1v1 practice

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Squigs44
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1v1 practice

#1 Post by Squigs44 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:45 pm

Hello.

I've played a couple 1v1 games but really I'm still pretty awful at them. I'm looking for a player or two or three that would want to play some 1v1s with me as practice.

In search of: Players that have a basic grasp of 1v1 strategy, but are not super smart and are just going to crush me every single time.

Game settings: I would like to play both FvA and GvI, although I know FvA is more popular so probably mostly that. 36 hour phases, but I intend to ready up any time I put moves in so several turns a day could happen if time zones meet up. I don't really care on excused missed turns as long as you are reliable.

If there is a lot of interest in this I could set up some sort of round robin or ladder, but really I just want to play quality games
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Squigs44
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Re: 1v1 practice

#2 Post by Squigs44 » Sat Jun 15, 2019 2:40 am

Also, how many games do people want to play at a time? Just 1, or 1 of each FvA, GvI? Since there really isn't any diplomacy taking place, I figure I could probably play 5 or 6 at a time.

AncientMemories
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Re: 1v1 practice

#3 Post by AncientMemories » Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:48 am

I'd be interested! No promises on the skill front, since I'm also relatively new to 1v1, but I'd like to think I don't usually make glaring blunders, or that I can at least learn from them. I agree I'd be happy to have a meaningful amount of games on at a time. If it ends up being a ladder, maybe two or three games of each plus a potential tie breaker between each contestant? Which could be played concurrently, with whoever is ahead by some metric deciding the match up of the tiebreaker. Or something like that? Just a thought.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#4 Post by CptMike » Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:32 am

You can find here some advices about how to play. and with additionnal links. That's worth a few dozens games of practice.
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Peregrine Falcon
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Re: 1v1 practice

#5 Post by Peregrine Falcon » Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:42 am

I used to be decent at 1v1, but I haven't played in months. I probably still have some grasp of strategy, but also will surely mess things up from rust. If you want, some practice games might help us both?

I probably can't commit to more than 2 games at a time, (and would prefer 1) however.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#6 Post by Squigs44 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:12 am

It looks like there isn't a ton of interest in this, so I will just make a few games tomorrow and send invites according to how many games you said you were interested in at a time
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teccles
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Re: 1v1 practice

#7 Post by teccles » Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:41 am

I'd be interested in some 1v1 games where we discuss the play after the game (or even during). I've been playing a lot of 1v1, but I suspect there are still important strategic principles I don't understand.
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Squigs44
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Re: 1v1 practice

#8 Post by Squigs44 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:12 pm

I just created a few games and sent invites to those that expressed interest here. If anyone else is interested, or any of you want more games than what I sent you, feel free to continue posting here and coordinate games among yourselves.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#9 Post by BananaFang » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:03 pm

I'm willing to play some practice/teaching games. I'm ranked 29 in 1v1 apparently. However, I've mostly played against IRL friends, I haven't played many people ranked above me, and I haven't played nearly the volume of games some others have. So, I don't know where I truly stand. If you are a total newbie then I might crush you but I'll be glad to explain how I'm doing it :).

I think it would be helpful for the newbies if we posted our thoughts here instead of inside the games themselves.

I haven't managed to sneak into a Championship Crown(? - the FvA one) game yet. I'd like to but at the same time I don't want to be obligated to play a bunch of games in a row if I do well. So I'm willing to practice against high rank people without that obligation and/or to teach newbies. PM me for either.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#10 Post by Squigs44 » Mon Jun 17, 2019 9:57 pm

Some of my games have been going rather quickly, so I will post my games and what I learned from them (made two mistakes in a game that I should have won) here later tonight. Feel free to comment on those as well after I post. I also might be free to play a game with you bananafang

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Re: 1v1 practice

#11 Post by Squigs44 » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:48 pm

Here is my first 1v1 game write-up. The goal of these is mostly to give myself a format in which I can take another look at the game and figure out what worked, what didn't, and what I should do differently next time. It is also a way for me to give advice to my opponent, and to let others see what my thought process is so they can learn or correct me where I am wrong.

1v1 Practice GvI 1
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameI ... #gamePanel
Opponent: Ancient Memories
Title: The Tyrolian Chokehold

Spring 1901: I decided to go with the most standard German opening, the Tyrolian opening, and it did its job. Bouncing Tyrolia kept Venice in place, which really set the tone for the rest of the game.

Fall 1901: I am able to use Munich to take Tyrolia, since Italy had to use Venice to secure Trieste to get more than 1 build. My other two units pick up SC's, meaning we are both at 5 a piece.

Winter 1901: I build a fleet in Kiel to try to grab some of the many coastal SCs to my north, and an army in Munich to keep pressure on Italy.

Spring 1902: For the remainder of the game, Tyrolia is the reason that I won this game. I decide to forego Vienna and instead tap Venice. Why? Because having a unit in Venice inhibits Italy's builds. If Italy moves out of Venice and I take it, this causes Italy to get behind on SC count and they are unable to build in Venice. If they remain in Venice, they have a unit stuck there, and they cannot build in Venice. If I can keep a unit in Venice this game while picking up lots of SCs on my end, I will be able to get an additional unit on the board ahead of Italy every year. Munich goes to Bohemia and Warsaw to Galicia to form a cup around Vienna, and Bohemia can offer support to Tyrolia. My fleets continue picking up SC's and moving closer to the Iberian Peninsula.

Fall 1902: My cup like positioning around Vienna means that I can take it this turn. Bohemia and Galicia are sufficient for this, and so Tyrolia can tap Venice once again, meaning Italy cannot build in Venice this year. Holland remains and EC goes to Brest ensuring I get three builds and I take an advantage on units.

Winter 1902: A fleet in Kiel to continue picking up SCs and two armies, one in Munich to moves West, and one in Berlin to move south and help with the growing line of armies.

Spring 1903: Once again Tyrolia taps Venice, causing a bounce there and leaving the Roman army stuck down south. Big win for me there. Vienna and Galicia attempt an attack on Budapest, mostly just to keep pressure on Italy. The moves in that area fail, which is fine by me. I am already deep enough south where my goal is just to hold the line. Silesia moves south to offer assistance. Munich moves to Bur to try to snag Marseilles. I have already established myself well in the East, so if I can win the West then I have this game down. Brest to MAO also sets myself up well on that front. My other two fleets continue to try to snag SCs to generate builds for my rush.

Fall 1903: Italy makes some mistakes here. The first was with Piedmont. Piedmont to Tyrolia really did not do anything for Italy. Piedmont should have bounced me out of Marseilles. MAO and West Med both attack each other, which leaves me secure over there. I did not need the SC in Spain, what I need is security in MAO. My other fleets take an SC each continuing my growth. In hindsight, I should have stayed in Denmark instead of going to Sweden. This would have allowed me to get to Edi the following year, then Lvp. Getting a third fleet towards MAO was more important for me than picking up Sweden or Norway, and the timing of that fleet caused me all sorts of indecision later. My armies in the East contest Trieste causing a bounce, and Galicia and Ukraine are able to fan eastward, stretching out my barrier and making room for more units to come in. Budapest was busy supporting Serbia, and so that movement was safe for me. Rome moving to Venice and blocking his home SC for another year meant that Italy was now several units behind me even though his SC count was pretty close to mine.

Winter 1903:
Three armies built, because why not? I didn't need another fleet, I needed armies in both the east and west.

Spring 1904:
My armies in the East keep the pressure on, but there is little movement, which is exactly what I want. Meanwhile in the west, I know that I am going to lose Marseilles, so I give it up to take Spain. Munich rotates down to Bur in the hopes of regaining Marseilles soon, and I now have units in MAO and EC giving me extra security there. Sweden moves to Norway, and it is at this point I realize my mistake. Taking St Pete would be awful for my timing, so I will need to stay in Norway.

Fall 1904:
In the west I move my army to Portugal. This allowed me to keep Spain open for my fleet in MAO to attack with support from Portugal. In hindsight, I should have just taken Portugal with MAO. Bur taps Marseilles in case he tried to use Marseilles to attack Spain and Pie went to Mar. I keep pressure in the East, and even snag Sev with Ukraine. Notice I still have Tyrolia, and Italy is still trying to move his units to either Venice or Trieste, which causes Italy to get behind on builds.

Winter 1904:
2 armies to solidify my stalemate line in the East. At this point I realize I don't even need Vienna, I just need to capture the SCs to my north and hold what I have down south.

Spring 1905:
At this point I cede Vienna, and pull my troops into a more defensible line. That last thing I need is for Italy to break through, so by pulling back, I give up one SC that I don't need in order to ensure my own security. In the West I take Spain and move some more armies in the area.

Fall 1905:
A bunch of supporting in the East, just holding my line. Now, North Sea moves to Norwegian Sea in a sort of panic. If Ionian had gone to Tunis, then N Africa, he could have contested MAO. I didn't want that, so I tried to put my fleet in a position to help support MAO. It gave up an SC, but at this point I was worried more about security than speed. In order to make sure I took an SC, I took Paris. Prussia to Livonia sets me up nicely to take either Moscow or St Pete the next year.

Builds 1905:
An army in Munich for security.

Spring 1906:
In the East I take Rum. I really didn't want Rum, but it actually worked out well for me, and had no real risk. Everything else is a holding pattern in the east. In the west I move Gascony into position to attack Mar.

Fall 1906:
I originally put in some other orders, but after doing the math, I realize I can win this turn. All I have to do is take St Pete and Moscow in the East (while maintaining my SCs), Lvp up north, and then force Marseilles with Spain, while covering Spain. This left Edi and Denmark as neutral SC's above me, SCs I was planning on taking but later realized I did not need.

Tl;dr:
Getting an army into Tyrolia in Fall 01 did me wonders. It stayed there until the final turn, inspiring fear on Venice and Trieste. It often ensured Italy kept a unit in Venice for the Fall, meaning that Italy could only build 2 units most years. My armies in the East kept pressure on Italy while maintaining a secure line. My fleets picked up SCs while quickly making it to the West. Two armies also thrown to the West allowed me to take all of the SCs there.

What I learned about Germany:
Take Tyrolia and use it well

What I learned about Italy:
I think one thing Italy did not do super well in this game was manage the West. It is vital for Italy to use its fleet dominance to contest the French and Iberian centers before it is too late.
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Percy Williams
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Re: 1v1 practice

#12 Post by Percy Williams » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:55 pm

Please put me into a 1v1. I'm not an absolute idiot, but I've never donate a 1v1 before, so I probably won't dominate.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#13 Post by Squigs44 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 12:06 am

Now that we have more interest I'll try to put together some more matchups so that people get to play multiple people. I can't play you all! Percy how many games do you want to play at a time do you think?

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Re: 1v1 practice

#14 Post by Percy Williams » Tue Jun 18, 2019 12:18 am

Squigs44 wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 12:06 am
Now that we have more interest I'll try to put together some more matchups so that people get to play multiple people. I can't play you all! Percy how many games do you want to play at a time do you think?
Probably two maybe three. Especially if we have 36 hour phases, I have no problem doing three.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#15 Post by Squigs44 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 12:29 am

Percy and teccles, why don't the two of you play each other? You can PM each other and coordinate.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#16 Post by AncientMemories » Tue Jun 18, 2019 4:31 am

I don't think that I'll live up to Squigs' write up, (much in the same way I didn't live up to his play!) but here's my first write up. I'll try to match him for format.

1v1 Practice GvI 1
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameI ... #gamePanel
Opponent: Squigs44
Title: Eastern Over-extension

Spring 01:
After quickly re-reading the primer on how to open on Italy, and trying to find something about what to do after, I told myself I'd just do my best, since the standard opening matched what I was thinking and I wanted to establish a baseline for myself. So I bounce in Tyrolia and set up the convoy to Greece, but I'm already a little unsure what my overarching strategy is. The indecision will hurt me later.

Fall 01:
Predictably, we both follow through with the fall extension of our so far standard openings, and Germany gets into Tyrolia.

Winter 01:
Again, the standard builds for my opening, another army in Naples to convoy into the Balkans and an army Venice. At this point I should have realized how important it was to get him out of there, and have that be my first step of the plan for next year, but, as Squigs already mentioned, I didn't, and that set the tone for the rest of the game.

Spring 02:
I think I expected to bounce him in Vienna here, but instead I wind up over extending. I guessed 'correctly' about leaving Trieste uncovered, but I think it would have been better for me if he took it and left Tyr, which brings us to what I thought he'd do in...

Fall 02:
But he didn't. I was expecting to bounce him again in Budapest or Rum, but this is the turn where the other factor that I think led to me losing this game really becomes apparent: Squigs has back line troops picking up his builds and can pressure me with his armies, but more than that he's taking this slow and steady with containing me instead of getting over extended and turning Austria/the Balkans into a brawl in a rush to contest the centers, which is what I somehow expected him to do. I think here's where if I had taken half a day to sit back and count where he'd be getting his centers from to reach 18, I would have realized he wasn't going to be trying to sneak around and get into the meat of Austria because he didn't need to. He just needed to keep me bottled up.

Winter 02:
The builds this year are where I realized what dire straights I was in , having to sit in Venice and not be able to match him for builds even though I had the centers. I think it flusters me a little, and it shows in how I don't commit enough to the east later and with pie, because I wind up panicking a little about the west.

Spring 03:
This turn is pretty much just setting up for the Fall, and things go about how I expected they would. No big wins or unexpected losses, but climbing out of Rome is a problem just as I anticipated.

Fall 03:
I missed my guess pretty much everywhere except with MAO here, and looking at it, many of them should have been predictable. Not getting him out of Tyr set the tone for the game, but this turn was where I think I made my biggest misplays. I wasn't expecting him to keep pushing east, and I should have at least tapped gal instead of support holding, I thought it'd be Vie moving into Trieste and that I'd cut support with Pie so I could get Serbia there, but it wasn't and in retrospect that should have been clear to me. Pie definitely should have focused west, it wouldn't have been late to really contend there, but instead I let myself get tied up with what was going on in the east and lose the plot.

Winter 03:
Army and a fleet here because I need to get another army into the Balkans and I need another fleet to match the fleets he has. I'm again stuck with one more center than I have build, and I'm kicking myself for not going to Tusc instead of Venice, but I think that would've been too risky. I'm now meaningfully behind on troops though, and he's able to spare a unit to keep picking up neutral builds that I can't match.

Spring 04:
I tried to get clever here with convoying to the Balkans again, but I think it just slowed me down. I should have sent the army to Tuscany and gotten my head in the game with the west, taking mars with Piedmont and setting myself up to contest France. I also should have risked Budapest to get me into Trieste, especially given that I was wasting Pie on it. I'm caught not entering the west and not doing anything effective in the east.

Fall 04:
It's pretty much his game to lose at this point, and I start trying to come up with something to break out, but I think he also realizes it and isn't going to let me. He's still in Tyrolia and I'm really hurting from it. I've basically given up the west, which was a mistake given that he had me so tied up in the east.

Spring 05:
He sets up his line here and that's basically all she wrote for the rest of the game. A couple mistakes on my part even past here, but nothing that I think influenced the outcome. Nothing much more to say for the rest of the game.

TL;DR:
Squigs got into Tyr and I didn't get him out of it, and he proceeded to romp me. I proceeded to lose my head and then the game.

What I learned about Italy:
Tyr is a critical spot in Italy's defense, not just for contesting the east, but also for maintaining security of your heartland and the safety to leave your home centers open for builds early game. You need to take Tyr back early, and maintain control of it while your navy heads west. You should be beating Germany to Spain and MAO, or at least contesting them before he can funnel armies around. I think I also hurt here from neglecting sending armies through Turkey early enough. This wasn't a great game on my side.

What I learned about Germany:
Fleets picking up centers on their way to MAO and containing Italy rather than worrying about fighting it out for Austria, then send some armies around to solidify France and the rest is gravy. Holding Tyr is a huge pressure on Italy.
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teccles
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Re: 1v1 practice

#17 Post by teccles » Wed Jun 19, 2019 6:19 pm

Something interesting came up in my game in this "series" with Percy. He was playing Germany, and opened to Bohemia in Spring 1901. I opened to Tyrolia. In Autumn, this leads to a guessing game over Munich and Vienna, with pretty dire consequences for whoever guesses badly! I this case it was me, leaving me stuck on 1 build (after which Percy won comfortably). But if Germany guesses wrong, they either lose Munich (eek), or can't build there while Italy takes Vienna (also eek).

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Re: 1v1 practice

#18 Post by PRINCE WILLIAM » Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:56 pm

I am interested to play in future games. I have some experience with France vs Austria and even won some and a complete novice to Germany vs Italy.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#19 Post by mhsmith0 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 8:11 pm

Germany opening to Bohemia essentially gives away his overall positioning advantage in favor of a coin flip where if he wins he's in strong (but not quite crushing) position, and if he loses he's in trouble (if Italy gets Vienna to stay at 2-2, it's a big positioning advantage long term, if Italy gets Munich it's gg in 1901). I don't think it's a wise approach fwiw.

I also think that you made some meaningful errors in spring 1902.

Tyr-Bie and Ven-Tyr seems effective enough (worst case he gets into Tyr/Boh and that's... not really that bad? you can run Ven-Tyr, roll dice with Ven-Tri, etc), and you definitely should have gone Gre-Ser instead of Gre-Bul, as you left Budapest wide open for him to occupy without consequence.

As Germany, I wouldn't want to subject myself to a 50-50 coin flip to be behind in 1901 in exchange for a 50-50 chance to be ahead but not dominant.

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Re: 1v1 practice

#20 Post by teccles » Wed Jun 19, 2019 8:30 pm

I agree that the coinflip is probably worse than the default German play. I think it's interesting, but wouldn't use it (unless perhaps I though I was severely outmatched!)

Thanks for your points on Spring 1902. I agree 100% about Serbia, not sure what I was thinking on that one. I think if Germany had support attacked Tyrolia - which I thought was the most likely line - the support hold would have been the right play. So I think that one was losing a guessing game, rather than outright wrong?

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