Mini Mafia 1018 - Race with the Devil [hidden]

[worcej]

I was keeping up to a point, and had strong townreads on Bona and Fox as well as scumread on ghug.

Wasn't sure on Fishy, but he flipped scum so that's good.

I'm pretty sure ghug is scum.

##Vote ghug

I hate this but his blow-up and subsequent request for a subout is probably indicative of Jamie being town...

##vote ghug - back to my opposite theory.

[ghug]

I was keeping up to a point, and had strong townreads on Bona and Fox as well as scumread on ghug.

Wasn't sure on Fishy, but he flipped scum so that's good.

I'm pretty sure ghug is scum.

##Vote ghug

I hate this but his blow-up and subsequent request for a subout is probably indicative of Jamie being town...

##vote ghug - back to my opposite theory.

Jamie proved last game that hes capable of similarly pathetic losses of emotional control as scum. This was my gut reaction as well, but his response to us voting for him for reasons he perceived to not relate to his conduct in the game was very similar to his response to kgray dismissing what he had to say because she was confident he was scum.

The only thing we can reliably take away from this is that Chaqa is very unlikely to be scum with either of the two of us.

[ghug]

I'd also encourage anyone inclined to vote for me to look at the EoD voting assuming that I'm lfischl's teammate and not Jamie's and tell me if it makes any sense.

[Bonatogether]

I'd also encourage anyone inclined to vote for me to look at the EoD voting assuming that I'm lfischl's teammate and not Jamie's and tell me if it makes any sense.

##vote ghug

choo choo

[ghug]

I'd also encourage anyone inclined to vote for me to look at the EoD voting assuming that I'm lfischl's teammate and not Jamie's and tell me if it makes any sense.

##vote ghug

choo choo

[ghug]

This game is dead af

[BobMcBob]

This game is dead af

yep
sure is

[BobMcBob]

okay so jamies disappearance is odd
but im much more inclined to think it came from town
so i dont really love ghug here
worcej doesnt really gain or lose towniness from this so hes still just meh
i still like a celaph wagon if anybody else wants to join me

[Maniac]

Ghug’s wagon is BS and very probably Mafia led. No one has given a reason for voting for him except worceJ who uses the excuse that Ghug is scum if Jamie is town. Jamie’s play seems soooo exaggerated that it’s more likely to be scum motivated and planned last night. I don’t believe that anyone gets so upset because people read you as scum in a game of Mafia.

If there is any logic in the notion that Jamie and Ghug must be on different teams, then we should flip Chaqa/Jamie

[Vecna]

Vecna ketchup wall – Its gotta be Heinz or the south African delicious gold stuff edition

Oh, good, I see lfischl browsing the forum. I would like to hear more from you.

I don't really have that many reads. Voting vecna for capital letters is not a good idea but other than that i don't have much.

make something up

Commented on it at the time, but this interaction is pretty interesting after an lfischl flip. Not sure how to interpret it, I remember as bona being quite crazy/fun that time he was scum.

Can someone try to kill someone else? I'm bored

While at the same time as Fox is questioning and prodding lfischl, Ghug is sitting here not interacting with it, trying to create something potentially? Its fitting the narrative on my part, but Id feel a bit uncomfortable if I saw my teammate lfischl get pressures In this spot.

Reading Jamie In isolation it’s interesting that he provided the data about high/low posters being voted off D1 (admittedly at my instigation) but it seems that he is now using our group bias to get target a low poster with spurious reasons like ‘seems of’. Getting easy D1 kills is not pro-town. ##vote Jamie

Ah, this is the Maniac I was missing last game.

Do like this Ghug post though.

*SQUAWK*

Why do you squawk?

This question seems weird.

Interesting worcej observation. Lets look into how he follows up on it.

I don't really have that many reads. Voting vecna for capital letters is not a good idea but other than that i don't have much.

make something up

i love this post so much
but seriously lfischl, you need to start having more opinions
chuck out some gut feelings at least

There sure was a lot of attention for that interaction. Note to check for followup and leadup to EoD as well. Pretty sure Bob never encouraged lfischl to do shit last game.

Bob is trying too hard.

Hmmm, interesting

make something up

i love this post so much
but seriously lfischl, you need to start having more opinions
chuck out some gut feelings at least

If one of ghug and jaime are scum then the other definitly is. If we were to vote one of them out and they were town then i think the other one would be town as well.

And he actually responds to the request. With a post that is quite interesting in hindsight.

Celaph, it feels like youre having trouble naturally entering the stream of conversation.

Whats happening buddy?

Did you just call out the 3 maf from my pool? Is my theory actually correct?

Hmm above post actually indicates that his big shitposting wall wasn’t as shitposty as it was last game, but that he’s actually looking for stuff to connect. Interesting.

Jamie's goading me and I'm trying not to start a fight. This is what should have been expected from both of us regardless of alignment. Why do you think it means something else?

no thats exactly what i mean
i think the conversation would likely play out like this regardless of your alignments
pretty sure thats what i said

Yes, it's Lfischl's reaction that's odd, in my opinion, Bob, not yours.

More shots taken at lfischl, this time by jamiet. Unless the bus was the plan, this reflects pretty good.

so tossing up voting between lfischl and worcej
they both kinda suck
both talked about ghug/jamie and not much else
but i feel like lfischl was more awkward about it so ##vote lfischl
although i did like his reply to bona

Reflects decently overall. Pro’s/cons seem genuine enough.

@Lfischl - why are you so absent, yet again?

Take part or sub out.

Interesting that he advocates for a replacement as opposed to just killing the slot.

Jamie/Vecna scumteam confirmed.

Not Jamiet/celaph?

I'm not seeing the celaph thing, and the way Vecna interacted with Jamie on page 1 reads like annoyance at a teammate.

Why specifically a teammate though, Ghug?

As someone who said last game 'good job buddying me' to me after my mafiaflip and with this post, who would you say would've buddied you in this game (or is there no one)? Is there any duo right now who, you would say, seems to be buddying? Or someone who tries to buddy someone?

Ghug could be buddying Bona, but it's now his usual style as scum. People that are usually a bit abrasive don't tend to try to buddy anyone as it would be too obvious.

Rdr's (albeit rather limited) posts this game feel like a productive town rdr.

Bit of a weak take. This was one of the very few rdr posts that actually tried to push an opinion, no?

I feel very meh about almost everyone at the moment and I haven't seen anyone really make a good argument. Hence my focus on pushing back against people's suspicions.

since are you the one who's pushing back against townreads? usually you're doing something constructive

I find it interesting that you think I'm pushing back against townreads when I'm doing the exact opposite, pushing back against people's scumreads. I'm not confident in my own, but I'd like people to at least put forward good reasons for the wagons they are on. I was doing just that in 2 of the 4 posts you highlighted earlier.

*nods* *nods*

Can you elaborate on what caught your eye because it feels like normal NAI ghug to me? Particularly given your later comment, why you think that Bona is likely to be ghug's teammate? Do you dislike a scum ghug/town Bona explanation?

I'm challenging Kak's ghug/bona scumread because I don't see it.

Why is it wierd? I'm just asking why he posts *SQUAWK*.

@worcej, coming from anyone besides lfischl I would agree with you, but my memory is that lfischl has asked a number of literal surface level questions before like this.

I'm contesting worcej's read on lfischl as weird because it strikes me as normal lfischl.

One of the other two posts you quoted was when I agreed that Bob's last posts at the time were weird. I stand by that statement though since then his posts have returned to a more normal Bob. I'm keeping an eye on him, but don't have a strong desire to kill him today. The last one was me challenging lfischl's ghug/Jamie connection. I suppose you could interpret this as pushing back against a townread, but I see no indication about whether lfischl sees them as more likely t/t or s/s.

This wall feels like a pretty big effort to defend a scum teammate. Makes it feel less likely that Celaph was lfischl’s teammate.

[Vecna]

Ghug, Kak, Jamiet, Celaph — pick three for the scum team?

Phew, that is actually hard. I'm having the creeps right now from lfischl. Worcej isn't here, ok, something sunday and family (see last game), alright, but no word of it is kinda strange. And then ... hmm ... I'm kinda lost. Maybe celaph? Maybe jamie? Maybe bob? From the reactions per se, I'm not sure, but did bob try to buddy me? And maniac was kinda strange too, but that might be just strange strange. Or weird strange.

So probably lfischl, worcej and, with the current low energy situation, probably bob and cel/jamie are just the t vs t situation mafia would want to have? Sorry if I sound unsure but I guess I can't get a better feeling of the situation right now.

Unless Jamie is scum, this hesitancy strikes me as town from Kak. ##unvote

Why only mention jamiet as a possible scum though?

[Kakarroto]

I hope you feel better now, Jamie. I have to say though, your use of the word 'abuse' strikes me as a bit too lightly, but that is a thing left for another time/place. If you feel however you were wrongly pushed and you can't continue this way, I think you've made the right choice. I wish you all the best.

Returning to game related things: I think the whole thing gives Jamie a few notches for town. I'm a bit surprised to see me in his maf reads, but I guess I'm not the towniest town in here right now. Well, time to catch some maf's then.

Ghuggie, ghuggie, ghuggie ... I can't place you right now. If I look at you, there are millions of different ways that you could be town, mafia, 3P (yes, even that) and a special voice is whispering in my head that you might be evil.

Looking at that wagon on you though, I don't especially like it. Hmm, rd says it's an alarmbell vote (my special voice agrees there), Chaqa says he reads you since before as mafia, hmm. Well, that might be true, but Chaqa has read the thread until now? That's good to hear, noted. Worcej ... after the 'blow-up', he goes back to his theory but in reverse ... though this theory came from lfischl ... I don't like this reasoning. Does that make sense to anyone else? Am I misunderstanding something? And then Bona vote. Hmm. Nothing too suspicous, though it kinda feels empty.

@worcej have you read the game up since weekend is over? Do you have any more ideas/questions/theories?

[Vecna]

Lol fuck yeah.

I was all ready to proclaim Kak's scumminess, but now I'm unsure.

This seems like the pivotal moment where Ghug turned off the kakka as potential scum mindset, and maybe later on ignored his silly postings of over-the-top surprise after the night reveal?

(im not completely certain about Ghug, naturally, but a lot of silly things seem to fit just fine with him being scum.)

[Vecna]

You shouldn't be scum reading me for my late vote. Anyone who can read can see I didn't believe in it. If you want to scum read me for something, scum

*Scum read me for defending him all day.

they were tepid and uninteresting defenses

also pretty sure the bona progression on Celaph comes from a good place.

Very convincingly done if faked somehow.

[celaph]

@Worcej:


Come here and participate. It is no longer the weekend.

You have made 10 posts in the entire game so far.

Four of those 10 posts accuse me and Ghug of being scum together, without providing any reasoning for this view. Please would you explain why you hold this (incorrect) position?

This post feels like town Jamie to me. He seems angry, but he is channeling that anger into something productive to try and solve the game.

[celaph]

Also, I was RB'd.

[Kakarroto]

Also, I was RB'd.

On a scale from 1 to 10, how glad are you that fox, who was voting you for reading you weak town/townleaning on you, was the night target?

Why do you think that mafia would rb you and nk him?

[celaph]

maniac for lack of content?
really?
and not lfischl?

i disagree with kak reasoning but its at least fine and i could see someone thinking that

Yes, Maniac provided incredibly little content especially the latter half of that day.

As I noted above, I had commented on my reasons for not wanting to vote lfischl hence his exclusion here despite the obvious lack of content. Rdr is the other name that I didn't bring up mostly because I D1 bias rdr enough that I'm not inclined to kill him.

maniac not only provided more content than lfischl but also more towny content
i would hardly characterise maniac as lurking yesterday
why was your approach so inexplicably different?
why did lfischl get a free pass for lurking just because he always does that?

As I said earlier:

Because I'm not sold on Bona's argument that lfischl is impossible to read. And it's not just because he posts so little. He has had a couple town games with many more posts where he still ends up getting killed quite quickly. I had a theory about his behavior being indicative of a normal, town, lfischl. Obviously I was wrong.

I wasn't comparing lfischl to Maniac, I was comparing lfischl to past lfischl. I think more highly of both Maniac's scum and town play than I do of lfischl's. If I play purely off who I think has been the towniest, then I expect I'll miskill lfischl every game that he's town.

[BobMcBob]

Also, I was RB'd.

hmmmm

[celaph]

that wouldve looked a lot worse if worcej was scum
as it stands it doesnt look too bad now
i think

Why would it have looked worse if Worcej is scum? I feel like Jamie looks decent for calling out Kak's move to lfischl.
As is, I feel like it looks alright, but mostly because I don't expect that scum Jamie there is in the mindset there of accusing Kak knowing Kak is right.

this was saying kak wouldve looked awful if worcej was scum
which i stand by

ahhh, I misunderstood what you were saying. I agree scum worcej looks bad for Kak.