Finished: 07 PM Wed 15 Aug 12 UTC
Rawr.
1 day /phase
Pot: 70 D - Autumn, 1903, Finished
Classic, Anonymous players, Draw-Size Scoring
1 excused missed turn
Game drawn
09 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1901: hey i just wanted to say good luck to everybody. also....dont want to sound snobby, but if ppl could fully confirm their orders that would be nice. it just seems unnecessary to wait 24 hrs when all that is required to speed up the turns is ppl clicking "Ready".
09 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1901: May wanna sleep without other gerting to talk first
09 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1901: I generally confirm as quickly as I can, but I'm traveling this weekend and will occasionally need the full time.
09 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1901: So do i, just sayin they may have there reasons
09 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1901: no no i get it, like i said i dont want to be rude, im just saying for future turns. if anyone needs the full time to make decisions i completely understand and sometimes i need that too. im just saying i know ppl who know what they are doing but purposefully take longer either bc they are not doing well or are being invaded or have to retreat too many armies. I wasn't referring to this turn just for this game in general if we could be sensible about that. sorry if i gave anyone the wrong impression.
09 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1901: Agreed
09 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1901: I'm sending messages. I confirm when I'm ready to go.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: There's no way we are going to keep going if France CDs I presume...
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: idk.....france is most likely going to lose all his centers no matter what he does.....
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: Yeah but it would be easier for him to lose his centers this way. I agree with Turkey. Draw if France CDs.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: France CD'd because was getting attacked on by all of his neighbors. He was going down anyway, and he left with units on all of the SCs (as opposed to leaving them vacant).

I agree with Germany on this. He was going to lose 2-3 SCs this year anyway and would have been out of the game by the end of 1904.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: "attacked on three sides by"
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: By the way, I started the global chat by writing a long message that mentioned confirming your orders and not just leaving bc your not doing well. I felt guilty and a little bad for doing it but I knew this would happen. Some ppl only want to play if they are winning from move one till the 18th center......
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: That's it, Germany! I blame you!
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: haha...but in all seriousness I would like to continue bc France is going to lose his centers anyway regardless of if he plays or not, but if everyone wants to draw if he misses again, then I will agree too.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: It doesn't matter if someone is going to be killed. When someone CDs, they should draw. You have no idea when Germany might leave four centers wide open to England. You have no idea if France may have found some way to turn someone. You have no way to know that you would have finished France. If he had had 3 centers and CD'd, fine, but he had 6. That's a lot. For me, who gets nothing out of it except for a more powerful map and a similarly not-so-powerful me, this game is skewed and should be drawn.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: What he said.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: yes, I was going to chime in earlier, and when someone CDs, regardless of how you THINK it was going to go, a couple of things happens.

one, you devote less resources than you would have to accomplish the same things, and 2, you do not know how it would have really happened.

I am sure if it was Turkey or Austria or Russia CDing, the tunes would be sung differently.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: Russia, if a country leaves SCs vacant (and ripe to taking with a single unit), then my tune would be different. This is not that, though, and so my opinion remains the same, despite your assurances.

Yes, if France had stayed, then there is a SMALL chance he would have found a way to survive being attacked on all sides by people who had planned on doing so since the game began, but that is a remote possibility (at best). You seem to be suggesting that a CD requires a draw, but by this rationale, if a 15 SC strong nation is 1-2 years away from winning, and a surrounded 6 SC country CDs, then the game should be halted simply because no one can know what might have happened. I think it's ludicrous to the point of asininity to mandate a draw EVERY time there is a CD. There are situations where I believe it is merited and required, but I do not believe this is one such time. I know that opinion may make me unpopular, but I also don't agree that every kid in a sports league should win a trophy just for showing up.

All of that said, I do recognize the unfairness of the few mandating to the many. So, if a majority of the board voices a request for a draw, then I will as well. It seems England, Russia, and Turkey support drawing while Germany and I do not. And so I will do as Austria does, since that appears to be the deciding vote.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: Even if he has little chance, the chance at all is enough to warrant an end to the game.
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: I'll vote for the draw. If it were later in the game, I'd be OK with keeping this going
13 Aug 12 UTC Spring, 1903: Ok.
14 Aug 12 UTC So are we drawing?

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

Germany
zqazi2 (635 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 12 D
6 supply-centers, 6 units
England
emfries (0 D X)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 12 D
5 supply-centers, 5 units
Austria
ferrelic (786 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 12 D
5 supply-centers, 5 units
Russia
Stressedlines (1559 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 12 D
5 supply-centers, 5 units
Italy
BosephJennett (866 D)
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 12 D
4 supply-centers, 4 units
Turkey
bo_sox48 (5202 D Mod (G))
Drawn. Bet: 10 D, won: 12 D
4 supply-centers, 4 units
France
durpies (100 D)
Resigned. Bet: 10 D
5 supply-centers, 2 units
Civil Disorders
durpies (100 D)France (Spring, 1903) with 5 centres.
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