Slingshot Juggernaut

Use this forum to discuss Diplomacy strategy.
Forum rules
This forum is limited to topics relating to the game Diplomacy only. Other posts or topics will be relocated to the correct forum category or deleted. Please be respectful and follow our normal site rules at http://www.webdiplomacy.net/rules.php.
Post Reply
Message
Author
Jables
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:40 pm
Contact:

Slingshot Juggernaut

#1 Post by Jables » Thu Jan 28, 2021 4:59 pm

Can anybody explain the Slingshot Juggernaut in full detail?

I've heard of it and I get that the key move is to blow up Russia's starting Black Sea fleet and then Russia builds an army in Sev. But I haven't ever seen a full explanation of the setup and follow-up moves.

Thanks in advance!

User avatar
dargorygel
Site Moderator
Site Moderator
Posts: 6682
Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:55 pm
Location: Over the rainbow
Contact:

Re: Slingshot Juggernaut

#2 Post by dargorygel » Thu Jan 28, 2021 5:14 pm

From the zine:
http://uk.diplom.org/pouch/Zine/W1996A/ ... osits.html

I call it the "Slingshot Juggernaut" opening. Since I came up with it, it has been tried twice, both times with the result of a solo win for the Russian player after a gamelong alliance with the Turkish player (well, gamelong until the last move, of course). Now that I'm writing about it here, of course, I suppose it'll never work again.

Anyway, the two biggest problems for the juggernaut opening are convincing the other players that there is no juggernaut and determining what to do with the Russian fleet in Sevastopol. In the Slingshot, both problems are dealt with by a quick and efficient fake war.

At the beginning of the game, both Turkey and Russia claim to everyone (especially Austria) that they will be opening against each other while promising otherwise, and indeed, both do -- in a particular way. Russia sends Warsaw to Ukraine, Moscow to Sevastopol, and Sevastopol into Armenia, while Turkey sends Ankara to the Black Sea and Smyrna to Ankara. To the world, this looks like a total concentration of forces in the southeast.

These Spring 1901 moves are perhaps just a touch off-beat, but creative explanations to the Austrian are easy to come by. For example, Austria would be prepared for the Russian's grand "eastern attack strategy" with a plan like: "Okay, I've convinced the Turk to send his fleet to Constantinople to go out to sea, but my fleet will head south to make sure he has to guard Ankara while I build another fleet in Sevastopol and take the Black Sea."

After the initial moves, Russia also makes sure to occupy all of Austria's attention with his continual hand-wringing -- mad at the Turk for not sending the fleet west and now wondering whether to support Armenia or to use Sevastopol to assure the take of Rumania. Turkey, of course, is equally mad at Russia for the violation of the fictitious Armenia plank of the DMZ agreement. If Austria can be read well enough to assure a Russian Rumania, both Russia and Turkey plead with Austria for his support into Rumania.

In the end, Russia guesses wrong, supporting Ukraine to Rumania with the Sevastopol army (the bright spot being the failure of Bul-Rum), and the Turkish army enters Armenia with support from the Black Sea, dislodging the poor Russian fleet. And -- horror of horrors -- there are no retreats for the fleet. It is destroyed.

Claiming that he is giving up on the fleet idea, since it worked so poorly, Russia builds an army in Sevastopol.

While both Russia and Turkey make loud noises about their war, and while both enter into convoluted plans against each other with the Austrian, the Armenian army busies itself preparing for a convoy across the Black Sea and into the Balkans. Meanwhile, the Rumanian and Bulgarian armies are quietly deciding any support scheme to use against the Serbian defenses. Before the board knows what hit it, the juggernaut is through Austria. It is truly a joy to behold -- especially as Russia (I say, knowingly).]

Jables
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:40 pm
Contact:

Re: Slingshot Juggernaut

#3 Post by Jables » Thu Jan 28, 2021 7:38 pm

Thanks dargorygel for sharing. This is actually the article I was reacting to with my OP. I've read it. I get the basic principles but I'm scratching my head about the actual moveset.

For example the article says in fall 1901:
"Russia guesses wrong, supporting Ukraine to Rumania with the Sevastopol army," then after the fleet gets destroyed, "Russia builds an army in Sevastopol."

But according to this moveset, Sevastopol is occupied by an army already — so how can Russia build there??!?

In that scenario you could just build in Warsaw or Moscow instead, but the article SAYS Russia builds in Sevastopol so I'm wondering if the moveset is not being described accurately or if there are different ways this is played.

Also the article says in 1902:
"... the Armenian army busies itself preparing for a convoy across the Black Sea and into the Balkans."

Again, I'm scratching my head — WHERE exactly is this army supposed to convoy to? According to this account Rum and Bul are already occupied and there isn't any obvious route to move them. Are we supposing that Turkey builds fleet Smyrna in 1901, moves to AEG, then fleet AEG supports army Bul into Gre, with army Arm convoying to backfill Bul with support from Rum?

The article says Rum and Bul start preparing support orders into Serbia, but it's highly likely Austria has an army in Bud or Tri at this point, so again the setup doesn't seem to be in place.

This is why I'm looking for an actual description of the moveset!

jay65536
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2019 7:36 pm
Contact:

Re: Slingshot Juggernaut

#4 Post by jay65536 » Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:04 pm

Russia builds an army somewhere else, not Sev. The exact builds are dependent on Russia’s other diplomacy.

Arm can be convoyed anywhere. The most common is to convoy to Bul while Bul moves to Ser with support from Rum. This could theoretically be stopped but the point is to fool Austria into not being prepared for it.

By the way, this is a fringe opening for a reason. If Austria is competent it wastes time and doesn’t work, and if Turkey is competent then Russia can’t win.

Jables
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2020 7:40 pm
Contact:

Re: Slingshot Juggernaut

#5 Post by Jables » Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:47 pm

Thanks jay65536, that is very helpful! I think I get the picture.

I was hoping you would reply to this thread, since I first encountered the concept of the Slingshot Juggernaut when you mentioned it while discussing this Turkish opening: https://brotherbored.com/youve-never-us ... t-opening/

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users