What the hell happened?!

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Expand view Topic review: What the hell happened?!

Re: What the hell happened?!

by jmo1121109 » Sat Mar 31, 2018 12:10 am

Rjmcf wrote:
Fri Mar 30, 2018 11:32 pm
Something akin to what happens on Reddit when a post is deleted where it just leaves [deleted] in its wake. Partly it gives something for subsequent conversations to reference, it makes it easier to understand the flow of discourse if everyone knows how many posts were deleted, who posted them, etc.

It might also help it feel less authoritarian. You can see my views on this from my previous comments, I’m completely on the mods’ side, but I agree that things just disappearing without a trace feels little... unpleasant.
Right now we actually can't do that with the phpbb constraints. A mod would have to post afterwards and let people know where in the conversation they'd deleted something, since we can't insert at a specific point. But it's something that I'll look into on phpbb mods and see if there are any that might be useful in that regard.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by Rjmcf » Fri Mar 30, 2018 11:32 pm

Something akin to what happens on Reddit when a post is deleted where it just leaves [deleted] in its wake. Partly it gives something for subsequent conversations to reference, it makes it easier to understand the flow of discourse if everyone knows how many posts were deleted, who posted them, etc.

It might also help it feel less authoritarian. You can see my views on this from my previous comments, I’m completely on the mods’ side, but I agree that things just disappearing without a trace feels little... unpleasant.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by CommanderByron » Fri Mar 30, 2018 8:13 pm

Since the idea has been floated by someone more important than me.

If we went about logging out deletions publicly clearly we wouldn’t also log the content of the messages (that defeats the purpose of deleting them). So would the purpose of such a log be to show the frequency of deletions and what exactly would that prove/accomplish?

I’m not doubting it I’m just trying to grasp what the end goal is for this.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by Durga » Fri Mar 30, 2018 4:13 pm

Deleting posts made by banned members is fine. But the mod team is still too trigger happy.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by jmo1121109 » Fri Mar 30, 2018 3:17 pm

That said in various cases in the past I’d have loved to share the chains, the mods put a ton of effort into being fair and forum conversations don’t really show that like the email chains tend too. But, member privacy first, defense of mod actions second is really what had to be priority.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by jmo1121109 » Fri Mar 30, 2018 3:14 pm

Oct, for privacy reasons direct email screenshots with members will never be shared. Even if it’s that member sharing it. Having that liability to sort out is a headache nobody wants. If someone really wants to share that info then they should go with copying the message text without info covered by various countries right to be forgotten laws.

As for the record being left, phpbb does not support that. Though a manual record is something to consider.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by Octavious » Fri Mar 30, 2018 3:04 pm

Perhaps it would be nice if a record was left when deletions happen. Having these things expunged from existence with no evidence that they were even there is a tad unnerving, regardless of content.

I also think you should give serious consideration to allowing the membership to see some of these moderation email chains. Even with Haughtiness' editing you came across rather well in that link he posted.

Still, all fascinating stuff.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by CroakandDagger » Fri Mar 30, 2018 2:53 pm

I'm not sure i'd agree with that.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by bo_sox48 » Fri Mar 30, 2018 2:27 pm

Octavious wrote:
Fri Mar 30, 2018 1:54 pm
You know, the enthusiasm for deleting posts these days is a little OTT, don't you think? Out of curiosity, why was it done?
Condescension came back with a brand new multi to try to rile up the crowd and appeal to all of you that he didn't do anything wrong. He alluded to specific communications he had with the moderators and cherrypicked from more than two dozen emails we had back and forth to make it appear as if he was banned on a whim and wasn't given multiple opportunities to straighten himself out. There was a conversation as to whether or not to leave his posts up and the moderators online at the time chose to delete them and the subsequent responses to them, which I think was the right thing to do. Communications with the moderator team should generally not be shared unless the moderator team gives it the okay, and choosing to once again circumvent a ban with the expressed purpose of calling for torches and pitchforks is obviously not okay either. Like CB said, it's much better to delete posts that have no purpose other than to make things spiral out of control than it is to lock a topic and let it fade into the depths of the forum and be forgotten. I'm happy to have a private conversation with anyone that thinks otherwise and I can explain things in more detail.

With the new forum comes many, many new moderation tools and we are still learning the new etiquette for moderating the forum. Fortunately, the new forum so far has seen few instances where moderation is even necessary. We'll have a conversation about deleting posts in the near future and make sure that it is a last resort and an action only taken in extreme circumstances. Those posts, though, definitely warranted being deleted.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by CommanderByron » Fri Mar 30, 2018 2:08 pm

Due to the fact that the comments are deleted I can’t comment directly on their content; however I can assure you that the deleted comments were not deleted in haste.

This however is a perfect example of why this new forum is a positive change. Now when a thread is derailed or goes to far; the mod team has the ability to delete comments rather than locking the thread.

What this means for you and the rest of the community is good conversation and dialogue don’t get removed in response to a few negative or rule breaking comments.

I get that this may seem like some form of abuse but this is much more effective in the long term and will inevitably improve site interactions; not to mention the mod team is a diverse group who don’t all share the same sentiments so we do our best to police not only the forum but each other.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by Octavious » Fri Mar 30, 2018 1:54 pm

You know, the enthusiasm for deleting posts these days is a little OTT, don't you think? Out of curiosity, why was it done?

Re: What the hell happened?!

by bo_sox48 » Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:37 pm

Only half?

Re: What the hell happened?!

by Octavious » Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:42 am

You and half of Europe if his reputation is to be believed

Re: What the hell happened?!

by CommanderByron » Sun Mar 25, 2018 7:38 am

^ i am actually related... fun fact.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by JECE » Sat Mar 24, 2018 11:17 pm

CroakandDagger: So he did. For more than a second there I thought you were making an obscure reference to Lord Byron, ha ha.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by brainbomb » Sat Mar 24, 2018 11:09 pm

Education should be defended by the US military

Re: What the hell happened?!

by brainbomb » Sat Mar 24, 2018 11:06 pm

Hey CroakandBoring whats new? America sucks, but I'm doing great.

Why am I mad

Re: What the hell happened?!

by CroakandDagger » Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:59 pm

Byron got there ahead of both of you anyway.

Re: What the hell happened?!

by ghug » Sat Mar 24, 2018 5:37 pm

+1 PF

Great advice!

Re: What the hell happened?!

by JECE » Sat Mar 24, 2018 2:23 pm

Peregrine Falcon: Copycat. I just said that. You're trying to steal the +1's nobody is giving me, aren't you?

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