Rules Resolution Question

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cdngooner
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Rules Resolution Question

#1 Post by cdngooner » Sat Jul 11, 2020 2:29 pm

How does this happen?

Russia:
Diplomacy
The army at Warsaw hold. (dislodged)
The fleet at Sevastopol move to Black Sea. (fail) (dislodged)
The fleet at Rumania move to Black Sea.
The fleet at Gulf of Bothnia move to Baltic Sea.
The army at Budapest move to Rumania. (fail)

How does the Rumania fleet succeed in taking Black Sea, if the Sevastopol fleet was also moving there. Neither was supported. The only difference is that the Sev fleet was dislodged by a Turkish attack from Black Sea, but since all moves are simultaneous, that should not have made a difference.

Can someone point me to the rule governing this?

RoganJosh
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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#2 Post by RoganJosh » Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:07 pm

https://media.wizards.com/2015/download ... _rules.pdf

Page 11, top of right column:

"A dislodged unit, even with support, has no effect on the province that dislodged it. "
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Tibarius
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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#3 Post by Tibarius » Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:09 pm

You did not list all units involved, nor the game it happened in, which makes it hard to name a precise rule reference. But if Fleet Sevastopol was dislodged from a turkish fleet in the black sea then it seems right to me on the first look.

The original board game rules, german version page 8 says (translated):
A move order, which is directed into a territory from which the moving unit is successfully attacked, is changed into a hold order.
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cdngooner
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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#4 Post by cdngooner » Sat Jul 11, 2020 5:12 pm

Thank you for those references. It seems counterintuitive that I (as attacking Turkey) am penalized but losing Black Sea, only because I was successful in taking Sev.

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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#5 Post by jay65536 » Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:30 pm

Not sure why this is counterintuitive. You moved out of the Black Sea. When you order your unit to leave a space and it succeeds, the unit doesn't defend the space it left. Any unit is free to follow behind it. The fleet moving from Sev is different because--intuitively--it "ran into" the attacking fleet, and got "pushed back" and thus could not bounce the other fleet.
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cdngooner
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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#6 Post by cdngooner » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:26 pm

To me its counterintuitive that what would normally be a bounce in Province A becomes a loss for me there because of a win in Province B.

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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#7 Post by RoganJosh » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:50 pm

You didn't order to Black Sea, so I'm not sure it's really accurate to say that you 'lost' in the Black Sea.

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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#8 Post by RoganJosh » Sun Jul 12, 2020 1:43 am

Tibarius wrote:
Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:09 pm
The original board game rules, german version page 8 says (translated):
A move order, which is directed into a territory from which the moving unit is successfully attacked, is changed into a hold order.
Is that a correct translation? That the order is 'changed into a hold order'?

If it is correct, then the German rules are just ... wrong.
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CptMike
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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#9 Post by CptMike » Sun Jul 12, 2020 5:35 am

RoganJosh wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 1:43 am
Tibarius wrote:
Sat Jul 11, 2020 4:09 pm
The original board game rules, german version page 8 says (translated):
A move order, which is directed into a territory from which the moving unit is successfully attacked, is changed into a hold order.
Is that a correct translation? That the order is 'changed into a hold order'?

If it is correct, then the German rules are just ... wrong.
Indeed. That version of the rules cancels a bypass move by a convoy...

David E. Cohen
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Re: Rules Resolution Question

#10 Post by David E. Cohen » Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:27 am

Not necessarily. You don't know what the rest of the rules say, especially if they state specifically that a convoy would be an exception to the quoted rule.

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