M61 - The Mastermind's Revenge - Game Thread - HIDDEN

[Hellenic Riot]

Well, first of all, it can be used to confirm a claim later if the FV is on the block, because they can say who they gave fruit to, and those people can confirm they they got a fruit.

Jamie's exactly right here.

That said, FV should only visit once. More than that, and it's likely to confuse the trackers.

fwiw, I hardclaim that I am NOT the FV. If I ever claim as much, eliminate me.

The only reason I'm talking about the FV this much at all is for the sake of PoE with the low-cost roles. Sad to say it, but it might take another death and role-reveal to get more information.

I don't see why the Fruit Vendor would ever use their ability as town.

Being tracked to someone that isn't the kill is a pretty good thing, particularly if there's only one scum left.

[ghug]

Well, first of all, it can be used to confirm a claim later if the FV is on the block, because they can say who they gave fruit to, and those people can confirm they they got a fruit.

Jamie's exactly right here.

That said, FV should only visit once. More than that, and it's likely to confuse the trackers.

fwiw, I hardclaim that I am NOT the FV. If I ever claim as much, eliminate me.

The only reason I'm talking about the FV this much at all is for the sake of PoE with the low-cost roles. Sad to say it, but it might take another death and role-reveal to get more information.

I don't see why the Fruit Vendor would ever use their ability as town.

Chaqa making the opposing argument is just about the best thing for my case.

[kgray]

Ghug, you and I seem to be syncing up this game -

I'm feeling really good about Bo right now, even though he's the worst, I strongly think he's town for once. Would you agree?

Wow does this seem fake. Not sure how you could possibly think you're synching up with ghug and yet strongly think bo is town.

[Chaqa]

Jamie's exactly right here.

That said, FV should only visit once. More than that, and it's likely to confuse the trackers.

fwiw, I hardclaim that I am NOT the FV. If I ever claim as much, eliminate me.

The only reason I'm talking about the FV this much at all is for the sake of PoE with the low-cost roles. Sad to say it, but it might take another death and role-reveal to get more information.

I don't see why the Fruit Vendor would ever use their ability as town.

Chaqa making the opposing argument is just about the best thing for my case.

Hey, if town had listened to me last game and had the Road runner claim, we probably wouldn't have lost so bad. my ideas arent ALWAYS crazy.

TBH I'd probably be throwing all the Fruit at Jamie just to annoy him.

[Chaqa]

Ghug, you and I seem to be syncing up this game -

I'm feeling really good about Bo right now, even though he's the worst, I strongly think he's town for once. Would you agree?

Wow does this seem fake. Not sure how you could possibly think you're synching up with ghug and yet strongly think bo is town.

At the time, I didn't know ghug was anti-bo.

I'm doing a Flavius catchup

[Chaqa]

Whew! No more to read.

ALl the people I wanted to talk to have left, though :/

[teacon7]

You think it's likely the Public Vanilla is scum?

Considering it's a 0-cost role, I could see it being one they would choose if they recruited.

They don't get to pick the role for the recruit.

[ghug]

You think it's likely the Public Vanilla is scum?

Considering it's a 0-cost role, I could see it being one they would choose if they recruited.

They don't get to pick the role for the recruit.

He's saying they picked cheap roles if they recruited.

(I needed a new spokesperson job since bozo died)

[kgray]

Are you talking about me? I didn't say he didn't post EoN reads, and I didn't see where anybody else said that either.

Teacon said it.

Very paranoid response there, Kgray, assuming people are talking about you when they're not even talking about you, and gave no indication they were talking about you.

teacon said people should post EoN readlists.

I said teacon hasn't posted many reads despite advocating for people posting EoN readlists.

Soon after, Hamilton said someone else said that although teacon suggested people post EoN reads, he did not post EoN reads.

So I wondered if Hamilton thought I was the someone else.

Did you see anybody comment that teacon hadn't posted EoN reads, like Hamilton said he saw?

[Chaqa]

You think it's likely the Public Vanilla is scum?

Considering it's a 0-cost role, I could see it being one they would choose if they recruited.

They don't get to pick the role for the recruit.

You misunderstand.

If the mafia recruited, then their roles would by necessity be cheaper, so I could see a 0 coster or the FV for its +1 being something they choose to let them get one or two medium power roles.

[Jamiet99uk]

Teacon said it.

Very paranoid response there, Kgray, assuming people are talking about you when they're not even talking about you, and gave no indication they were talking about you.

teacon said people should post EoN readlists.

I said teacon hasn't posted many reads despite advocating for people posting EoN readlists.

Soon after, Hamilton said someone else said that although teacon suggested people post EoN reads, he did not post EoN reads.

So I wondered if Hamilton thought I was the someone else.

Did you see anybody comment that teacon hadn't posted EoN reads, like Hamilton said he saw?

Oh, I see, sorry. You're right.

[Chaqa]

For now I'm going to ##Vote teacon7

Would also currently vote kgray or rivera.

[teacon7]

My general feeling about the "what would scum have done" discussions is that it's not helpful until we see scum flip, and even then it's a bunch of wifom. I don't find talking about it to be scummy on its own, but I do think that it's an easy way for scum to appear active without giving reads, which I don't like.

I can agree with that outlook. When you say, "give reads," what do you mean? A list at the end of a phase, or something else? Go skim your play so far in the bot... Would your game so far fit the criteria you're asking for here?

HR has hardly given enough content for me to get a read on him. In my experience he is normally not very active early in games, although I'm not sure I've seen him be this absent. I would prefer he talk more about reads and less about strategies/mechs also, but he's not preaching about how town should be posting with substance so I'm not as bothered by it.

Is it alignment-indicative that he plays differently than you would?

The bulk of Maniac's posts which talk about mechanical issues are him saying that Rivera should be daykilled because of his role, which I don't agree with and I do think is pretty scummy, but he isn't pushing for Rivera's daykill. And he has given other reads and contributed non-mechanics thoughts.

I don't think Maniac is saying that rdriv should be daykilled due to his role. It sounded more like he running with the "rdr needs to be DK'd if he's alive past d3, because it means he hasn't been NK'd." Ask him if you've characterized his argument fairly.

My concern about you isn't that you're talking about general strategies or mechanical issues, it's posts where you say things like town should post reads so they can be held accountable, but then you don't seem to be posting a lot of your own reads even though you're clearly being active and talking about other things. It's the two things together that rub me the wrong way.

That's an impressively long sentence.

It sounds a bit like you're finding it alignment-indicative that people approach the game differently than you.

I tend to commit to reads at ends of phases. Like I did on pg 70. Posting those during phases is iffy because things change as people talk. Unless you want me to one-word comment reply to quoteboxes? Because town players are capable of being bad at their role, rooting out hypocrisy or bad attitudes doesn't reliably mean finding out their alignment, not anymore than only talking about mechanics or strategy. For my part, I think that focusing too much on people's attitude or tone tends to be unproductive. We're all very different. Some people think that "scumhunting" is pushing people and being rude. Others do it by getting reactions, or reading the thread but not commenting. Is that AI?

[Chaqa]

For now I'm going to ##Vote teacon7

Would also currently vote kgray or rivera.

Actually, probably not rivera. Even if he's scum, a vanilla isn't super threatening. If I think rivera-Maniac team is a possiiblity, I'd vote Maniac over rivera I think.

[Chaqa]

For now I'm going to ##Vote teacon7

Would also currently vote kgray or rivera.

Actually, probably not rivera. Even if he's scum, a vanilla isn't super threatening. If I think rivera-Maniac team is a possiiblity, I'd vote Maniac over rivera I think.

Hmm... although on the flipside, if I'm wrong, losing a Vanilla is probably less bad...

So maybe Rivera first after all

[teacon7]

If the mafia recruited, then their roles would by necessity be cheaper, so I could see a 0 coster or the FV for its +1 being something they choose to let them get one or two medium power roles.

Oh, yeah, I agree with that. I just meant that the couldn't assign it to the recruit.

[Jamiet99uk]

If I think rivera-Maniac team is a possiiblity, I'd vote Maniac over rivera I think.

Well do you think that, or not?

Saying "if" you think something is a bit weird. Openly speculating about what you, yourself, might be thinking.....?

[Chaqa]

If I think rivera-Maniac team is a possiiblity, I'd vote Maniac over rivera I think.

Well do you think that, or not?

Saying "if" you think something is a bit weird. Openly speculating about what you, yourself, might be thinking.....?

Do you never weigh both possibilities against each other?

Also I'm super high. It's Friday baby

[Jamiet99uk]

If I think rivera-Maniac team is a possiiblity, I'd vote Maniac over rivera I think.

Well do you think that, or not?

Saying "if" you think something is a bit weird. Openly speculating about what you, yourself, might be thinking.....?

Do you never weigh both possibilities against each other?

Also I'm super high. It's Friday baby

I like to do some thinking inside my head before I say things.

Are you incapable of thinking about things without typing? What a strange syndrome, does it have a name?

[Jamiet99uk]

I have this mental image of Chaqa sitting helpless in a high-backed armchair, his head lolling to one side, saliva dripping from one corner of his open mouth, until suddenly he is presented with a laptop and his mind springs into action, rendering him capable of thoughts, actions, ideas.... and apparently recreational drug abuse. Or perhaps that's what caused the condition in the first place, who knows. Medical science is baffled.