Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

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MajorMitchell
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Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#1 Post by MajorMitchell » Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:50 pm

This thread is for discussing nthe Fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game with a gazillion points, or thereabouts in prizes.
It's Spring 1901, DipComrade Octaviouski our Oracle has Russia, CTA, who is reputedly an isomer mirror variant Blighter~Dalek~Bot replicant of beloved ATC has England so expect surprises of Shakespearean proportions from this player. CaptMike has La Belle Francais and is all toute suite and Belle Amour. Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel has Das Germany und schmelzer und strahlen in das Spring move mit Blitzen und Donner ready for Autumn. Pasha chLuke has Turkey and is probably giving Constantinople's hareem a Spring spruce up. Clearly God works in mysterious ways and by Divine Will has Annointed Crazy Anglican to be Pontiff Primo in Rome. Let us pray that the Christian God, HG & JC are hip with the metagaming rules and that they show faith in Crazy Anglican's abilities to Triumph without their meddling from celestial residence.

I'm trying to frame a market, figure out the relative odds and handicapping , weight in saddle bags of various jockeys, their talents with the whip etc. We live in exciting times...
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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#2 Post by MajorMitchell » Fri Jan 08, 2021 1:04 pm

Damnation. I meant Omnipotent Zultar's fantastic... Now I find out he's omnipresent? As well as Omniscient. A trinity of omnis? It's a divine sign. Omnipotent, Omniscient & Omnipresent Zultar.. I'm unworthy and sinful and covet'd Liverpool with lust and violence in my heart when Peregrine Falcon unlawfully stole it from me, don't ever forgive me over that sinful fueding but encourage me to exact revenge and crush all other opponents like little bugs beneath my boots. May my diplomacy Game dishonesty be as well rewarded as my occasionally honest transgressions forgiven. Please don't send me to diplomacy Hell, stuck in a one v one with he who cannot be named for all Eternity but lift me up to play with beloved DipComrade Jamiet99Uk and share Celestial Silesian Surprises.
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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#3 Post by MajorMitchell » Sat Jan 09, 2021 2:19 pm

Getting my 500th +1 is imminent... hint hint
The Spring move has been played in Omnipotent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Contest Game & spectators can discern some of the strategic choices made by players.
CTA with England has moved fleet London to English channel & army to Wales, fleet Edinburgh to North sea.
CaptMike with La Belle Francais~Army Paris to Picardy, army Marseilles to Burgundy for a bounce with Das Dargorygel's army from Munich.
Das Dargorygel's army Berlin moved to Kiel, so me Spring 01 Silesian Surprise & fleet Kiel moved to Holland, not Kiel.
Crazy Anglican moved fleet Naples to Ionian sea, army Rome to Naples and army Venice held. Is this Wacky Protestant Pontiff thinking of a Less Pantsoff/PresbyterianPantomime?
The Passionate Pasha sent army Constantinople to Bulgaria, fleet Ankara to Black Sea for a bounce with fleet Sevastapol and army Smyrna to Ankara not Armenia, so it's still in Smyrna. Is a blunder or a deception & army Smyrna will move to Con & the Passionate Pasha will.not attack Sevastapol?
CzarDipComrade of All Russia Octavious our Oracle has played a steady as she goes opening set of moves, army Moscow to Ukraine, army Warsaw to Galicia (bounce) fleet St P to Gulf of Bothnia & fleet Sevastapol bounced in Black sea. Well set up to move either army Ukraine or fleet Sevastapol to Rumania with support move. If it's the army Ukraine that moves to Rumania then rdriveria will probably not be happy.
rdriveria with Austria played fleet Trieste to Albania and army Budapest to Serbia, always a good spring 01 move, Serbia is the key to the Balkans, the most important sc to control imho. Army Vienna to Galicia repelled CzarDipComrade Octavious out Oracle's army from Warsaw. No doubt rdriveria is relieved that the Wacky Protestant Pontiff didn't play armies to Tyrolia and Venice. Light a candle in hopes of a Less Protestant Panto.
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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#4 Post by MajorMitchell » Sat Jan 09, 2021 2:26 pm

What does it all.mean? Much is still to be revealed. Will CTA make attack on Brest? Moving fleet English channel to Mid Atlantic is a bold play, convoying army Wales to Belgium with a support move from Das Dargorygel's fleet Holland is possible, or Das Dargorygel's fleet Holland might move to Belgium itself. Clearly Das Dargorygel has decided to concede Sweden to CzarDipComrade Octavious our Oracle, so Russia should gain two scs this year.. With England and Germany going hard at France, CzarDipComrade Octavious our Oracle could make a Scandinavian play in the second year. England struggles to wage war in the North/Scandinavia and against France simultaneously.
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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#5 Post by MajorMitchell » Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:09 am

Young whippersnapper Millennials may be unaware that Daffy Old MM is a dab hand playing England in classic diplomacy, as might be other readers. I'm going to watch how TCA goes about his task & see how TCA rates on my "Walsingham" scale. I've given two demerit points for his opening moves & will elucidate my reasons for this harsh assessment.

1 it picks a fight with France at the start. I'm of the view that starting a fight with France at the start is a mistake. I advocate a strategy of getting army to Norway and seeing who shows a hostile intentions against England. If Germany and Russia gang up against England, then the ally England needs is France & alienating France in spring 01, well it plays into having no allies & being attacked by Germany, Russia and France?

2 the two fleets North & army to Edinburgh opening moves are the most used because they work best imho. If CTA had played that opening, then CaptMike with La Belle Francais would be eager to form an alliance with CATS now, Germany's move to Burgundy would make most players with France offer the player with England peace and request an alliance.
CTA would have, with two fleets North opening be able to move army to Norway and bounce Germany in Denmark, while France bounces Germany in Belgium, results, France only gains two, Germany only gains one sc Holland and England has France and Germany fighting each other, always desirable imho.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#6 Post by MajorMitchell » Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:30 am

Thanks for the +1s to the generous webdiplomacy Comrades, Hoorah & thanks for getting me over the +500 karma points hurdle.

Continuing with the Walsingham principles, the prime objective is to have European rivals squabble and fight each other and all seeking assistance from England.
Using the strategy of "coming to help" one of the squabbling European rivals enables the player with England to acquire more scs and concessions can be delicately extorted from supplicant player helped as well, always useful.
If CTA had played two fleets North opening moves, then getting a no new fleet build in Brest should be a concession from France CTA can politely demand as a prime example, and a "French fleets all in Mediterranean" policy by CTA another concession to pursue, DMZ in mid Atlantic and English channel.
So the bold move to English channel in spring 01 by a player with England is not one I regard highly. It's a defensive play in many ways, and with army to Wales is too overtly hostile to France, and shows too much interest in getting an army to Belgium, too soon. Sending english army to Norway is sound strategy and making France and Germany fight each other for Belgium at the start an excellent "geo~political" outcome for England that fits with the "get army to Norway" opening.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#7 Post by MajorMitchell » Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:47 am

Here's the possible outcome for CTA .. Germany gets Denmark & Holland, bounces France in Belgium, or gets fleet to Belgium because CTA has use fleet North sea to take Norway, so Germany gets Belgium & Denmark, because army Picardy moves to Brest.
Spring 02. England builds a new fleet. Russia has fleet in Sweden and new fleet St P north coast. Germany builds a new fleet, so has a fleet in Holland or possibly Belgium and new fleet.
France might have army in Brest because England convoys army Wales to Picardy??? France can build a new fleet in Marseilles and with Italy's peaceful towards France opening there's a good chance two French fleets will be fighting England.
CTA might have fleet in Norway, isloated, no fleet in North sea... & be looking at six hostile fleets.
That's a possibility not a certainty. So it's going to be most interesting to see how this came goes for CTA. The inscrutable, wise ATC would, I doubt have so quickly, if ever got himself in the situation CTA might have created for himself.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#8 Post by MajorMitchell » Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:49 am

If I could get better than 12/1 on CTA losing North Sea in either autumn 02 or Spring 03 I'd place a modest wager

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#9 Post by MajorMitchell » Sun Jan 10, 2021 4:02 am

My Walsingham scale ratings of opening moves.
CTA two demerits
CaptMike plus one
CzarDipComrade Octavious our Oracle, plus two
Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel no score either way. Fleet Kiel should imho, always move to Denmark not Holland in opening move.
rdriviera plus 1.5
chluke minus 0.5
Our Wacky Protestant Pontiff, plus one.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#10 Post by MajorMitchell » Sun Jan 10, 2021 7:31 am

I've been for a paddle about on my Yellow twin fin swallowtail circa 1983/4 artisan craftsman handmade Bodyboard at Paradise Lost Rocks this afternoon, caught five or so waves in two and a half hours in water, two piddly efforts & had to paddle back out through a decent set of waves & got full rinse cycle. Got one superb left on a three/ four foot swell and got an eyes wide open expecting crash take off on the biggest wave, made the impact & carved right and got a cramp in.left lower leg.so drifted in to the sand.
I've been thinking about the Contest Game and haven't changed my opinions, bit had the thought, our Wacky Protestant Pontiff could move army Venice to Tyrolia this, Autumn move if he decides to support Austria against Russia. Occupying Tyrolia defends both Venice and Trieste & is a shield for unnocupied Venice and Trieste. I like the lack of aggressive moves against France or Austria by our Protestant Pontiff, the players with France and Austria will both almost certainly be keen to have peaceful relationships with Italy. Peace with France, an alliance with Austria and a Le Panto Protestant Pontiff style is what I would expect to see in second year & third year.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#11 Post by MajorMitchell » Mon Jan 11, 2021 10:45 am

Well readers of all ages, the Autumn 01 move has been played & it's Builds move in Omnipotent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Competition Game. CTA with England used fleets English channel & North sea to convoy army Wales to Norway successfully. Gains one sc.
CaptMike with La Belle Francais captured Portugal with fleet Mid Atlantic, Spain with army Marseilles and army Picardy moved to Burgundy and bounced with army from Munich. Gains two scs.
Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel's fleet Holland moved successfully to Belgium, army Kiel to Denmark and army Munich bounced in Burgundy. Gains two scs.
Our Protestant Pontiff moved army Venice to Piedmont, fleet Ionian sea to Tunis and army Naples held, which is inexplicable to me, it means that no new unit, like a fleet can be built in Naples. Is our Protestant Pontiff sniffing too much inscence, getting high on Myrrh and Francinscence???
Gains one? a new fleet in Venice? Or Rome?
Austria, cdrivera might be more crafty than a boardroom full of stockbrokers and corporate lawyers, but a conservative chap. He ganged up with Turkey against Russia. Army Serbia gave a support move for Turkish army Bulgaria to Rumania, which bounced with fleet Sevastapol to Rumania supported by army Ukraine.
Austria's fleet Albania scurried back to Trieste, worried about Italian army Venice. Only gains one sc, Serbia. A dangerous place to be, only gaining one sc in first year with Austria.

CzarDipComrade Octavious our Oracle. Fleet Gulf of Bothnia captured Sweden. Army Warsaw bounced in Galicia. Fleet Sevastapol to Rumania also bounced. Gains one. I'm curious about the unknown diplomacy capering, did CzarDipComrade Octavious make a deal with Austria to put a fleet not an army in Rumania and get stitched up by Austria? Could be in for a tough time if England attacks in Scandinavia as well as fighting an Austrian~Turkish alliance in the South. Needs peace with Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel​ and the usual miracle every player with Russia needs.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#12 Post by MajorMitchell » Mon Jan 11, 2021 10:56 am

Walsingham scale marks.
CTA +0.5
CaptMike +1.25
Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel +1
cdrivera +0.75
Eccentric Protestant Pontiff -0.5
CzarDipComrade Octavious our Oracle -0.5

After builds I will give full first year aggregate marks for our players. Currently CaptMike & cdrivera lead on +2.25 & chluke and Eccentric Protestant Pontiff lag at the bottom on +0.5 & will have to perform better in builds, and more importantly, in their second year.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#13 Post by MajorMitchell » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:03 am

A notable development was CTA moving army Wales to Norway. I have no idea why CTA used this fake(?) attack against France then played traditional army to Norway in a costly double fleet Convoy. A traditional two fleets North opening moves would have allowed CTA to get army from Edinburgh to Norway and bounce Germany in Denmark. So, meh.i have a diplomacy unit of measurement. Unit/moves so that Convoy cost three unit moves not two. Opportunity cost lost, one unit move consequence, a rival power gets two builds, not one.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#14 Post by MajorMitchell » Tue Jan 12, 2021 2:15 pm

Another example of lost opportunity cost in diplomacy relates builds. An example in this game is Austria getting only one build in the first year. cdrivera will be two unit moves down over the next year compared to his position if he had captured two scs and got two builds, not one. The consequences will likely be be not capturing as many scs in this coming year
Some wasted unit moves don't have significant consequences, eg in spring Turkish army Smyrna's move to Ankara not Armenia bounced, ok wasn't in Armenia to attack Sevastapol in autumn move... overall longer term consequences not significant.
Others, I suggest the English opening moves have relatively greater long term Consequences, Germany gets two builds & not one. With two builds Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel goes into the second year with five units, not four and you can bet this player will maximize the advantages of those stronger forces.
A bounce in Denmark would give England a better chance of capturing Denmark, or using unnocupied Denmark to seduce Russia into attacking it & by default get Germany & Russia fighting each other for Denmark, achieving a Walsingham strategy of getting the European powers squabbling & fighting each other, not forming alliances hostile to England's interests.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#15 Post by MajorMitchell » Tue Jan 12, 2021 2:17 pm

..which is spearing them one by one whilst they fight each other

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#16 Post by MajorMitchell » Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:30 am

I'm pressed for time, had a quick look at the game to see builds & saw the global chatter, the blighters are trying to do comedy. I cannot alas as a Comedic Performing Artist recommend their initial efforts at the comedy capering. I had a useful visit to a new Comedy venue, the Crown and Anchor Hotel & Cranker Comedy (qv Facebook Page for Cranker Comedy)

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#17 Post by MajorMitchell » Wed Jan 13, 2021 9:31 am

Readers are invited to participate in this thread

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#18 Post by leon1122 » Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:03 am

Consider linking the actual game in this thread?

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#19 Post by MajorMitchell » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:38 pm

Thanks for the suggestion Leon consider the possibility that Daffy Old MM doesn't have Interwebby skills to do that? Please if a helpful reader, perhaps an enthusiastic whippersnapper Millennial wants to post a link betwixt this thread and the game it would be much appreciated.

I've added these Walsingham scale marks for builds.& will put each player's first year score as well.
cdrivera Austria I've adjusted the autumn mark, +0.75 is reduced to +0.7, build -0.25. Year one 1.95 our leader
CaptMike gets minus 0.25 and year one total 1.75
CTA England build +0.25 total 1.75
Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel, I've adjusted my Spring mark, zero was too harsh so I adjusted it to 0.4 which with 0.3 for builds gives 1.7
CzarDipComrade Octavious our Oracle Russia build +0.2 total 1.7
chluke Turkey build +0.25 total 0.75
Crazy Anglican Italy build -0.3 total 0.2 Not opening up Naples for a fleet build results in our Protestant Pontiff being marked harshly.

Observations. Despite only getting one build for Austria cdrivera leads the group of players. Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel with Germany is more powerful perhaps, yet it's the bloody difficult nature of Austria in classic diplomacy & cdrivera's success in keeping Galicia unnocupied and teaming up with Turkey against Russia that sees him in the lead.
I can see why CaptMike would want to build three fleets, but it costs​too much in my opinion, a third army is essential to fend off Germany and Italy in my opinion.
The big mover in autumn and builds is Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel with Germany, after average spring mark, 0.4 a solid 1 for autumn move and +0.3 for build so +1.3 for autumn and build das Blitzen und Donner I predicted from a dab hand at the diplomacy capering.

What hints for this year's strategies and tactics from current dispositions and builds might be inferred?
Austria, no change to probable alliance with Turkey against Russia but in difficult position if Italy switches from benevolent to hostile.
France. Strong but could be in for a fight with Italy as well as Germany, so desperately needs alliance with England.
Germany. In a really good position. Belgium is vulnerable to a supported attack and if a retreat option is not available a possible forced disbanding is a risk.
Russia. Another country that like Austria is challenging to play, it straddles the stalemate lines and is blooming difficult to play. In trouble in the South and weak in the North.
Needs peace from both Germany and England and that's blooming difficult to get. Still those two countries could agree to help Russia which could have unpleasant consequences for CaptMike if they did. A keep Russia in the game fighting the Austrian and Turkish alliance while they gobble up France, then attack Italy and Austria and then spear Russia?
England is in a good position. Germany and France are fighting each other, Russia is weak. Italy is threatening France. Almost perfect situation for England. Biggest potential threat imho. Das Urkomisch Ausglassen Dargorygel with Germany. A sudden German French alliance would turn things in a surprising direction indeed. Five fleets. Five armies. Blitzen und Dinner with some Napoleonish surprises.
There's a myriad of possibilities to look forward to
Turkey, in a good position to make gains this year.

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Re: Omnipresent Zultar's fantastic Holiday Diplomacy Game

#20 Post by dargorygel » Thu Jan 14, 2021 3:50 pm

Not a millennial... I think I'm older than you.
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=339224

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