its day 1 where he says eden is kinda sus.

This is very interesting.

[ghug]

Snowy, I'd like to know what you were getting at with your question to me about Eden and the night results.

[Jamiet99uk]

Here is my current view of the potential scum, from most to least likely:

EMC^42
Macca^573
Damo^666
Worcej
Prez Eden
Johnny Big Horse
Rdrivera2005
Hamilton Brian
ghug
Brainbombe

Note this is based on the assumption (explained earlier) that Chaqa and Snowy are town with me.

[snowy801]

Snowy, I'd like to know what you were getting at with your question to me about Eden and the night results.

I may be off base, but as I recall your many accusations towards President Eden often amounted to one off "this post is fake" and "this is bad hunting", and it appeared to me that you never once addressed his overarching drive that you, Chaqa and brainbomb were scum in the context of you being gun claimants rather than simply the meta knowledge of hip shooting involved

I want to know why you never said "so you think everyone with a gun is scum you moron?" which is definitely what my image of you demanded that I see, and I contextualized it because now we know increasingly more that Chaqa and by consequence Jamiet are likely town, and Eden at some point expanded from the three aforementioned to four including Jamiet.

Essentially, I find that your attacks on Eden are weak and peripheral and wonder why.

[ghug]

Snowy, I'd like to know what you were getting at with your question to me about Eden and the night results.

I may be off base, but as I recall your many accusations towards President Eden often amounted to one off "this post is fake" and "this is bad hunting", and it appeared to me that you never once addressed his overarching drive that you, Chaqa and brainbomb were scum in the context of you being gun claimants rather than simply the meta knowledge of hip shooting involved

I want to know why you never said "so you think everyone with a gun is scum you moron?" which is definitely what my image of you demanded that I see, and I contextualized it because now we know increasingly more that Chaqa and by consequence Jamiet are likely town, and Eden at some point expanded from the three aforementioned to four including Jamiet.

Essentially, I find that your attacks on Eden are weak and peripheral and wonder why.

Chaqa didn't vote him at the end out of nowhere, brain and I didn't vote him at all. Jamie did, but you can't have four scum.

Chaqa was shading him all day and generally down for it, Jamie voted him, you agreed with Jamie's vote but didn't vote him yourself. My argument doesn't depend on all of you actually voting him, just that you were all interested, none of you had compelling reasons, and the push materialized largely out of the blue. That all suggests town wagon.

And while this is a bit circular for my liking, it doesn't help me personally that I already suspected literally everyone who voted emc at any point on day 1 except snowy (townread) and worcej (null, could easily be mafia, just don't feel as strongly). I think I have independent reasons to be concerned about the emc push and to think it suggests he's town, but for full disclosure I am somewhat reading him off association.

So I agree that Jamie's vote was weird (hence my calling it out as noteworthy and not joining him), but not Chaqa's, and it feels like a stretch to conclude he's town just because you have some suspicion of the people who voted for him.

What I keep noticing from you is an astonishingly poor ability to think about how scum would think:
We know town mostly picked roses? Scum must be all the people who told us they didn't!
My view of the game is that potentially scum brainbomb and two townies were up for the kill? Scum must have concocted a fourth wagon with shoddy reasoning rather than jumping on either of the town counters!

Does this actually feel like a bona fide effort to look for hiding scum?

[brainbomb]

@Johnny

if you were scum would your team take a rose and use factional kill on one of your own?

[brainbomb]

pretty sure snowy is mafia with damo.
just need to find amigo #3

[ghug]

pretty sure snowy is mafia with damo.
just need to find amigo #3

You think someone shot at snowy and the real mafia target hasn't claimed?

[snowy801]

We know town mostly picked roses? Scum must be all the people who told us they didn't!

Oh, well, the bot was down.

[brainbomb]

I think scum expected more town to take guns so they had 1 scum member take a rose just in case. and it was snowy. and they used factional kill on him to false clear him

[brainbomb]

damo needs to die first no matter whatt. snowy will out himself by surviving too long if he is indeed faked. so im not concerned about him. hes definetely scum though

[President Eden]

there is only one time where eden ever mentions damo all game and its n1 where he says he is probably town. there is only one momen where damo ever mentions eden and its day 1 where he says eden is kinda sus.

Eden is kinda sus, I tell no lie

Eden, what made you say you're stupid and unvote? What exactly went through your head there?

There’s too many people who should know better being fucking bad at this game and it’s messing up my ability to read mafia faking vs town lack of info grasping at straws. Brain apparently authentically believes that I townread damo higher than myself when even a five second look at my list compared to the player list in the OP would make it clear I was simply going down the player list and sorting the players into three piles. Wtf am I supposed to do with that? This guy actually thinks I townread damo more than I townread MYSELF.

I’m playing the exact same game I always play every single time and I always get townreads from these guys because I’m obviously fucking town, but somehow this time it’s different. Logically I think that’s supposed to come from town not having all the info, but my gut reaction is getting mad and thinking they’re faking it, so I am having trouble processing what I’m supposed to be doing.

Brain, if you wanted to know why not fucking ask? I thought it was really obvious damo was genuinely pissed off town, since he doesn’t lose his cool like that when he’s mafia. I think y’all get way too far up your asses about people potentially faking things.

Chaqa doesn’t actually think the order of my list is weird, he didn’t pay any attention to it and has no real opinion about it. He’s probably mafia faking. But worcej is completely absent in a very uncharacteristic way and needs to come out and play.

##VOTE worcej

[President Eden]

Also it’s super frustrating that ghug judges my day 1 heuristic starting point votes like they should be day 5 deep dives when (1) he knows better (2) his own analysis is even more superficial (3) my opinions at least change as more info comes in and I start to root things more in behavior while he keeps to his superficial reads

Unclear if mafia or simply out of it but step your game up bro.

[President Eden]

I think scum expected more town to take guns so they had 1 scum member take a rose just in case. and it was snowy. and they used factional kill on him to false clear him

That would be one of the most extreme cases of fancy play syndrome I've ever seen in mafia. Way more likely that a town with a gun shot him and didn't claim the shot

[ghug]

Also it’s super frustrating that ghug judges my day 1 heuristic starting point votes like they should be day 5 deep dives when (1) he knows better (2) his own analysis is even more superficial (3) my opinions at least change as more info comes in and I start to root things more in behavior while he keeps to his superficial reads

Unclear if mafia or simply out of it but step your game up bro.

I'm not claiming things aren't deep dives. I'm claiming the logic you're putting out doesn't hold up to the tiniest bit of scrutiny.

The worcej vote might be the most sensible thing you've done all game.

[snowy801]

So I suppose we live now in a world where Eden thinks Chaqa at least was scum, used his scumgun / nk to shoot at Jamiet who in this world I imagine is loosely affiliated with being scum with rose, though Chaqa could've just been shooting town, and I'm... town who got shot by... scumgun / vig?

Versus brainbomb thinks I'm scum with rose who used factional nk on myself (scumgun excluded as he himself excluded it), and so must believe that Chaqa and Jamiet are equally town.

I genuinely think brainbomb's scenario is more likely than Eden's, frankly.

Let us suppose this mythical and wholly unrealistic scenario that all three of us are town and speak the truth, however. Why was I shot? It is difficult for me to discern between the "they hated me for speaking the truth" versus the more probable reason that they were just shooting someone who posted a lot and wasn't scum read too often. I especially weigh the fact that I was especially confused at EoD and didn't have a clear target that would make scum say "he knows too much, get him" so cannot really imagine a reason for someone thinking I'm a threat except possibly my constant calls to axe e.m.c., which may be confirmation bias, and invite opinions on this matter.

[President Eden]

Also it’s super frustrating that ghug judges my day 1 heuristic starting point votes like they should be day 5 deep dives when (1) he knows better (2) his own analysis is even more superficial (3) my opinions at least change as more info comes in and I start to root things more in behavior while he keeps to his superficial reads

Unclear if mafia or simply out of it but step your game up bro.

I'm not claiming things aren't deep dives. I'm claiming the logic you're putting out doesn't hold up to the tiniest bit of scrutiny.

The worcej vote might be the most sensible thing you've done all game.

Sure it does. I never claimed any degree of certainty on anything mechanics-based, just that starting with people who claimed guns was a smart starting point since there could be at most 2 town with guns and since mafia are incentivized to take guns. That is a heuristic, which was employed in the first couple of hours of day 1, and which triggered enough of a reaction out of brainbomb that I thought he was actually mafia from behavior (acting like caught mafia begging to be allowed to play the game).

I thought and still think it's extremely bizarre that you and Chaqa are townreading each other. Y'all are always at each other's throats in these games and neither of you have acted obviously town in a way that I thought should have abated that tendency. I thought it even more bizarre neither of you shot the other. Turns out you apparently didn't have a gun, so that explains half of it, but it's still bizarre that Chaqa was out to shoot someone with a rose to clear them, that you claimed rose near EON, and he didn't shoot you.