M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

[ghug]

I feel like I've been slacking off today, and I don't really like the wagons, so I'm gonna take stock of my thoughts. 90% of this is for me, so read at your own peril.
-- removed for brevity

I don't think town!Ghug usually gives reads lists?

This is false. I don't believe in always doing them at preordained times, but it's useful to organize my thoughts.

[ghug]

I don't like the Vecna wagon.

I'm cooling on scum!Bob

Celaph seems like an OK option

But I really like ##Vote HR

Care to tell us why?

[Vecna]

If any other people made a post like that I would say he just want to distract the thread, but Maniac is just Maniac.

In fact, I think most of the times he made some weird play he was town. But Bozo probably can confirm it.

I think we just have to accept that Maniac is the best use of a copscan, ever.

What?? He's so town right now.

same as when he was scum last time and noone suspected him at any point during the game

[bozotheclown]

Havent observed Donny yet this game, but he's normally much more awkward as town and pretty convincing as scum.

Donny was the lead wagon when Vecna made this post. I find it suspicious how Vecna subtly defended Donny if he had not read anything yet.

##VOTE Vecna

I always criticize big wagons if I feel theyre based on shit reasoning. Donny was discussed on that very page, and people were citing his awkwarness as reasoning for voting him.

I would think you would want to read the game and decide for yourself instead of deciding Donny is town because he was a wagon, and I could not find anyone using the word "awkward" to describe Donny. Also, I have other reasons to suspect Donny. If Donny is mafia, one of his teammates probably jumped on his wagon.

[Vecna]

You mean where you said you wanted to scum read donny for finding the M61 stuff and confirming you but missing the later post you made? That would be interesting but you also couched it in the same post by saying you gut feel he is townie. Then you do roughly the same thing on bozo and said you're wifomming yourself on him. Both times on the two guys you say you have the most interesting information on you are unwilling to take any actual stand.

So I guess I'll ask the question: gun to your head town read or scum read on Donny and why? Same question for bozo.

Glad you're back Flum. Can you answer the two questions at the bottom when you get a chance?

Donny reacted very sus, but I haven't played with him in so long and I don't have the heart to scumread him right now. When he was scum he also buddied me pretty hard, and I don't really see him buddying people this game.
So it's a little awkward that my test made someone I was otherwise townreading look bad. I'll still lean town.

Bozo I need more info from, but he's been kind of mia. He said he knew what I was doing, so I lean towards town reading him for letting me do my thing when he could have shut it down right away.
I want to make sure he actually did know what I was doing though.

[bozotheclown]

what did ghug fake-claim? Did the wagon on him d1 actually got enough steam that he dismantled it with a fakeclaim?

He claimed a RB. Then Chaqa claimed RB too and he withdraw. Some people think it could be a scum plot to clear Chaqa (Goldie or Bozo I think?).

I think it would be a pretty dumb play to RB the kill in this setup. Theyre not clearing players anyway, so why not double your odds to not get copscans?

If it was bozo id consider that strike 2 for not well thought out comments

If I were mafia I would not want to leave a trail of players with RB claims. Also, if they wanted to fake claim the RB, that would be a good enough reason to RB the NK.

[BusinessLamp]

i can’t sleep and maybe it is because I have my vote on my dear friend celaph

##unvote

What do you see from Celaph last posts that made you change your mind?

nothing of celaph’s posts changed my mind because nothing of celaph’s posts caused me to vote him. i was just lazy/disheartened and thought that if kgray/ghug/Chaqa were all advocating for this maybe I should just trust they are right. but then I was like nah that is stupid

[Bonatogether]

I agree that we can't say how he'd play as scum, but we can still easily comment on whether his actions seem to benefit town, which I think they absolutely have. He has been sharing his opinions, starting wagons, defending people he townreads. That's why he merits a townread.

That's not the point. The point is him being competent is not in and of itself worthy of a townread due to his newness, and his newness is a reason to be more skittish on the townreads with blamp

I mean he also literally said he's played forum mafia before. I still feel good about him but I'd be feeling better if he'd pointed that out himself.

Where did blamp say that?

[Donny Dude]

I think the electoral system is flawed and my vote is pointless!!
But I think Goldys post on bob is good
A point there is that it feels prefaced by bob.
##vote bob
Mostly because I want to what bobs reaction is to that.
Plus, I did not find anything that bob says gold is scum directly until his post as mentioned by gold.

[BusinessLamp]

I agree that we can't say how he'd play as scum, but we can still easily comment on whether his actions seem to benefit town, which I think they absolutely have. He has been sharing his opinions, starting wagons, defending people he townreads. That's why he merits a townread.

That's not the point. The point is him being competent is not in and of itself worthy of a townread due to his newness, and his newness is a reason to be more skittish on the townreads with blamp

I mean he also literally said he's played forum mafia before. I still feel good about him but I'd be feeling better if he'd pointed that out himself.

yeah this has been awkward for me because the answer is that I am 1000% capable of playing a good scum game. Not only played forum mafia before, played like 150+ hours of Resistance, alias Survivor, etc. But I don’t know what good it does for me to be like “hell yeah I could be fooling you all, but I’m not!” all the discussion regarding me is frustrating because I feel like it has little to do with my actions and is all just like “what level of deception is possible.” a high level of deception is possible, i’m very smart. but im also just a guy that’s increasingly realizing why he stopped playing forum mafia in the first place lmao because finding mafia seems impossible.

[BusinessLamp]

That's not the point. The point is him being competent is not in and of itself worthy of a townread due to his newness, and his newness is a reason to be more skittish on the townreads with blamp

I mean he also literally said he's played forum mafia before. I still feel good about him but I'd be feeling better if he'd pointed that out himself.

Where did blamp say that?

opening post

[bozotheclown]

Demon again has the agitated tone he often has as scum.

I had the opposite reaction, this reminds me of when he was a mason with me and started getting pretty aggressive in the thread on D2. When I was scum with him later he didn't get aggro, iirc

It seems to me Vecna is fabricating things, I was mafia with RHK once and I would say he was the opposite of agitated.

[Jamiet99uk]

the only thing to come out of the ghug fake claim for me is that bob’s immediate “seems legit” feels forced. still undecided on Bob as a whole though

what did ghug fake-claim? Did the wagon on him d1 actually got enough steam that he dismantled it with a fakeclaim?

This feels fake. Like you're trying to dumbtell. You were a little around at EoD, you're capable of checking votes in the bot, and you know that if I'd claimed a role to save myself, there'd be more pressure on me today.

I don't actually believe you're the Day Fruit Vendor anymore.

[rdrivera2005]

Demon again has the agitated tone he often has as scum.

I had the opposite reaction, this reminds me of when he was a mason with me and started getting pretty aggressive in the thread on D2. When I was scum with him later he didn't get aggro, iirc

It seems to me Vecna is fabricating things, I was mafia with RHK once and I would say he was the opposite of agitated.

I remember Demon lurking a lot (really a lot) when he was scum.

[bozotheclown]

the only thing to come out of the ghug fake claim for me is that bob’s immediate “seems legit” feels forced. still undecided on Bob as a whole though

what did ghug fake-claim? Did the wagon on him d1 actually got enough steam that he dismantled it with a fakeclaim?

This feels fake. Like you're trying to dumbtell. You were a little around at EoD, you're capable of checking votes in the bot, and you know that if I'd claimed a role to save myself, there'd be more pressure on me today.

Good point, you should vote for Vecna.

[ghug]

If scum roleblocked town!Chaqa so that they could push for his miskill isn't it strange that nobody is voting for Chaqa?

Back to the drawing board on that theory, perhaps?

Jamie chill out

[ghug]

I agree that we can't say how he'd play as scum, but we can still easily comment on whether his actions seem to benefit town, which I think they absolutely have. He has been sharing his opinions, starting wagons, defending people he townreads. That's why he merits a townread.

That's not the point. The point is him being competent is not in and of itself worthy of a townread due to his newness, and his newness is a reason to be more skittish on the townreads with blamp

I mean he also literally said he's played forum mafia before. I still feel good about him but I'd be feeling better if he'd pointed that out himself.

Why is it his job to point that out himself?

[ghug]

Having just read the set up and rules there is no obligation to vote that I can find. Wierd.

@GM please verify

GM NOTE:

This is correct. There is an obligation to meaningfully participate, but no obligation to vote.

wtf. who decides what's meaningful then?

President Eden

[ghug]

Goldfinger time!
Water problems D1, he gets a pass.
Almost immediately comes back with a huge post which restates a lot of events and not much else. There's a bunch of reads at the beginning. The post is fine. Then a post with reads later, which is also fine. Gold finger completely forgetting I was a wagon, especially after reading through all of the EoD, is rather strange. He does not update his case on HR as a result.

Then goldie starts talking about DL8 and roleblocks... He says that scum would likely be roleblocking their kill target, which throws shade on Chaqa. He also states that scum might have killed DL8 because of something he mentioned offhand in his wall post. "DL was for sure scum sniping for PRs" is a very odd thing to say, and why would you come to that conclusion? And who would've decided that DL8 was a good PR snipe except goldie? He later pulls up three posts where people mention DL8, but none of them suggest that his activity is unusual for him. Which is what goldie states they are. This whole thing feels... off. Combine this with the fact that it has been dredged up that goldie has soft-gloated like this before and it looks worse again.

If he does flip scum, I think Chaqa is pretty much as good as clear. And he also strangely shades the Fox/Vecna wagon for being predicated on stuff in the first half of D1, which could be another connection.

I expected to come out of this scumreading goldie, but darn, I didn't remember the roleblock thing being so bad. I honestly like a ##vote goldie to see if we can get a wagon going.

Bob, for someone who draws the (somewhat correct, I suppose..) conclusion that Chaqa would be semi-clear if I flip scum, how are you not understanding my statement of "DL was the scum team sniping for PRs"?

Giving you the benefit of the doubt that you may have never been scum before, NK discussions roughly break down into 3 reasons 1) Someone is so obviously town (hard or soft clear) that they need to go. DL obviously did not fit this 2) This person might be a PR, but even if they're not they're a super scary town player, so let's kill them. Very typical N1 behavior, and you often see people like HR getting killed this way. And xorxes. DL is not one to inspire fear 3) Genuine belief someone is a PR.

Why did you expect to come out of it scumreading me though? That sounds like you went into the re-read looking for evidence to back up a scumread that would be believable. Honestly with that last paragraph, the whole post reeks something terrible.

##Vote Bob. Still willing to switch to my other votes, but holy shit how has nobody else caught that? For emphasis again.

I expected to come out of this scumreading goldie

DL has been pretty good since he's been back, so I think your assumption that he's not a potential fearkill is inaccurate.

[damo666]

Leaning back to scum on Bob now after gold's post and Demon not gaining traction so ##vote Bob.

This is probably my last post for about 24 hours.

I got 10 minutes before I have to go offline.