M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

[Jamiet99uk]

91.738%

I want Damo to answer.

If you want to know the real theoretical probability of nobody out of any three players being scum, it's 44.288% so slightly less than half.

Coincidentally, I bet at least one of donny, kgray and rdr is scum.

First of all there are four people whose name begins with B, not three.

Second of all, and to repeat myself again, I want Damo to answer. You are not Damo, are you?

[Jamiet99uk]

Here are the eight people that ended up on Flum:

Jamiet99uk
TheFlyingBoat
damo666
Chaqa
Hellenic Riot
rdrivera2005
bozotheclown
ghug

I think there are likely to be three categories of person on that list:

1. People who are town and who genuinely agreed with my case on Flum.

2. People who, in your words "blindly jumped on", implying that they are foolish town rather than scheming scumbos.

3. People who are scum, knew that I was wrong, and who felt it convenient to use my push on Flum to ensure a D1 miskill that could then be blamed on me.

How would you categorise each of the people on the Flum wagon, Bob?

Well that's a very broad question that requires too much research to be worth my time for a very questionably effective categorisation. But based off vibes:
Jamie - 1
TFB - 1
Damo - 3
Chaqa - 2 or 3, he should know better
HR - 1
Rdr - 1
Ghug - 1 or 3, he should also know better
Bozo - 1

This is an interesting analysis.

So you think that on the Flum wagon, Damo, Chaqa, and Ghug are the scum suspects. You have also mentioned you scumread Donny Dude, Kgray and Rdrivera. So your scumpool is Damo, Chaqa, Ghug, Donny, Kgray, Rdrivera.

See this is useful work.

[BobMcBob]

Here are the eight people that ended up on Flum:

Jamiet99uk
TheFlyingBoat
damo666
Chaqa
Hellenic Riot
rdrivera2005
bozotheclown
ghug

I think there are likely to be three categories of person on that list:

1. People who are town and who genuinely agreed with my case on Flum.

2. People who, in your words "blindly jumped on", implying that they are foolish town rather than scheming scumbos.

3. People who are scum, knew that I was wrong, and who felt it convenient to use my push on Flum to ensure a D1 miskill that could then be blamed on me.

How would you categorise each of the people on the Flum wagon, Bob?

Well that's a very broad question that requires too much research to be worth my time for a very questionably effective categorisation. But based off vibes:
Jamie - 1
TFB - 1
Damo - 3
Chaqa - 2 or 3, he should know better
HR - 1
Rdr - 1
Ghug - 1 or 3, he should also know better
Bozo - 1

This is an interesting analysis.

So you think that on the Flum wagon, Damo, Chaqa, and Ghug are the scum suspects. You have also mentioned you scumread Donny Dude, Kgray and Rdrivera. So your scumpool is Damo, Chaqa, Ghug, Donny, Kgray, Rdrivera.

See this is useful work.

Conveniently leaving yourself out Jamie? I didn't put you as a 3 only because you started the wagon and it didn't make sense to me to put it next to your name. Which is silly and I absolutely should've. Also Demon can go in my scumpool for having nothing going for him.

[goldfinger0303]

@rdrivera- are you 100% vanilla town?

Stop PR hunting. Your vt claim is also anti town.

Looks like someone didn't read rdrivera's post history very well.

[Durga]

Ayyyy goldie you're here

[Jamiet99uk]

Well that's a very broad question that requires too much research to be worth my time for a very questionably effective categorisation. But based off vibes:
Jamie - 1
TFB - 1
Damo - 3
Chaqa - 2 or 3, he should know better
HR - 1
Rdr - 1
Ghug - 1 or 3, he should also know better
Bozo - 1

This is an interesting analysis.

So you think that on the Flum wagon, Damo, Chaqa, and Ghug are the scum suspects. You have also mentioned you scumread Donny Dude, Kgray and Rdrivera. So your scumpool is Damo, Chaqa, Ghug, Donny, Kgray, Rdrivera.

See this is useful work.

Conveniently leaving yourself out Jamie? I didn't put you as a 3 only because you started the wagon and it didn't make sense to me to put it next to your name. Which is silly and I absolutely should've. Also Demon can go in my scumpool for having nothing going for him.

I left myself out because you categorised me as a "1" and therefore likely town and not a scum suspect.

The fact you've now changed your mind is not something I am responsible for and it is weird that you're suggesting I am somehow responsible for your categorisation of me.

So now your scumpool is Damo, Chaqa, Ghug, Donny, Kgray, Rdrivera, DemonRHK, and Jamiet99uk.

[Jamiet99uk]

@rdrivera- are you 100% vanilla town?

Stop PR hunting. Your vt claim is also anti town.

Looks like someone didn't read rdrivera's post history very well.

To be fair, Rdrivera was role-playing as Jeff Kuta earlier.

[Jamiet99uk]

@Goldfinger can you explain how you listed Bob as both scum and town in the same post, please?

[kgray]

giant wall of text

omg could you please break these thoughts up next time. there are so many things to respond to but this is impossible and i can't even be bothered to reread all of this closely. a few things though:

what about ghug's EOD made you think he was taking control? he followed my pressure onto Rivera (did he even really push that wagon? i don't think so) and ended on Flum with a jokey reason. not a good look and definitely not taking control imo.

every time i've seen someone share their last thoughts they've been town. celaph, hamilton, brain have all done this. it's not about parsing how novel or original Flum's thoughts were and the fact that you 1) expect people to do that in the last few minutes at EOD and to decide his thoughts weren't towny enough and 2) are emphasizing now that you don't think his reads were towny enough to justify not moving is sketchy.

and as a note lamp also encouraging flum to post his reads "early" and then questioning those reads makes him my strongest townread. and, i'm shocked you're ignoring the fact that flum bothered answering lamp's questions. that alone is incredibly towny of flum regardless of what you think of flum's reads.

[goldfinger0303]

Wait you scumread me and also think I'm town, so now HR is scum? But you can still push me later?

No, I just straight scumread you. My big long post was a rolling commentary, and I'm aware I townread you towards the beginning of it.

[rdrivera2005]

Stop PR hunting. Your vt claim is also anti town.

Looks like someone didn't read rdrivera's post history very well.

To be fair, Rdrivera was role-playing as Jeff Kuta earlier.

No, I was role-playing myself. I have being doing this since a game where I was 100% confirmed vanilla (could be town or scum). And I was town. And I have been doing this as town since that game.

[Jamiet99uk]

Wait you scumread me and also think I'm town, so now HR is scum? But you can still push me later?

No, I just straight scumread you. My big long post was a rolling commentary, and I'm aware I townread you towards the beginning of it.

You declared him to be scum in one sentence, and then town in the very next sentence, right after that.

[kgray]

Well, RIP Flum. I don't like blaming dead townies, but the whole "town tell" thing was a mess.

I always try to look at motivation before classifying a thing as scummy or towny. I can't find either a scum motivation or a town motivation on what Flim did, laying about a town tell and answering by first double down and later making fun. I still fail to see what he was expecting from this. And that's why I was just so in doubt about voting him or not.

For all the people (wrongly)scumreading me saying I was defending Flum or trying to deflate his wagon, I want you now to present a reason to why I would do that as scum and attract all this attention to me. Specially Kgray, who keep shading me without any logic explanation.

I tried to lay out my points near EOD yesterday but clearly I was too caught up in the moment to make sense because even HR didn't get what I was saying. I'll go back and summarize my logic in a bit. But I do think shading townies for voting someone you know will flip town is a perfectly reasonable scumplay and I could absolutely see you doing that with two townies who are going all-out on another townie, and damo who did his damo thing. I don't think you expected to get a lot of attention for it.

[goldfinger0303]

Wait you scumread me and also think I'm town, so now HR is scum? But you can still push me later?

No, I just straight scumread you. My big long post was a rolling commentary, and I'm aware I townread you towards the beginning of it.

You declared him to be scum in one sentence, and then town in the very next sentence, right after that.

Oh, I mixed up who was the leading alternative wagon at the end. I thought TFB was the counter-wagon, and rdrivera after it. I see the source of confusion now.

[kgray]

Thank you for recapping your case for flum being scum. I will now switch my vote. Flum's death is somewhat on himself, but town on this site really need to start thinking about D1 flum wagons before blindly jumping on them. This happens far too often to blame it all on flum at this point.

Yes Jamie, I hold you responsible over flum. Deal with it.

I was not recapping the case, I was recapping the sequence of events, just for the record.

Your opinion of the Flum wagon (and indeed, everyone's opinion of it) is a useful conversation topic, however.

Here are the eight people that ended up on Flum:

Jamiet99uk
TheFlyingBoat
damo666
Chaqa
Hellenic Riot
rdrivera2005
bozotheclown
ghug

I think there are likely to be three categories of person on that list:

1. People who are town and who genuinely agreed with my case on Flum.

2. People who, in your words "blindly jumped on", implying that they are foolish town rather than scheming scumbos.

3. People who are scum, knew that I was wrong, and who felt it convenient to use my push on Flum to ensure a D1 miskill that could then be blamed on me.


How would you categorise each of the people on the Flum wagon, Bob?

Well that's a very broad question that requires too much research to be worth my time for a very questionably effective categorisation. But based off vibes:
Jamie - 1
TFB - 1
Damo - 3
Chaqa - 2 or 3, he should know better
HR - 1
Rdr - 1
Ghug - 1 or 3, he should also know better
Bozo - 1

Now I should make it clear that I don't like the way this is phrased. I think most of the town on the wagon probably genuinely thought he was scum, but also genuinely suck at reading flum's antics, making them also " foolish". I'm most suspicious (other than you) of people who I would expect might've learned by now.

I agree that ghug and Chaqa should know better, and I completely reject your claim that Rivera and Bozo agreed with Jamie's case on Flum.

[Chaqa]

TBH over-analyzing the Flum wagon probably isn't super productive until we know Bob and/or TFB's alignments.

If all three are town, then scum probably is spread evenly among them and the non-major wagons.

If Bob or TFB if scum, there's probably a good number of scum on the opposite + Flum wagons.

Even once we do, Flum's Day 1 was very difficult to see town motivation for, so I have a feeling his wagon was more town-led than scum-led, which is why it didn't get much pushback - scum had no reason to intervene, especially if Bob and/or TFB are also town.

My gut says we had three town on the block yesterday.

[kgray]

@ghug do you still scumread Jamie?

[BobMcBob]

I was not recapping the case, I was recapping the sequence of events, just for the record.

Your opinion of the Flum wagon (and indeed, everyone's opinion of it) is a useful conversation topic, however.

Here are the eight people that ended up on Flum:

Jamiet99uk
TheFlyingBoat
damo666
Chaqa
Hellenic Riot
rdrivera2005
bozotheclown
ghug

I think there are likely to be three categories of person on that list:

1. People who are town and who genuinely agreed with my case on Flum.

2. People who, in your words "blindly jumped on", implying that they are foolish town rather than scheming scumbos.

3. People who are scum, knew that I was wrong, and who felt it convenient to use my push on Flum to ensure a D1 miskill that could then be blamed on me.


How would you categorise each of the people on the Flum wagon, Bob?

Well that's a very broad question that requires too much research to be worth my time for a very questionably effective categorisation. But based off vibes:
Jamie - 1
TFB - 1
Damo - 3
Chaqa - 2 or 3, he should know better
HR - 1
Rdr - 1
Ghug - 1 or 3, he should also know better
Bozo - 1

Now I should make it clear that I don't like the way this is phrased. I think most of the town on the wagon probably genuinely thought he was scum, but also genuinely suck at reading flum's antics, making them also " foolish". I'm most suspicious (other than you) of people who I would expect might've learned by now.

I agree that ghug and Chaqa should know better, and I completely reject your claim that Rivera and Bozo agreed with Jamie's case on Flum.

You may be right, I didn't do any checking on any of their votes. And checking now I see bozo stated being on there primarily to "resolve" flum, which is silly, and also something bozo would do, so he can be a 2 instead.

[bozotheclown]

I'm gonna need to explain why you have Donny and Rivera on here but not Bob, theflyingboat, Flum or Fox, please.

Bob and TFB seem to be trying to generate discussion. I get the feeling Foxcastle was looking for reactions with his one longer post. Fluminator said he was town.

Bozo here you said Flum was town and later reiterated you knew what he was doing.
You also noted the m59 Flum did the whole thing and lied.
I will also note you think rdr and bob are town before voting flum.
Did you feel that Flum was Mafia?
Or was it the more anti-towness of flum that late in the day?
What made you change from the flum town you were earlier asserting?

I was uncertain on Fluminator after he retracted his claim, and I thought the alternative wagons at EOD were more likely to be town. Also, the suspicion of Fluminator was not likely to go away, so not DKing him D1 would probably be delaying the inevitable.

[rdrivera2005]

Well, RIP Flum. I don't like blaming dead townies, but the whole "town tell" thing was a mess.

I always try to look at motivation before classifying a thing as scummy or towny. I can't find either a scum motivation or a town motivation on what Flim did, laying about a town tell and answering by first double down and later making fun. I still fail to see what he was expecting from this. And that's why I was just so in doubt about voting him or not.

For all the people (wrongly)scumreading me saying I was defending Flum or trying to deflate his wagon, I want you now to present a reason to why I would do that as scum and attract all this attention to me. Specially Kgray, who keep shading me without any logic explanation.

I tried to lay out my points near EOD yesterday but clearly I was too caught up in the moment to make sense because even HR didn't get what I was saying. I'll go back and summarize my logic in a bit. But I do think shading townies for voting someone you know will flip town is a perfectly reasonable scumplay and I could absolutely see you doing that with two townies who are going all-out on another townie, and damo who did his damo thing. I don't think you expected to get a lot of attention for it.

How do you know tfb and Jamiet are two townies? And how I was shading anyone?
I said I didn´t like the Flum wagon, because I find tfb midly scummy and Damo just voted out of the blue and ended, which isn´t a great thing to do on D1.
How is this shading? And why I would do that instead of simply voting Flum or just avoiding this discussion at all.
A challenge for you (or Bozo or Jamiet). Go find a scum game of mine where I did something like that. You won´t find.