M61 - The Mastermind's Revenge - Game Thread - HIDDEN

[ghug]

I get that you didn't want to vote HR. What I don't understand is why you didn't vote Maniac when he was the clear counter wagon.

Because we had an hour left and I wanted to try to make a bona fide scumread a wagon first, and then that worked.

[kgray]

Does it help to know I was very stoned?

No.

We can rule out tone, then.

Is it because I pontificated on my meta when I was scum last game?

No, it's because last game you did a great job hiding and getting townreads, and I think any decently wary townie would be suspicious of you doing the same thing here. So why wouldn't scum!ghug lean into this "scummy" persona in this game?

[ghug]

Did you read my response to kgray doing the same thing, Jamie?

I'm not saying I wanted Maniac dead. I'm saying I established opinions, specifically the one on HR, that would have made voting HR over him very suspicious.

Wait what? You didn't want to vote for HR because that would make you look suspicious?

No, I said things that would have made voting HR over Maniac very suspicious, which means I was de facto establishing that I would vote Maniac over HR if it came down to it.

[kgray]

I get that you didn't want to vote HR. What I don't understand is why you didn't vote Maniac when he was the clear counter wagon.

Because we had an hour left and I wanted to try to make a bona fide scumread a wagon first, and then that worked.

And when there were 10 minutes til EOD, you left my wagon to join darg's when HR and Maniac were still tied for the lead.

[ghug]

No.

We can rule out tone, then.

Is it because I pontificated on my meta when I was scum last game?

No, it's because last game you did a great job hiding and getting townreads, and I think any decently wary townie would be suspicious of you doing the same thing here. So why wouldn't scum!ghug lean into this "scummy" persona in this game?

Hmm, I buy that explanation, but you still haven't established why my persona is scummy.

[ghug]

I get that you didn't want to vote HR. What I don't understand is why you didn't vote Maniac when he was the clear counter wagon.

Because we had an hour left and I wanted to try to make a bona fide scumread a wagon first, and then that worked.

And when there were 10 minutes til EOD, you left my wagon to join darg's when HR and Maniac were still tied for the lead.

Oh, guess it was that late.

Doesn't change the motivation.

[kgray]

We can rule out tone, then.

Is it because I pontificated on my meta when I was scum last game?

No, it's because last game you did a great job hiding and getting townreads, and I think any decently wary townie would be suspicious of you doing the same thing here. So why wouldn't scum!ghug lean into this "scummy" persona in this game?

Hmm, I buy that explanation, but you still haven't established why my persona is scummy.

Well this whole "I would have voted for Maniac to save HR" argument when you not only never implied that was the case but actively avoided doing that when it could have saved HR is pretty damn scummy.

[kgray]

Did you read my response to kgray doing the same thing, Jamie?

I'm not saying I wanted Maniac dead. I'm saying I established opinions, specifically the one on HR, that would have made voting HR over him very suspicious.

Wait what? You didn't want to vote for HR because that would make you look suspicious?

No, I said things that would have made voting HR over Maniac very suspicious, which means I was de facto establishing that I would vote Maniac over HR if it came down to it.

But you didn't. You didn't vote Maniac over HR when it came down to it.

[rdrivera2005]

So, a bunch of brilliant town with probably some scum on it decided to kill HR because he was playing weirdly. Great.

I am pretty sure we can find some scum on HR wagon, maybe more then one. I will not vote tomorrow outside people on this wagon. And I am pretty sure I will be alive tomorrow before someone ask.

I guess damo will get another pass?

You gave Damo a pass.

[kgray]

Because we had an hour left and I wanted to try to make a bona fide scumread a wagon first, and then that worked.

And when there were 10 minutes til EOD, you left my wagon to join darg's when HR and Maniac were still tied for the lead.

Oh, guess it was that late.

Doesn't change the motivation.

It certainly changes my opinion of how much you actually wanted to save HR.

[kgray]

So, a bunch of brilliant town with probably some scum on it decided to kill HR because he was playing weirdly. Great.

I am pretty sure we can find some scum on HR wagon, maybe more then one. I will not vote tomorrow outside people on this wagon. And I am pretty sure I will be alive tomorrow before someone ask.

I guess damo will get another pass?

You gave Damo a pass.

I know, and you said you didn't think we should, which is why I'm questioning it.

[rdrivera2005]

Wait what? You didn't want to vote for HR because that would make you look suspicious?

No, I said things that would have made voting HR over Maniac very suspicious, which means I was de facto establishing that I would vote Maniac over HR if it came down to it.

But you didn't. You didn't vote Maniac over HR when it came down to it.

How do you feel about a scumteam with Vecna and Ghug?

[ghug]

Wait what? You didn't want to vote for HR because that would make you look suspicious?

No, I said things that would have made voting HR over Maniac very suspicious, which means I was de facto establishing that I would vote Maniac over HR if it came down to it.

But you didn't. You didn't vote Maniac over HR when it came down to it.

It didn't come down to it. I was on a wagon that was tied with HR and ahead of Maniac, and then a bunch of people voted HR.

If you hadn't moved to darg, I could have put Maniac ahead, but you did.

[bo_sox48]

Why were you considering Maniac with 1 minute to go when the vote had already been decided and you were on the leading wagon?

Considering it doesn't mean acting on it; there is also the issue of my writing, actually posting, and the time delay between all of that and the bot. I was surprised when I saw the vote grow quickly from 4 to 7 (I think that's what it was).

Why would you consider something if you aren't willing to act on it?

Were you not considering Maniac prior to 1 minute to go? The delay is irrelevant when you had 48 hours to make up your mind.

[kgray]

No, I said things that would have made voting HR over Maniac very suspicious, which means I was de facto establishing that I would vote Maniac over HR if it came down to it.

But you didn't. You didn't vote Maniac over HR when it came down to it.

How do you feel about a scumteam with Vecna and Ghug?

I am currently leaning towards a scumteam with ghug and Maniac.

I didn't like/understand Vecna's HR vote but I'm not seeing too much else that's suspicious from him and I don't have a strong read on him at all. I haven't looked into whether he'd make sense with ghug.

[rdrivera2005]

I guess damo will get another pass?

You gave Damo a pass.

I know, and you said you didn't think we should, which is why I'm questioning it.

I don't understand how a towny with half a brain push the lynch of HR based on such a weak case. So, I think there are a greater chance to get scum on the HR wagon. I don't see a single solid townread on that wagon. HB was one but it melted after yesterday

[kgray]

No, I said things that would have made voting HR over Maniac very suspicious, which means I was de facto establishing that I would vote Maniac over HR if it came down to it.

But you didn't. You didn't vote Maniac over HR when it came down to it.

It didn't come down to it. I was on a wagon that was tied with HR and ahead of Maniac, and then a bunch of people voted HR.

If you hadn't moved to darg, I could have put Maniac ahead, but you did.

You never once implied you would do that. You appeared to be actively avoiding/discrediting the Maniac wagon. I moved to darg because I thought he might get more traction than Maniac but obviously I wouldn't have done that if it seemed like you would join me on Maniac.

[kgray]

You gave Damo a pass.

I know, and you said you didn't think we should, which is why I'm questioning it.

I don't understand how a towny with half a brain push the lynch of HR based on such a weak case. So, I think there are a greater chance to get scum on the HR wagon. I don't see a single solid townread on that wagon. HB was one but it melted after yesterday

I mostly agree with this, except that I still townread Hamilton and I'm starting to feel a lot better about Jamie.

[ghug]

But you didn't. You didn't vote Maniac over HR when it came down to it.

It didn't come down to it. I was on a wagon that was tied with HR and ahead of Maniac, and then a bunch of people voted HR.

If you hadn't moved to darg, I could have put Maniac ahead, but you did.

You never once implied you would do that. You appeared to be actively avoiding/discrediting the Maniac wagon. I moved to darg because I thought he might get more traction than Maniac but obviously I wouldn't have done that if it seemed like you would join me on Maniac.

Again I'm not saying "I gladly would have killed Maniac". I wanted darg dead. If you had thought about what I could be expected to do in the final minutes between HR and Maniac, though, it should have been obvious which I would have chosen.

Why would I, as Maniac's teammate trying to save him, adamantly argue against his most viable counterwagon?

[Jamiet99uk]

Did you read my response to kgray doing the same thing, Jamie?

I'm not saying I wanted Maniac dead. I'm saying I established opinions, specifically the one on HR, that would have made voting HR over him very suspicious.

Yes I can see your desperate back-pedalling. You initially said you made it clear that you'd vote for Maniac if needed. It's very, very clear you absolutely never said any such thing. You lied.