M61 - The Mastermind's Revenge - Game Thread - HIDDEN

[Chaqa]

##CALL GM how does the Governor work? Can we not vote the target at all? Is there an announcement? If the target is the leading vote getter, then does the 2nd place automatically die or does nobody die?

The Governor is dead, Bunny.

It was Bozo.

He's dead.

universal backup jamiet

Didn’t we already talk about this and determine UB is Flum’s role not Bozo’s?

[Chaqa]

Ah I see Maniac claims vengeful.

We think this is a scum claim, yes?

That is, it may be his correct role - but if we daykill him today, then we are handing scum a double NK tonight, in effect.

Clever play, Maniac.

Are you gonna play his little voting game?

Fine. ##VOTE CHAQA

And I suggest the people remaining on Chaqa's voting committee instruct him to vote for himself because lulz.

I think you especially are missing what I was doing.

[Chaqa]

I'm off work the next two days, so I'll try to do some VCA on the day 1/2 wagons tomorrow morning.

please dont

Care to contribute or just make remarks at people all game?

[Chaqa]

The problem is, if Maniac is Scum Vengeful, how can we win without daykilling him at some point?

Perhaps it is therefore better to do it today than waiting until there are only a few town left?

I guess Vengeful is a pretty damn powerful role for Scum to have.

I think we’re kinda forced to daykill him.

If he’s town and we don’t, scum can kill him tonight.

If he’s scum and we don’t, he only gets more powerful as more of us die and a 1:1 scum trade gets better mathematically for mafia

[ghug]

IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT:

I'm Vengeful

How do i verify this? Well you're all going to kill me today.

Before you do, you have to decide who I'm going to take with me.

So you must all now vote only for the following people

Vecna
Chaqa
Bunny
Ghug
Seth

At EOD -27hrs, I'll remove 1 person from that list.
At EOD -26hrs, I'll remove another person from that list
At EOD -25hrs, I'll remove a third person from that list

The vote count at EOD -24hrs will determine who I take with me.

I will obviously be weighting the voting so if I think you're scum you're vote will count less than if I think you're solid town.

I won't be commenting on why I have selected these people. I don't want you all to repeat my thoughts back to me. Go out and make your own cases on these five people.

Many of you will say I've gone too early, perhaps, but some solid town reads have indicated that I'm high on their scum list. Mafia could have anywhere between 3-5 votes. They could so easily get me killed today, so I need (we need) a good town kill.

See you all at EOD - 27hrs.

@@Flum - obviously just vote for one of these. Don't sheep anyone.

This list sucks.

[ghug]

There's something wonderfully poetic about Voyeur Vecna watching himself.

I know, right?

Anyways, scum likely tracked me last night, so they were going to think I was self-doctoring most likely and kill me tomorrow, so better I just share what I know.

I don't see much benefit to not telling us what else you know at this point.

[ghug]

Ah I see Maniac claims vengeful.

We think this is a scum claim, yes?

That is, it may be his correct role - but if we daykill him today, then we are handing scum a double NK tonight, in effect.

Clever play, Maniac.

I doubt scum bought Vengeful, and I doubt a scum vengeful would make this play instead of trying to survive and just taking someone with them when they do, but Maniac gonna Maniac, so the second point could be wrong.

Why did you assume it was a scum action?

[Chaqa]

Oh, GM call says maniac will still go off if he does to a night kill. So that makes it complicated even more.

If he is town, mafia will never kill him until they can afford to... or they think he’s going to shoot a towny

If he’s scum, and he knew the role would be ruled this way, he could have planned this to make him un-killable

Blegh

[ghug]

The Governor is dead, Bunny.

It was Bozo.

He's dead.

universal backup jamiet

Didn’t we already talk about this and determine UB is Flum’s role not Bozo’s?

Nope, the GM confirmed it's not the spirit.

[Chaqa]

universal backup jamiet

Didn’t we already talk about this and determine UB is Flum’s role not Bozo’s?

Nope, the GM confirmed it's not the spirit.

The fuck.

##CallGM: why is one role (Vengeful) being ruled "as written" when another (Spirit) isn't?

[ghug]

The Vengeful costs $25, and I really doubt Maniac would claim it as scum. He's very likely town.

I think it's very unlikely Vecna claims with his story as scum. A tracker could obviously let us know if he visited anyone other than himself, and if he were scum, there'd be little benefit to outing it. That means he's also very likely town.

[Chaqa]

Sorry, that should be the Universal Backup isn't:

You are the Universal Backup. You will assume the powers of the first person to be eliminated. If the person did not have powers, your ability does not trigger. If the role had charges, you gain the same amount of charges as the player had when they were eliminated. If the role had no charges when they were eliminated, you do not gain their role.

So, by this writing, the Universal Backup should either be:
1. A Vengeful Spirit who will have a vote upon death OR
2. A VT who will never become anything

No reading of this role PM allows for it to be the Governor...

[Chaqa]

It does not say you assume the roles of the first person who was eliminated with powers you can take. It very much reads that if the first person has nothing to take, it never triggers?

[damo666]

Ironically I have just eaten a banana, in real life.

I recently had banoffee pie.

[ghug]

Bananas are terrible.

##CALLGM If the first role eliminated has no powers, does the backup get the next one, or become a vanilla?

[Chaqa]

My main issue here is the GM needs to be consistent on all rulings and not pick/choose intention vs. as-written.

Surprised Jamie isn't throwing a fit over this.

[ghug]

@Maniac, given that your ability can trigger at night, I will not be voting for you today.

If you must pick someone from that list, I suppose I would recommend Seth, but I townread all of those players. You also shouldn't tell us who you have chosen, as it complicates scum's decision making around killing you.

[Jamiet99uk]

Bananas are terrible.

##CALLGM If the first role eliminated has no powers, does the backup get the next one, or become a vanilla?

This has been answered.

[Jamiet99uk]

The problem is, if Maniac is Scum Vengeful, how can we win without daykilling him at some point?

Perhaps it is therefore better to do it today than waiting until there are only a few town left?

I guess Vengeful is a pretty damn powerful role for Scum to have.

I think we’re kinda forced to daykill him.

If he’s town and we don’t, scum can kill him tonight.

If he’s scum and we don’t, he only gets more powerful as more of us die and a 1:1 scum trade gets better mathematically for mafia

That was kinda my point. I'm currently voting you because I want to see what he does at the various milestones he proclaimed.

[Jamiet99uk]

Ah I see Maniac claims vengeful.

We think this is a scum claim, yes?

That is, it may be his correct role - but if we daykill him today, then we are handing scum a double NK tonight, in effect.

Clever play, Maniac.

I doubt scum bought Vengeful, and I doubt a scum vengeful would make this play instead of trying to survive and just taking someone with them when they do, but Maniac gonna Maniac, so the second point could be wrong.

Why did you assume it was a scum action?

Because I think Maniac is scum.