MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4941 Post by Hamilton Brian » Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:55 pm

Christ EMC, make up your mind!!! Who do you scum read?

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4942 Post by ghug » Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:59 pm

If I die kill kgray.

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4943 Post by Hamilton Brian » Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:59 pm

Town: kgray, ghug, Bob, brain, bins, bunny, Damo, demon, donny

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4944 Post by DemonRHK » Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:59 pm

Conf Town
brain
kgray

town
rdr
Bob
bona
HB

Scum
HR
cel
Maniac
Vecna
Ezio

I expect to see morning but imagine many confs will not.

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4945 Post by kgray » Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:59 pm

None of this should be a surprise, and I’m pretty sure I have too many townreads, but here’s where I’m at:

Bob - I’d be so impressed if he’s scum here. He’s seeing the game pretty similarly to how I’m seeing it, and although sometimes I wonder if he’s just parroting me to pocket me, it seems pretty natural. The way he pokes at people (Ezio and Donny recently) shows a confidence that I think he wouldn’t have as scum, based on the game I played with scum!Bob. Townread.

Bonatogether - is doing anti-town stuff and it gets annoying, but I think he mostly means well and is just excited to be solving. Townread.

brainbomb - motivated, hunting, engaged, invested. Town.

BunnyGo - I have no words for Bunny right now. Null I guess.

celaph - Demon raises a good question about celaph wanting damo as a wagon, and I’m not sure I’m satisfied with celaph’s response. But I really don’t see any reason for scum!celaph to advocate sheeping me as he’s about to die. Townlean.

damo666 - I don’t buy that he’s scum who needed to claim for towncred. I’m sure people are like “that’s the point” but I just don’t see damo of all people doing this. I dislike some of his votes but he wouldn’t be damo if that weren’t the case. Townlean.

DemonRHK - makes good, original points. Pro-town in an unhesitant way, not hiding or going with the flow of the thread. Town.

Donny Dude - I like his questioning posts, I feel like he’s trying to solve a puzzle and it seems like it’s deeper than what he did when he was scum in M60. Townlean.

Emc^42 - obviously inactive, and when he’s here his tone is different from normal. Could be explained by irl factors but my town list is growing and he’s not on it. And when he does show up he’s not putting any thought into reads at all. Scumlean.

Ezio - very questionable motives for his lie but I don’t get why he’d do it as scum if he didn’t have a better explanation. Could be counting on people to believe that, though. Null.

ghug - actually feeling better about ghug atm. Still think his lack of scum hunting is a problem, and was really evident even on D1. But he doesn’t feel scummy somehow. Null.

hamilton brian - nothing about Hamilton CCing Ezio was scummy in any way, and his unbridled joy at catching someone in a lie, while also wondering if he should out because he didn’t want to reveal something that could hurt town, is the towniest thing I’ve ever seen. Never kill him. Very very very strong townread.

Hellenic Riot - obvscum.

Jasnah - Wish she’d talk more. Sometimes when she reacts to things I see a thought process similar to mine. Confidence/abrasiveness is NAI but unless she’s playing a hugely wifom-forward game I doubt she refuses to explain reads as scum. Townlean.

Macca573 - not contributing reads freely, reminds me a lot of Macca’s scum game. Not sure why they’d blatantly out a PR during the night as scum, though. Null.

Maniac - Don’t like anything he said N2. Scumlean.

rdrivera2005 - classic obvtown rivera. Town.

Vecna - virtually nonexistent. Null.

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4946 Post by kgray » Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:59 pm

ghug wrote:
Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:59 pm
If I die kill kgray.
no

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4947 Post by Hellenic Riot » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:00 pm

So obviously I do not actually have an incontrovertible and impossible guilty on kgray, as BunnyGo noted at the time, but I find the bloc voting to be deeply problematic and I really do not see a reason to believe she is town here. Let's have a look at the progression of her thoughts on rdrivera, starting with her scum-case on him d1:
kgray wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 9:16 pm
I'm also mildly suspicious of Rivera because even though he's often not a big poster early, he usually does present some reads. This game all he's done is piggy-back off my brain townread, said basically what I said about Macca (and bozo pointed out why Rivera saying that didn't make sense) and made a weird comment about Maniac being scummy for things that Rivera knows very well that town!Maniac does.
A perfectly reasonable case, though as I pointed out at the time, not a conclusive one. Pertinently she suspected him because he had done nothing and was not giving reads - Something which rdrivera has done absolutely fuck all of ever since. kgray attempted to get a wagon on him going for quite a while at EoD1 before backing out and heading after others, but kept having rdrivera as her top scumread.

But N1, when pushed on whether rdrivera was scum, she's now hedging hard:
kgray wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:48 pm
Hellenic Riot wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 9:58 pm
Now kgray, given that you apparently *were* fairly convinced that rdrivera was scum, I have some questions of my own:

A) Why did YOU not switch back from celaph when rdrivera took the lead after you thought the wagon was dead?
B) Do you think those reasons apply to DemonRHK who had the same pattern as you, too?
C) What do you think about the other conclusions from my VCA, primarily how atrocious damo looks there?
I wouldn't say I was fairly convinced, but yeah I definitely thought/think it's possible that Rivera is scum. I don't know, the Rivera wagon wasn't feeling right, I definitely changed my mind about Bunny, and celaph made sense at the time.

[SNIP]
Come D2 this has now transformed into one of her top townreads:
kgray wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:50 pm
Vecna wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 7:45 pm
someone entertain me some, im here now. I dont have time to catchup on 200 pages atm, but I do wanna get a grasp of shit and hammer some scumbucket again so I can die in peace tonight.
People who should absolutely not die today: brain, bona, Rivera, Bob, Demon, Donny, Hamilton, Ezio

People who are scummy: ghug, celaph, damo, HR
Now, what can have changed in that time? Option one of course is that she has a report on rdrivera, but given that she spent half the day pushing for a celaph flip to work out if there's a psychotrooper then the idea that she's magically townreading rdrivera based solely on a report instead of just pushing her preivous top scumread then this line doesn't hold up to any sort of scrutiny whatsoever. If she were that concerned about a psychotrooper, she'd still be wanting rdrivera. So then, maybe it's his gameplay that suddenly changed?

Well...

Let's first have a look at rdrivera's N1, and a couple of key posts in particular:
rdrivera2005 wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 1:04 am
Well, missed EOD. I thought it was later.

I kind of understand why I was a wagon and also why lfischl was a wagon. Don't get why he didn't claim his role. We now know for sure Alien lover is out of play. Not much.

Was that Bunny claim real?

I need to read EOD but probably not tonight.

See you.
So first up rdrivera enters and "understands why he was a wagon". Fair enough. Nothing of note here. EXCEPT...
rdrivera2005 wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 9:51 am
kgray wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 3:58 am
Hellenic Riot wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 11:36 pm
I want people to explain why ghug & I were the only people trying to prevent a tie there. Everyone who was present had better come up with a good reason for sitting back and letting Bona pull that shit - The only reason it was close is because none of the rest of you shifted
This is a lot of righteous indignation coming from someone who was on a vanity Rivera wagon with one minute to go, especially considering you didn't even strongly scumread Rivera.
That's a good point. I was re-reading EOD and HR vote on me looked really weird as we never interacted, I was offline and was obviously softing a PR. Not a vote I expect from HR closer to EOD.

What the ACTUAL fuck is this post? A) Who the fuck announces that they were softing a PR - *AT NIGHT* - Under no pressure, and for no reason whatsover - Ever? And B) He just said that he understood why he was a wagon, and now all of a sudden he was "obviously softing a PR". These two things are mutually incompatible - How can you think you were an obvious PR but also understand why you were a wagon?

---

Anyway, let's move on to rdrivera's D2. I can't be bothered to quote the whole thing.

http://mafia.peterlund.se/e/web/msgs?g= ... rivera2005

So, rdrivera still has basically no presence whatsoever. He does have a few reads now, but once again most of them are piggybacked. He also, at the point where I voted him and magically summoned him within five minutes, showed that he was clearly reading the thread but deliberately choosing not to post. None of which suggests that there's any reason for kgray to be townreading rdrivera. And of course, when asked about him D2, she could only come up with:
kgray wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:43 pm
Hellenic Riot wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:32 pm
I'd love to hear why rdrivera is your example here given you scumread him D1 and he's done absolutely fuck all today. He came in and claimed he'd softed a PR D1 (at night, for no reason whatsoever), and then disappeared off the face of the earth. Why are you no longer scumreading him?
Because he said he's obvtown and he only ever says that when he's town. And I decided that he's playing how I expect him to as town, like you originally said, and I don't trust the people saying he was saved. And I'm his spokesperson, and we're vibing this game, and he's town.
IE She couldn't make any explanation whatsoever for why her read has changed. And now of course tonight she's been harping on about Underdogs and how people are likely to change their reads entirely because of them - Something which sounds like some pretty poor scumplay but also sounds like it comes from experience. Is rdrivera an Underdog, and that's why she wanted him D1 but magically forgot about him ever since? Quite possibly yes.

As for RHK, I have no idea if he's actually a lover or just some deluded townie, and don't really care because the only thing he's actually done this game is repeatedly post about how ANGERY everything makes him and show off his macho body like some sweaty bodybuilder at the gym.


---

Moving onto the elephant in the room: Why did I tie the vote? Well, mostly because you all deserved it. After repeatedly calling all of you out N1 for the way you sat there and basically allowed Bona to run wild trying to tie the vote D1, what happens D2? Oh, that's right, you once again all sat there and did no consolidating despite numerous off-wagon voters *ACTIVELY POSTING* at the time. So I saw an opportunity to make you all learn not to create the scenario. But more importantly, I saw the way celaph had got off the other counterwagons and instead come aggressively at me and it reminded me strongly of whatever day we almost killed him in M62, and I therefore now have quite a significant townread on celaph. So I decided to load up time.is on my second monitor, furiously refresh to see if people would consolidate, and if not, I'd tie the vote.

Naturally I *could* have pushed on Ezio, but as I have said repeatedly, I really do not see any motivation for scum to lie about their discards. And for scum to lie about their discards to claim they tossed a UNIQUE ROLE makes even less sense - What the fuck is the point of taking that risk and therefore risking the call out? There is none. Maybe you could make an argument that he's a scumplayer who got two good scumcards and didn't want town to comfortably rule one out of being in play, but if that's the case he still just claims he tosses VT or Goon. So I didn't (and still do not) want to get Ezio either. And because we almost certainly don't have many miskills before we lose our majority and maybe even our plurality (something I also pointed out during the day), I'm quite pleased that I tied the vote rather than allowed either person I believe is town to die. And I'm going to look forward to painting "I told you so" out in rainbow glitter in the God QT later about it.

---

Now, I recognise there is a reasonable chance I get shot tonight by a vig. I'm not too bothered by that - I always prefer to be NK'd if I think I'm likely to be miskilled, as it's just better for town. But given that there's a potential scum doctor, vig shooting obvious candidates is bad and therefore I think there's also a solid chance that I don't die. HOWEVER - If I am the *only* death tonight, and therefore it's concluded that the mafia killed me, that would change the scenario - I see absolutely zero reason why scum-kgray would kill me, so if I die then that would only make sense if the mafia are trying to frame kgray. In that case, I might even accept I was slightly wrong about her. Though rdrivera's still scum, so she'd be wrong too, and that's what matters most.

---

Other reads, which are shortened as I ran out of time:

Strong town: Celaph, Ezio, Hamilton Brian (this is just blatant), Donny Dude, BobMcBob
Medium town: brainbomb (biggest flaw in my lovers theory is that I just don't see him as scum), BunnyGo (I see no reason why he'd be pointing out that PM'ing atrocity as scum, unless he's SK),

Strong scum: rdrivera, kgray
Medium scum: damo (I still see zero reason whatsoever for why he would out there), emc (only turns up when he's the topic), vecna (too little too late for him to be doing anything)

Possible scum: Macca (Gone an awful long way in without actually doing anything and yet cares enough to wake up super early to make sure they vote), ghug (I don't especially buy that he'd townread me here)

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4948 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:00 pm

NIGHT HAS ENDED - PLEASE HOLD
8

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4949 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:17 pm

GM NOTE

It has been brought to my attention that the webDip forum contains some utterly stupid functionality, under the "WHO IS ONLINE" feature, which allows anyone to see not only who is online, but what they are doing, which may include "reading Private Messages". (It doesn't reveal what message you are reading, or the contents of your inbox, just that you're reading a PM, but still...)

I had been unaware of this until it was brought to my attention this evening. I am grateful to the players who contacted me about it. (To be completely clear, none of you are in any trouble, far from it).

It is my view that this is a potential data privacy issue and I will be making representations to the Site Owners, Developers, and Admins, to request that this feature be removed or disabled. In the meantime, however, there is obviously nothing I can do about it as the GM.

I am posting this here for the sake of fairness and transparency to ensure everyone has the same level of awareness of this annoying feature.

For the remainder of the duration of this game, if the presence of this feature bothers or concerns you, you may submit messages to the GMs by any of the following means:

a) On Discord if you have us on Discord,
b) By email to: [email protected]
c) If you are in a QT, and wish to input orders there, even for your own personal actions, as well as factional actions, you may do that.

There is nothing else that I can do about this presently, so please be understanding.

I will now proceed to finish processing the Night phase.

Please CONTINUE TO HOLD.
10

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4950 Post by Jamiet99uk » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:24 pm

Mulder floated through an insubstantial, flickering dream-world. He was on a hospital trolley, rolling slowly along a darkened corridor. He could hear running water in the background. Scully appeared, floating above him. She appeared to speak but he couldn't hear her. He tried to sit up on the trolley but at that moment it ploughed into an enormous mountain of red Donald Trump baseball caps. The sound of rushing water grew louder. The phone was ringing. The mountain of baseball caps fell around him, smothering him. He reached out. The phone was ringing.

The phone was ringing.

He suddenly woke up, the dream taking flight into the recesses of his subconscious as he fumbled for the phone.

He realised that he really needed to pee.

His flailing hand found the phone just before the call rang out.

"Uhh... Mulder"

Scully's voice brought him fully into the waking world.

"Fox, are you ok?"

"Sorry, I just... I fell asleep. What time is it? Are you ok?"

"I'm fine. It's 8.30. In the morning. I just wanted to say good morning."

He breathed more easily.

"Well, good morning Dana. Did you sleep ok?"

"Better than you, by the sound of it."

He was pleased she was ok. He really needed to pee, though.

NOBODY died during the night.
DAY THREE HAS BEGUN
YOU MAY POST
6

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4951 Post by e.m.c^42 » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:24 pm

Lol, matching EOD and EON with no deaths.

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4952 Post by Bonatogether » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:24 pm

sweet

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4953 Post by ghug » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:25 pm

What if we just all stopped killing people and called it a draw.

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4954 Post by kgray » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:25 pm

Absolutely unreal.

##vote HR
##end

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4955 Post by DemonRHK » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:25 pm

Isn't that nice.

##VOTE HR
##END

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4956 Post by Hamilton Brian » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:25 pm

The actual fuck????

Is it okay to ask if anyone was notified of anything?

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4957 Post by ghug » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:25 pm

##VOTE HR
##END

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4958 Post by Bonatogether » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:25 pm

##vote HR

##end

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4959 Post by Donny Dude » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:25 pm

A good result.

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Re: MAFIA 64 - The Z Files - Game Thread [HIDDEN]

#4960 Post by kgray » Sun Feb 07, 2021 11:26 pm

kgray wrote:
Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:59 pm
ghug wrote:
Sun Feb 07, 2021 10:59 pm
If I die kill kgray.
no
What is this ghug?

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