M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1961 Post by bozotheclown » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:30 pm

kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:05 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:48 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:38 pm


Why?
Bob was overconfident about Fluminator being town, and ghug's switch from Bob to Fluminator only makes sense if he was protecting Bob. ghug's vote for rdrivera also did not make sense unless he was trying to pull your vote off of Donny.
So they're scum dependent on your scumread of ghug? Where have you even made a case for scum!ghug?

Donny's reaction to being a wagon was majorly towny, and I stated I wanted to move off of him well before ghug voted Rivera.
ghug never mentioned rdrivera until you said you were interested in voting for him.

What in particular did you find town indicative about Donny's reaction?
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1962 Post by kgray » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:32 pm

bozo I would really like to know why you hate my Rivera case so much
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1963 Post by ghug » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:33 pm

kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:08 pm
ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:57 pm
Hellenic Riot wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:56 pm


My participation will be predicated on whether I'm working a morning shift the morning after an EoD or not. Given I expect to miss a few EoD's due to this, it makes sense to actually turn up to the ones I can be around for. If you think me being more active is scummy, would you care to explain why my usual early game inactivity is roughly equal as both alignments? I know full well this is the case, because it's always been a conscious decision on whether to be active or not :razz: .
I think there's a plausible scenario where you'd decided to hold back and then reconsidered because you didn't like how the day was going.
What would he have not liked? Town!Flum as a wagon? Donny as a wagon? TFB as a wagon? Don't you townread both of them?
Well clearly he did like town Flum as a wagon. Donny is a possibility (there you go acting like all the reads need to fit together this early again). He may have simply been worried that the group of us looking for an alternative to Flum would land on a teammate.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1964 Post by Maniac » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:34 pm

Chaqa wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:17 pm
I wouldn't worry too much about kgray, she only wins as scum when I'm on her team :razz:

What are people's thoughts on Maniac? Long gone are the days where he posted a lot, but I feel like he's lurking more than he normally would.
He gets more and more handsome and his case against Bob was god enough to grace the supreme court
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1965 Post by ghug » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:34 pm

Chaqa wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:17 pm
I wouldn't worry too much about kgray, she only wins as scum when I'm on her team :razz:

What are people's thoughts on Maniac? Long gone are the days where he posted a lot, but I feel like he's lurking more than he normally would.
I liked the posts he did make. They felt sufficiently weird.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1966 Post by bozotheclown » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:35 pm

kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:09 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:58 pm
Donny Dude wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 12:01 am


At least I agree with you on TFB
Now I hope this killer headache I have dissapates
I am not a fan of the way Durga hopped onto me so suddenly so why did you vote for me Durga?
##vote Durga
Donny singling out Durga's vote and voting for her when she had no votes and ignoring ghug's even less explained vote when ghug had 2 votes could also be explained by Donny and ghug being mafia.
Then why didn't he ask me about my vote? I had no votes and didn't really explain my Donny vote. Am I mafia with them too?
If Donny is mafia, he would not want to antagonize any of his voters more than he had to, so I could see him picking one so he has a place to put his vote and ignoring the rest. He also would want to get his vote off of celaph knowing celaph had yet to vote.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1967 Post by kgray » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:35 pm

bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:30 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:05 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:48 pm


Bob was overconfident about Fluminator being town, and ghug's switch from Bob to Fluminator only makes sense if he was protecting Bob. ghug's vote for rdrivera also did not make sense unless he was trying to pull your vote off of Donny.
So they're scum dependent on your scumread of ghug? Where have you even made a case for scum!ghug?

Donny's reaction to being a wagon was majorly towny, and I stated I wanted to move off of him well before ghug voted Rivera.
ghug never mentioned rdrivera until you said you were interested in voting for him.

What in particular did you find town indicative about Donny's reaction?
idk he just felt chill about it and not flustered. I don't even townread ghug so you don't have to convince me that him voting for Rivera is scummy, but you can't say he specifically voted Rivera to pull me off of Donny when I'd already said I was going to move off Donny before he voted Rivera.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1968 Post by ghug » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:36 pm

bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:17 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:02 pm
ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:59 pm


Bozo, do you ever not scumread me?
Are you ever not scum?
I looked at past games, and the last game where we were both town was M69, and I never scum read you that game. Before that, I had to go back to M62 to find the next most recent game where we were both town, and I never scum read you in that game either. So, your suggestion that I always scum read you is either biased by the last 2 games where I scum read you when you were scum, or just an attempt to discredit me.
I still haven't emotionally recovered from the game where I went up against scum and won for three straight days and you still got me killed on the fourth day.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1969 Post by kgray » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:38 pm

ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:33 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:08 pm
ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:57 pm


I think there's a plausible scenario where you'd decided to hold back and then reconsidered because you didn't like how the day was going.
What would he have not liked? Town!Flum as a wagon? Donny as a wagon? TFB as a wagon? Don't you townread both of them?
Well clearly he did like town Flum as a wagon. Donny is a possibility (there you go acting like all the reads need to fit together this early again). He may have simply been worried that the group of us looking for an alternative to Flum would land on a teammate.
No I'm not saying reads all need to fit together perfectly, but you can't just make random assertions that don't fit in at all with your idea of the game state. Then you're just doing pointless 'what if' exercises.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1970 Post by ghug » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:38 pm

bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:30 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:05 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:48 pm


Bob was overconfident about Fluminator being town, and ghug's switch from Bob to Fluminator only makes sense if he was protecting Bob. ghug's vote for rdrivera also did not make sense unless he was trying to pull your vote off of Donny.
So they're scum dependent on your scumread of ghug? Where have you even made a case for scum!ghug?

Donny's reaction to being a wagon was majorly towny, and I stated I wanted to move off of him well before ghug voted Rivera.
ghug never mentioned rdrivera until you said you were interested in voting for him.

What in particular did you find town indicative about Donny's reaction?
I responded to him several times, at least one of which was antagonistic, and I didn't include him in the list of players I wasn't interested in killing, so saying I hadn't mentioned him feels a little disingenuous.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1971 Post by kgray » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:42 pm

bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:35 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:09 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:58 pm


Donny singling out Durga's vote and voting for her when she had no votes and ignoring ghug's even less explained vote when ghug had 2 votes could also be explained by Donny and ghug being mafia.
Then why didn't he ask me about my vote? I had no votes and didn't really explain my Donny vote. Am I mafia with them too?
If Donny is mafia, he would not want to antagonize any of his voters more than he had to, so I could see him picking one so he has a place to put his vote and ignoring the rest. He also would want to get his vote off of celaph knowing celaph had yet to vote.
I cannot believe this is the crux of your scum!donny read.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1972 Post by ghug » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:43 pm

kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:38 pm
ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:33 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:08 pm


What would he have not liked? Town!Flum as a wagon? Donny as a wagon? TFB as a wagon? Don't you townread both of them?
Well clearly he did like town Flum as a wagon. Donny is a possibility (there you go acting like all the reads need to fit together this early again). He may have simply been worried that the group of us looking for an alternative to Flum would land on a teammate.
No I'm not saying reads all need to fit together perfectly, but you can't just make random assertions that don't fit in at all with your idea of the game state. Then you're just doing pointless 'what if' exercises.
It's not a random assertion. HR's behavior is individually scummy. Donny's behavior is individually scummy. Based on HR's behavior, Donny would make a lot of sense as a partner, which would be enough for me to reconsider the townread should HR flip scum.

I don't have to know HR's exact scum motivation to believe that his play wasn't town-motivated. You're asking me for possibilities, so I'm giving them.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1973 Post by bozotheclown » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:43 pm

ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:38 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:30 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:05 pm


So they're scum dependent on your scumread of ghug? Where have you even made a case for scum!ghug?

Donny's reaction to being a wagon was majorly towny, and I stated I wanted to move off of him well before ghug voted Rivera.
ghug never mentioned rdrivera until you said you were interested in voting for him.

What in particular did you find town indicative about Donny's reaction?
I responded to him several times, at least one of which was antagonistic, and I didn't include him in the list of players I wasn't interested in killing, so saying I hadn't mentioned him feels a little disingenuous.
You did not mention him by name at least, and he was voting for you.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1974 Post by ghug » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:45 pm

bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:43 pm
ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:38 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:30 pm


ghug never mentioned rdrivera until you said you were interested in voting for him.

What in particular did you find town indicative about Donny's reaction?
I responded to him several times, at least one of which was antagonistic, and I didn't include him in the list of players I wasn't interested in killing, so saying I hadn't mentioned him feels a little disingenuous.
You did not mention him by name at least, and he was voting for you.
I responded directly to his vote for me...
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1975 Post by DeathLlama8 » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:46 pm

kgray/ghug feels TvT here in that I can pretty easily identify where both of them are coming from. I wouldn't want to flip HR before one of the possible partners at EOD1 (donny, tfb?) flips scum though
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1976 Post by bozotheclown » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:47 pm

kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:32 pm
bozo I would really like to know why you hate my Rivera case so much
rdrivera would not try to pocket me as scum and his reaction to Fluminator was similar to mine.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1977 Post by kgray » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:48 pm

ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:43 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:38 pm
ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:33 pm


Well clearly he did like town Flum as a wagon. Donny is a possibility (there you go acting like all the reads need to fit together this early again). He may have simply been worried that the group of us looking for an alternative to Flum would land on a teammate.
No I'm not saying reads all need to fit together perfectly, but you can't just make random assertions that don't fit in at all with your idea of the game state. Then you're just doing pointless 'what if' exercises.
It's not a random assertion. HR's behavior is individually scummy. Donny's behavior is individually scummy. Based on HR's behavior, Donny would make a lot of sense as a partner, which would be enough for me to reconsider the townread should HR flip scum.

I don't have to know HR's exact scum motivation to believe that his play wasn't town-motivated. You're asking me for possibilities, so I'm giving them.
No Donny's behavior is not individually scummy! What? What's scummy about him? And if Donny and HR are partners, why was HR's first read "I thought Donny was towny but now I don't"?

You're saying HR's behavior of being active at EOD is scummy on it's own and it's not, he does it as town. Now you're trying to add in something about Donny to make it seems scummier, but it's the opposite. Finding people who are towny near EOD is one of the most towny things a person can do.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1978 Post by bozotheclown » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:50 pm

ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:45 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:43 pm
ghug wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:38 pm


I responded to him several times, at least one of which was antagonistic, and I didn't include him in the list of players I wasn't interested in killing, so saying I hadn't mentioned him feels a little disingenuous.
You did not mention him by name at least, and he was voting for you.
I responded directly to his vote for me...
OK, but your top scum read is still coincidentally that first player to vote for you.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1979 Post by kgray » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:51 pm

bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:47 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:32 pm
bozo I would really like to know why you hate my Rivera case so much
rdrivera would not try to pocket me as scum and his reaction to Fluminator was similar to mine.
I have never said he tried to pocket you, you'll not in my wall post that I made it very clear that I was incorrect about him defending you. And it's not true that your Flum reactions were similar, they were the opposite. He explicitly said Flum was scummy and didn't vote for him (until the very end). You explicitly said Flum was towny and did vote for him.
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Re: M72 - “Echoes of Evelyn” - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#1980 Post by bozotheclown » Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:53 pm

kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:42 pm
bozotheclown wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:35 pm
kgray wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 9:09 pm


Then why didn't he ask me about my vote? I had no votes and didn't really explain my Donny vote. Am I mafia with them too?
If Donny is mafia, he would not want to antagonize any of his voters more than he had to, so I could see him picking one so he has a place to put his vote and ignoring the rest. He also would want to get his vote off of celaph knowing celaph had yet to vote.
I cannot believe this is the crux of your scum!donny read.
I believe votes are a good place to look scum motivation. After reviewing the 98 votes placed D1, ghug's votes for rdrivera and Fluminator were 2 of the most suspicious.
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