Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

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kestasjk
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#81 Post by kestasjk » Sun Oct 16, 2022 6:10 am

Enjoying the back forth by the way, always fun to test your ideas even though right now I feel a bit under siege

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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#82 Post by Octavious » Sun Oct 16, 2022 12:00 pm

Well, you would do :razz:.

The changes made to the forum back when we moved away from the old style created an environment fundamentally hostile to any view that deviates from the mainstream, where the mainstream is broadly defined by US liberal media. As this has been in place for some time now the result is a forum far less diverse in opinion. Back in the day there would have been plenty of voices backing you up as well as plenty being critical, and a far more balanced back and forth. But the fact that this is no longer the case is ever so slightly your fault, so you can't complain too much ;)
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#83 Post by JECE » Sun Oct 16, 2022 12:50 pm

Utter rubbish

There has always been diversity of thought in the Forum. The only difference now is that the Forum is quieter.

Maybe you just miss the likes of extremists like krellin, Draugnar or Conservative Man poisoning the Forum with their blather?
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#84 Post by Xerxes Worldweaver » Sun Oct 16, 2022 1:20 pm

If the debate is still going on, could someone summarize it for me? (Or indeed, perhaps you'd like to summarize it for your own sakes, if what we are pursuing here is mutual understanding.)
"I never discuss anything but politics and religion. There is nothing else to discuss." ~ G. K. Chesterton

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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#85 Post by Octavious » Sun Oct 16, 2022 1:22 pm

D who must not be named was never particularly extreme in his views. He left because he was having a very difficult time at home and vented his frustrations in a foolish attack on the site's leadership. Krellin had his own issues for which the forum and its debates were a kind of escape. Al Swearengen conducted the entirety of his forum engagements in character as a 19th century wild west pimp, and did so quite brilliantly. Conservative Man just seemed to be a bit of an idiot, but I can't say I knew much about him. Only one or two, arguably Mapleleaf, seemed genuinely nasty.

But do I miss those days when the forum was interesting and worth turning up too? God, yes. It was infinitely more entertaining and diverse than the perpetual game of 20 questions and counting of years that makes up the forum now.
JECE wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 12:50 pm
There has always been diversity of thought in the Forum. The only difference now is that the Forum is quieter.
Oh? Do you think that the views expressed on the forum reflect the views of the American people, which make up the largest chunk of membership? Do you think the views reflect the typical views of the populations of the wider global community from which we have members? Not at all. What webDip reflects more than anything else is CNN, with a handful of invited guests to give the illusion that a mix of views is represented.
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#86 Post by Doom427 » Sun Oct 16, 2022 1:36 pm

Xerxes Worldweaver wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 1:20 pm
If the debate is still going on, could someone summarize it for me? (Or indeed, perhaps you'd like to summarize it for your own sakes, if what we are pursuing here is mutual understanding.)
Confirmed - female superhero movies are unpopular because they suck.

From there we jumped to the most obvious and important connected topic-
Confirmed-Doom427 is a misandrist?

And of course, the question that must be answered if we wish to know why female superhero movies are unpopular-
Confirmed- why mermaid black? I'm not racist, but she shouldn't be black.

(Doing a quick scan of the forum shows me a lot of support for the pro-position here, at least as far as the upvotes from the judges go. I thought the point of this discussion was to increase the users karma nstead of mutual understanding. I suppose in either case I have not accomplished either)

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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#87 Post by Doom427 » Sun Oct 16, 2022 1:39 pm

:zultar: Oh nevermind, I got five upvotes once. :zultar:

I won the debate!
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#88 Post by captainmeme » Sun Oct 16, 2022 3:18 pm

"vented his frustrations in a foolish attack on the site's leadership" is a curious way to say 'threatened to DDoS us' lol

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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#89 Post by captainmeme » Sun Oct 16, 2022 4:06 pm

I suppose it's not wrong though.

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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#90 Post by flash2015 » Sun Oct 16, 2022 5:21 pm

Octavious wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 1:22 pm
Oh? Do you think that the views expressed on the forum reflect the views of the American people, which make up the largest chunk of membership? Do you think the views reflect the typical views of the populations of the wider global community from which we have members? Not at all. What webDip reflects more than anything else is CNN, with a handful of invited guests to give the illusion that a mix of views is represented.
This is a weird comment. CNN's ratings are terrible and are getting worse:

https://nypost.com/2022/09/07/cnn-ratin ... s-network/

It is hard to claim people here are parroting CNN when likely few if any people here ever watch it.

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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#91 Post by Octavious » Sun Oct 16, 2022 7:33 pm

I'm not claiming they're parroting CNN :?
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#92 Post by Xerxes Worldweaver » Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:26 pm

Octavious wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 1:22 pm
Oh? Do you think that the views expressed on the forum reflect the views of the American people, which make up the largest chunk of membership? Do you think the views reflect the typical views of the populations of the wider global community from which we have members? Not at all. What webDip reflects more than anything else is CNN, with a handful of invited guests to give the illusion that a mix of views is represented.
If you want a greater mix of views in this forum, I may be able to be of some assistance... provided that I don't get myself banned for my extreme (though hopefully civil) political incorrectness. Perhaps I'll demonstrate what I mean by that in giving my own three cents in answer to the original topic of this discussion.



(Reading back through this giant post, I feel as though I bit off more than I could chew. Kindly let me know where my opinions could be improved.)

Before I begin, I feel obliged to inform my audience, such as it is, that I rarely watch movies at all, let alone superhero movies, let alone female superhero movies. That being said I am somewhat familiar with the nature of the stories that underpin them - and it is the stories of the movies which inspire so much hatred. I mean, you can dislike a movie because it's a visual disaster, but to give credit where credit is due, have Marvel or Disney or any other big movie company made a movie in recent memory that's a literal eyesore? Not as far as I'm aware. I hear more often that the actors are terrible or that the script is terrible or, such as with the new Little Mermaid, that the producers are pushing diversity solely for diversity's sake. All three of those faults are, in their own way, the faults of story.

And what makes a story a bad story? I say that there are only two faults that a story can have - it can be boring, and it can be filled with lies. The latter offence is far worse than the first, but female superhero movies are guilty of both. Aye. But allow me to attempt to give this accusation some depth.

Proving that female superhero movies (hereafter referred to as FSMs) are boring is difficult for me since I haven't watched any and consequently cannot be concrete, but here is the synopsis for an imaginary FSM which I hope isn't too much of a strawman:
Fictitious movie reviewer wrote:Mary Heroine was always bullied in school by straight white men and oppressed by her totalitarian government. Then she got struck by lightning and gained superpowers! Joining the Resistance, an organization headed by a sage old woman who cusses a lot, Mary soon becomes an important figure for her insanely adept use of her powers. Everyone begins doing everything that Mary Heroine says they should do, or if they don't, really bad stuff happens because of it. Mary Heroine is never wrong about anything. Eventually she comes face to face with the villain, another straight white man who has trained for 10,000 years and mastered every type of combat. He says something like 'A woman's place is in the kitchen, go make me a sandwich, Mary,' and Mary shouts in response 'I'll make you a sandwich, alright!' and suffocates him to death with two slices of bread, thus proving the superiority of women over the patriarchy. She then falls in love with a hot [insert diverse race of your choice here] guy, sleeps with him but doesn't marry him, becomes the queen of the universe, and lives happily ever after.

Mary Heroine is never presented with an obstacle which she can't overcome by blasting it harder with her superpower juice, Mary Heroine is never seriously forced to question the morality of her actions, Mary Heroine never treats anyone with any respect at all (especially not her lover), Mary Heroine never has to actually sacrifice anything of her own for the greater good, Mary Heroine never gets beaten by a man that she doesn't get back at in the end.
Hopefully you'll agree with me that this story which I've summarized is rather boring. If you're not quite convinced, imagine that it took me an hour and a half to tell it to you, and perhaps you will be. This generic FSM is good at conveying one thing and one thing only, and that is feminism.

The story which feminism tells - well, I think it's a blatant lie, but I haven't gotten to that part of the argument yet - but I think it's also the epitome of boring. Feminism tells you (if you're a woman) that you're perfect just as you are, that your only flaw is that you don't believe in yourself hard enough. This comes through clearly in every feminist movie, I should think, and it leads to zero character development (since you can't improve on perfect). Every heroine has to be without flaw, and her only weakness is her lack of complete power at the beginning of the movie. The most notorious, and dare I say defining aspect of FSMs is the ability for the heroine to kick the butts of fully grown, fully armed, and fully armoured men, generally three or four times her size. This always has to happen. Women can't lose a fight, because that would be demeaning...

Et cetera.

Few men in the modern world can bear to admit that they hold erroneous opinions. Acknowledging one's failings is a mark of maturity. Feminists rarely possess such maturity, and the movies they make reflect their lack of maturity. That lack of maturity is what makes their movies boring. They don't want to grow up, because to grow up means that they were somehow imperfect, and their imperfections cannot be admitted. Better to live in a world of lies than to admit the truth.

A world of lies... that's what feminism is. A complete refutation of it and a proper defence of the patriarchy is beyond the scope of this post (though it shall be given if requested), but suffice it to say that it is a complete and utter lie that women as a whole were meant to be anything other than wives and mothers. Women were not meant to be soldiers - they are those whom soldiers fight to protect. Their lives are too valuable to be wasted on the battlefield. When we are shown in FSMs that a woman can beat the crap out of a man, we know it's a lie. Whenever a woman orders a man about, we know something's off.

FSMs try to empower women by making them into, basically, better men. This does not reflect real life, and the subconscious of the masses knows this. Hence the low popularity of such movies.



TL;DR: Female superhero movies are feminist. Feminism refuses to acknowledge that women are imperfect and consequently cannot develop their characters. Feminism is also a big fat lie and to some degree every non-feminist knows it and is repelled by it.



I spent quite a lot of time on this small essay, trying to be convincing, but towards the end I said 'screw it' and let fly my political incorrectness. I doubt anyone has agreed with everything I've said - hopefully I don't get banned from the forum and can reply to the reply which you're probably already typing. I enjoy a good debate; I welcome your disagreement with open arms.
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#93 Post by JECE » Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:35 pm

Octavious wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 7:33 pm
I'm not claiming they're parroting CNN :?
Of course, chap. Everything that you claim you never actually claim.

Except, of course, when you claim that you're a conservative.

So please go on enjoying your prime minister. I hear she's doing splendidly, as were her predecessors. Verily the pride of Anglo-Saxons everywhere!
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#94 Post by captainmeme » Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:41 pm

I am going to go ahead and move this to the politics forum just because of the direction it's gone in.
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#95 Post by JECE » Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:48 pm

Xerxes Worldweaver: I think that that's enough 'polite' trolling. Please don't post "a proper defence of the patriarchy".
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#96 Post by JECE » Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:54 pm

Octavious wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 1:22 pm
D who must not be named was never particularly extreme in his views.
True, he was not particularly extreme compared to the other two. But some of his posts, like his massive post detailing how he would use his Marines training to murder a fellow Forum user, you have to admit were somewhat extreme.
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#97 Post by Fluminator » Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:58 pm

Xerxes Worldweaver wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:26 pm
I hear more often that the actors are terrible or that the script is terrible or, such as with the new Little Mermaid, that the producers are pushing diversity solely for diversity's sake. All three of those faults are, in their own way, the faults of story.
There's so much to comment on here and on so many other posts here, but I just have to quickly ask, why is diversity for diversity's sake a bad thing?
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#98 Post by Fluminator » Sun Oct 16, 2022 10:38 pm

Kestas, just try to take a step back bro. I love playing devil's advocate (to the point half the forum thinks I'm a far-right troll) but this is not it.

Even if everything you said about Disney doing this as some Machiavellian plot to generate controversy to make more money or publicly is true, what does that really change? It shouldn't be controversial in the first place?
JECE and Meme kind of already said all the main points very succinctly.

I think in a few years, you might look back on this and be embarrassed how you bent over backwards trying to justify the backlash against a black mermaid.
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#99 Post by Doom427 » Sun Oct 16, 2022 10:44 pm

Xerxes Worldweaver wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:26 pm

A world of lies... that's what feminism is. A complete refutation of it and a proper defence of the patriarchy is beyond the scope of this post (though it shall be given if requested), but suffice it to say that it is a complete and utter lie that women as a whole were meant to be anything other than wives and mothers. Women were not meant to be soldiers - they are those whom soldiers fight to protect. Their lives are too valuable to be wasted on the battlefield. When we are shown in FSMs that a woman can beat the crap out of a man, we know it's a lie. Whenever a woman orders a man about, we know something's off.
There's something rather refreshing about seeing a reactionary remove the pretense and speak honestly about their ACTUAL thoughts. But I do have to wonder why they always pretend their beliefs are simultaneously something everyone believes and also are extreme unknown thoughts.

When you cut out the bullshit quite a few people do believe a woman's place is the home, only they also know (unlike the hardliners) that the only way you're gonna keep us there is with violent force. There's always gonna be some ladies who balk at being breeding sows. And some of them might even introduce lesbianism to the other wives and then your wonderful patriarchy might start to have a real problem on it's hands.

Ah lesbianism. What a wonderful term. Working off that concept, I have a thought experiment. Now, Mr. Worldweaver- what if the story was only about women? Just women beating the crap out of other women and ordering them around and other items that sound like a pornographic title. Would that be ok? Or would that it be bothersome too, because it doesn't portray women as The Most objectified type as required by patriarchy.

To be honest, a defense of the patriarchy does sound rather amusing - how does one claim to defend one of the largest all-encompising ideologies of all time? I'd find a defense of God less presumptuous - at least God has a question of existence. When it comes to patriarchy the only ones who deny it's strength are the very people trying to prove it's natural realness. If I have to be convinced the patriarchy is the natural configuration, does that not prove it's very unnaturalness?
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Re: Are female superhero movies unpopular because…

#100 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Oct 16, 2022 10:53 pm

Xerxes Worldweaver wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:26 pm

Few men in the modern world can bear to admit that they hold erroneous opinions. Acknowledging one's failings is a mark of maturity. Feminists rarely possess such maturity, and the movies they make reflect their lack of maturity. That lack of maturity is what makes their movies boring. They don't want to grow up, because to grow up means that they were somehow imperfect, and their imperfections cannot be admitted. Better to live in a world of lies than to admit the truth.
This paragraph is very confusing. You start by saying that very few men can admit that they are wrong, and then you immediately leap into an attack on "feminists". How do these two elements relate to each other? Are you assuming that most feminists are men? If not, are you accepting that most men make the same mistake that you are attributing to "feminists"? You're very bad at explaining yourself.
Xerxes Worldweaver wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:26 pm
A world of lies... that's what feminism is. A complete refutation of it and a proper defence of the patriarchy is beyond the scope of this post (though it shall be given if requested), but suffice it to say that it is a complete and utter lie that women as a whole were meant to be anything other than wives and mothers.
Oh my goodness. You've been masturbating to a lot of Jordan Peterson content, haven't you, you horrible little incenl shit?
Xerxes Worldweaver wrote:
Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:26 pm
TL;DR: I am a frustrated little man who has never touched a woman. Daddy Peterson has told me it's ok to hate them.
Go.
Fuck.
Your.
Self.
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